It should be true

Bottom line is that no matter what you believe or how hard you try to convince some one that what jesus did for all of us really did happen,unless someone is willing to believe through faith they will allways go through life as an athiest or an agnostic to believe that they themselves are the author of what life ultimatly holds for them.

phospher wrote: Okie Boarder, Let me ask you one final question. If you were born and grew up in Pakistan do you think you would still be a Christian? No, you would be Islam and you would surely believe in Islam just as strongly as you believe in Christianity. Can you see my problem with this?

That's a tough one to answer. I think it would depend a lot upon whether I was ever taught about Christianity and the Bible. Are you trying to say there are no Pakistani Christians?

I really enjoy reading these conversations; and I enjoy having them. Everyone's thoughts are valid and come from experience, incorporated values (from parents, teachers, and culture in general), and individual thought. I always learn from others' perspectives. Of course it is easy to become defensive while talking about such sensitive issues.
Words like: faith, God, Christianity, and Jesus, can and do evoke a lot of different images in people's minds. It's easy to get emotional about those images, at least it is for me.
For me, the apostle Paul said it best. "You can have enough faith to move a mountain, but without love it doesn't mean a thing." How humbling that is, my religion without love is meaningless, my beliefs without love are empty . . . faith isn't what I need; it's love. And it's in love where I find God.

Chuck

"You can have enough faith to move a mountain, but without love it doesn't mean a thing."

That is a nice quote. It is and I'm not being sarcastic. But do you know what else the bible says?

The God of the Bible also allows slavery, including selling your own daughter as a sex slave (Exodus 21:1-11), child abuse (Judges 11:29-40 and Isaiah 13:16), and bashing babies against rocks (Hosea 13:16 & Psalms 137:9).

You can't just cherry pick the good!

I also think it is very narrow minded for anyone to devote them selves to any one religion without studying them all.

phospher wrote: Surely you can see all the beef I have? And to be honest this isn't 1% of it I could really go on for weeks.

Surely there are other forums out there just for this.

Hollywood wrote: phospher wrote: Surely you can see all the beef I have? And to be honest this isn't 1% of it I could really go on for weeks. Surely there are other forums out there just for this.

Interesting isn't it how this kind of stuff gets kinda of icky feeling . . . wish it were easier to talk about.

OK, onto a new story, "A rabbi, a priest, and an attorney walked into a bar . . . and met . . .

Phil, I had an employer for 14 years that was also a good friend that had similar views as yours. We've discussed all this over and over through the years. After a while it becomes pointless and is no longer interesting, and really is better to be left alone as it gets in the way of why we have come together. (Boats built to the glory of God)

Interesting isn't it how this kind of stuff gets kinda of icky feeling . . . wish it were easier to talk about.

It's easy for me. I don't get any icky feeling. I just can't believe that educated adults believe this stuff with absolutely zero evidence and they won't even question it. They are 100% sure. That's called Blind Faith.


I would love to hear your comments on this video, it's 10 minutes long. Basically, it tells how your really worshiping the Sun. To me, it seems a bit quincedental.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3i6UwVkP6M

What is that you worship Phil,im not trying to be rude just curious

Phil, you make many assumptions about people. To me that sounds like ignorance and bigotry, but do go on.

ive seen the video also have seen L ron hubbard video, they are all the same

Riley,

Please do point out any invalid assumptions that I make about people. I certainly do not claim to know everything.

Thats a start your saying that maybe you are wrong for an atheist thats a positive

Brian if youll check your history a good portion of our forefathers were bible believing christians and you can see that in history the reason you see GOD on all your currency is evidence of that, and by the way the LAST war will be over religion, read revelations it will tell you who wins

Davee40,

what do you worsip

Maybe I don't understand your question but I don't worship anything and I sure wouldn't worship anything based on Faith alone. Do you know the definition of faith? Faith = firm belief in something for which there is no proof. Unfortunately, you can't reason with people of faith which is why this is always a never ending discussion. They all seem to know something non believers don't.

And your also wrong when you say,

Thats a start your saying that maybe you are wrong for an atheist thats a positive

That is incorrect. Atheists don't claim to be 100% sure that there is no god. Atheists instead say that there has never been one shred of evidence that a God exists and therefore there is no basis that anyone should ever believe in this stuff. There is a very distinct difference.

BKHallpass is right. This is nothing more than Christians trying to rewrite history.

The "In God We Trust" was not insribed on all currency until 1956. And I can tell you that, George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, Thomas Paine, Ethan Allen and Benjamin Franklin where not Christian.




The Treaty of Tripoli, passed by the U.S. Senate in 1797, read in part: "The government of the United States is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion." The treaty was written during the Washington administration, and sent to the Senate during the Adams administration. It was read aloud to the Senate, and each Senator received a printed copy. This was the 339th time that a recorded vote was required by the Senate, but only the third time a vote was unanimous (the next time was to honor George Washington). There is no record of any debate or dissension on the treaty. It was reprinted in full in three newspapers - two in Philadelphia, one in New York City. There is no record of public outcry or complaint in subsequent editions of the papers.