Forums
NautiqueParts.comNautiqueSkins.com - Correct Craft Upholstery and Part
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Manifolds Leaking
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Manifolds Leaking

 Post Reply Post Reply   
Author
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Manifolds Leaking
    Posted: April-29-2010 at 6:49pm
This is my second boat but really the first I have done any work on myself. The manifolds are in decent shape, there is a crack that leaks on one of the manifolds itself (not the riser/elbow). First is this something I could seal temporarily or should I replace altogether?

Next question, if you see the picture I have shown where the hose went from the manifold into the exhaust. I am getting water leakage on both sides at the same point here. THere are two clamps on both sides near the bottom, and both were tight. It's almost as if there isnt enough fiberglass for the hose to clamp to... Is there some sort of compound to get to beef this part up? Any other ideas?

Thanks for any help..

Alec
Back to Top
8122pbrainard View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: September-14-2006
Location: Three Lakes Wi.
Status: Offline
Points: 38211
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-29-2010 at 7:53pm
Alec,
Post another picture that's not so close up. I can't make out the hose connection you're speaking about.

Cracks in manifolds can be repaired by brazing or epoxy. Route out the crack with the Dremel, clean it up with some solvent and JB weld it. Mark (Laurallakeskier) did a JB weld a couple years ago and it's still holding.


54 Atom


77 Tique

64 X55 Dunphy

Keep it original, Pete
<
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-29-2010 at 11:08pm


here we are. On the other side, looks like the previous owner beefed it up with some epoxy putty type stuff, but it still leaks on that side too. Do they make a hose that attaches to the outside of the manifold but has some sort of inner smaller tube for the other end? This would eliminate the problem altogether... What do you think? Thanks..
Back to Top
LaurelLakeSkier View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: February-12-2007
Location: Wisconsin
Status: Offline
Points: 485
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LaurelLakeSkier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-29-2010 at 11:20pm
I'm having a hard time making out the details of the photos as well (the solenoid stands out clearly......) but not much of the manifold.

To be accurate, the epoxy I used on my exhaust manifold was PC-7.
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-29-2010 at 11:44pm
Ill try to take some better pictures tomorrow, but basically the hose doesn't have enough fiberglass to get a good seal around at the exhaust hole in the floor.....   I would think I could find a hose that has a smaller inside hose to funnel inside the boat exhaust, while using the outside hose to clamp.
Back to Top
Gary S View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: November-30-2006
Location: Illinois
Status: Offline
Points: 12443
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2010 at 12:03am
Looks like it's time to replace the hoses from the manifolds to the transom thru hulls.Remember it's the only thing between you and the bottom of the lake
69 Mustang HM SS
95 Nautique Super Sport
Back to Top
8122pbrainard View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: September-14-2006
Location: Three Lakes Wi.
Status: Offline
Points: 38211
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2010 at 7:27am
I'm picturing the issue now. Gary's correct that it looks like you need new exhaust hose. The hose is NOT sealed off to the surrounding glass to keep the water out of the boat. If there was caulking or glass wrapped around the hose then it sounds like the PO did a half assed attempt of a cover up job.

Alec,
Have you seen any of the stringer replacement threads and the pictures in them? They will give you a idea of what's under the floor. You will need to pull up the floor to get to the hose.

Speaking of stringers, just from what I'm looking at, I feel you had better check them!! What year and model boat is this?

EDIT: Is this problem on the Supra? If so, I suggest you take a real good look at Andy's stringer thread. Also, I wound NOT put this boat in the lake until you pull up the floor and see what's going on. Gary's correct - that hole is a direct connection to the bottom of the lake!!


54 Atom


77 Tique

64 X55 Dunphy

Keep it original, Pete
<
Back to Top
Gary S View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: November-30-2006
Location: Illinois
Status: Offline
Points: 12443
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2010 at 9:11am
It almost looks like mufflers with a 45* at the inlet. I wonder if it has delaminated? Anyway whatever it is it will need to be replaced.
69 Mustang HM SS
95 Nautique Super Sport
Back to Top
clibat2 View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie


Joined: May-21-2009
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 84
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote clibat2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2010 at 9:30am
These manifolds are obviously old. Personally I think you should replace them. The water coming out of that hose into the manifold is supposed to flow through seperate channels until it gets through the risers. If it is leaking on the outside, it could very well be cracked and leaking on the inside, which means you are introducing water directly into the cylindar heads through the exhaust ports.
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2010 at 2:43pm
Yes it is the 84 supra rider.    What is the easiest/best way to check stringers?
I've already been on the lake twice! Oops. By the way? It sounds and drives great. I was taking on some water through the shaft but replaced the flax packing. Now it is minimal.   

I wa having trouble finding which thread goes over the floor removal?
Back to Top
8122pbrainard View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: September-14-2006
Location: Three Lakes Wi.
Status: Offline
Points: 38211
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2010 at 3:14pm
Originally posted by muzaksyn muzaksyn wrote:

Yes it is the 84 supra rider.    What is the easiest/best way to check stringers?
I wa having trouble finding which thread goes over the floor removal?


Alec,
Here's Andy's Supra thread

I have a suspicion your stringers will look like his if not worse. I really don't know if you really need to look any farther for a stringer problem. I see missing engine mount lag bolts, what appears to be a carriage bolt used as a "nail" and the rot around the removed exhaust hoses!! Have you checked the engine to prop shaft alignment? With Andy's Supra, it's felt that due to his bad stringers that the alignment wasn't being maintained and it actually ripped the shaft log off the bottom of his hull!!


54 Atom


77 Tique

64 X55 Dunphy

Keep it original, Pete
<
Back to Top
Okie Boarder View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: August-31-2009
Location: OK
Status: Offline
Points: 779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Okie Boarder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2010 at 5:00pm
Alec,

Get some more pictures that aren't so close up. I'm not sure if they changed anything between your 84 Rider and my 89 Sunsport, but your manifolds and risers should go into the exhaust hose and then to a metal (stainless on mine) exhaust pipe to take it out of the back of the boat. Mine has rubber muffler units. Many of the older Supras had the supertrapp exhaust. From what others have told me and I have seen through photos, the supertrapps are a real problem for leakage.

If you have leakage around that area it is just saturating the compartments all filled with foam. I would definitely check to see what kind of shape your stringers are in and go from there. Can you see the exhaust thru hull area inside the boat or is it all covered up?

Check the lags holding the engine mounts to see if they are loose. You can drill a small pilot hole in the main stringers to see if you have water oozing out. Also, find a spot under a seat somewhere and use a hole saw to cut out the floor, then cut out a "core" sample of the foam to see if it is wet. If you have water oozing from places or wet foam, you have a definite problem and you'll need to decide how to address it.

Did you check for solid engine mounts or other signs of rot issues before you bought it?
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-01-2010 at 11:52pm
Well I drilled 2 small pilot holes in the stringer, one near the engine mounts, the other back by the shaft. I had no water or wetness at first... everything was dry. a couple hours after this i took a look in the hole by the engine mounts and saw a little wetness.   the other remained dry.

I did check for obvious signs of rot before i bought, the floor is completely solid all over, the engine mount bolts are all tight.

To be honest, I am not sure a stringer issue is something I want to even take on. I already have some offers on the boat, so that option is there.

The shaft alignment is on, no problems there.

As of now, I am not sure which direction to head... keep it for a summer or sell.    I would honestly prefer to get my hands on a CC if the price is right.
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-01-2010 at 11:56pm
in your opinion, is a stringer issue on this age boat even something worth pursuing? I feel that I should just sell and get something newer.

The exhaust area is all covered, although our buddy Chris Mars has offered to help me take up the flooring to address the mufflers and exhaust, if I choose to go that route.
Also, I am going to find a temporary solution to beef up of the intake into the hull area, to at least eliminate the leakage in this area.

Any ideas?
Back to Top
storm34 View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: November-03-2008
Location: Dexter Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 4452
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote storm34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-02-2010 at 2:20am
Sell and Buy this
Back to Top
storm34 View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: November-03-2008
Location: Dexter Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 4452
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote storm34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-02-2010 at 2:23am
Back to Top
storm34 View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: November-03-2008
Location: Dexter Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 4452
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote storm34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-02-2010 at 2:29am
Back to Top
8122pbrainard View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: September-14-2006
Location: Three Lakes Wi.
Status: Offline
Points: 38211
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-02-2010 at 8:45am
Alec,
You have to address the exhaust issue before you do anything so when you tear into it you'll be able to take a closer look at the stringers.

Are you drilling these pilot holes from the top? How deep? The best way to do this "exploring" is with a small hole saw. The saw will remove the glass so you can take a direct look at the wood and the pilot drill will remove a "core" sample. You want to be doing this close to the hull where the chances of rot are higher.


54 Atom


77 Tique

64 X55 Dunphy

Keep it original, Pete
<
Back to Top
Okie Boarder View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: August-31-2009
Location: OK
Status: Offline
Points: 779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Okie Boarder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-04-2010 at 10:33am
Alec,

You should also join the Supra forum. There is a guy on there with an 84 rider that is seeing some exhaust issues, as well. His thread talks about what is going on with it. There is another guy on there with an older rider also that commented on the pipes being fiberglass instead of stainless steel. It sounds like you may have the same situation. You might go check that out to learn a bit more about what you're dealing with.

Definitely keep us posted and get some more pictures.
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-04-2010 at 11:41am
I am sure they are fiberglass, I took a peek with a flashlight from the flaps side and it doesn't even look like there's no muffler and it's a straight shot from the 45's.   Thanks for all the help guys.   I will take a look at that forum.

I tried using epoxy rated for high heat to get a better seal on the floor side but I still have some leakage there too.   

Also, yesterday there were a few times where I'd turn the key and nothing would happen.... It's never the first time but the 4th or 5th. Turn the key and nothing. Other times it sometimes sounds like the starter is going out. Slow cranks with a delay.... I replaced the solenoid but does this sound like a bad starter?     When it's on it runs fine.
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-04-2010 at 11:46am
a
Back to Top
8122pbrainard View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: September-14-2006
Location: Three Lakes Wi.
Status: Offline
Points: 38211
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-04-2010 at 1:25pm
Originally posted by muzaksyn muzaksyn wrote:

I tried using epoxy rated for high heat to get a better seal on the floor side but I still have some leakage there too.

Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

The hose is NOT sealed off to the surrounding glass to keep the water out of the boat. If there was caulking or glass wrapped around the hose then it sounds like the PO did a half assed attempt of a cover up job.


Dig into the floor. A epoxy is just a "back yard" attempt and won't work!!!!

Regarding the starting problem, check all your battery connections, the cable condition and the condition of the battery first.


54 Atom


77 Tique

64 X55 Dunphy

Keep it original, Pete
<
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-04-2010 at 1:33pm
Ya I know but I need help with the floor, I won't attempt this with my limited knowledge.    Trying to fly Chris down to help with it.   

Should I replace the fiberglass hoses with stainless? (when I do this)
Back to Top
Okie Boarder View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: August-31-2009
Location: OK
Status: Offline
Points: 779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Okie Boarder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-04-2010 at 1:44pm
Alec,

If I can tackle a full replacement of the stringers and floors, so can you. ;-)

I would think reaplcing the fiberglass with SS would be a good idea.

Have you tried the suggestion Pete had using a hole saw on the stringers to get a core sample?

You might also try cutting just the floor open where you need access to the exhaust pipes. You'll be able to learn a lot about the condition by looking in there. You can use a sawzall and go shallow or set a circular saw to a shallow cut (~1/2")
Back to Top
muzaksyn View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: April-20-2010
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muzaksyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-11-2010 at 1:35pm
Alright guys, my stubborness is wearing...I will try to tackle the exhaust issue and while im in there, take a better look at the stringers.... since im a newbie, can you give me a list of materials I will need. The floor is solid so I figure ill just cut out the area I need to access and replace. What type of fiberglass/sealer/misc do I need to buy?   I plan to just replace the exhaust hoses from the existing fiberglass to a stainless.. where should I purchase these? any other materials?

I will not be able to do the stringers at this time, but I will definitely be able to look at them and decide what to do this winter.

My other question is about my starter. I have a delco-remy 1109485. It has 9 teeth. I found an place that will rebuild it for 135, but I also found a few online for nearly the same, some cheaper.

http://www.psepmarineparts.biz/store/mercruiser_hi-performance_models_&_engines_starter.htm#AHSDR0105

on this page, second from the bottom, is the one that appears to be correct. my starter goes in from the back, as you can see in some of those pictures, so it would be CCW rotation? Appreciate all the help..
Back to Top
Okie Boarder View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member


Joined: August-31-2009
Location: OK
Status: Offline
Points: 779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Okie Boarder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-12-2010 at 11:50am
I would start by cutting the floor and see how it looks. That will determine your supplies. Check with some local fab shops on the stainless for the exhaust. There are a couple threads on here talking about exhaust and I seem to remember seeing some links. You might try searching to see what you come up with.

When you cut the floor out and do your inspections, take lots of pictures. Find a couple spots to do exploration drilling with the hole saw. Show pictures of that too. I'm sure you can get plenty of guidance from there.
Back to Top
79nautique View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: January-27-2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7867
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-12-2010 at 12:32pm
buy a set of brushes and a new solenoid and rebuild the starter yourself, it's rare that the armature or field coils go bad, add a spot of grease to the bearing in the nose housing and rear cover plate and it's good as new.

now if the nose housing is cracked or the gear is all chewed up then your better off with a rebuild but if they look good no need.
Back to Top
storm34 View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: November-03-2008
Location: Dexter Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 4452
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote storm34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-12-2010 at 1:08pm
Alec, get some pictures posted of the manifolds back to the gas tank. Wide shots from the engine cover back with the access panel removed. This will give us an idea of what your floor looks like and where you'll need to cut to get to the mufflers.

I used a circular saw, depending on what kind of room you have, I would think you could do the same.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Copyright 2019 | Bagley Productions, LLC