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Stringer Repair 1985 2001 Ski Nautique

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    Posted: February-20-2013 at 12:10pm
So, I'm taking the plunge. From my first contemplative post (http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28637&title=stringer-replacement-decisions) I have made progress.

The garage to conduct the repair and later store the boat is mostly complete. The boat is inside, and I'm ready to begin the process.

The carpet has been removed, and I'm taking out the furniture today.

Engine removal, etc. is slotted for this weekend, as floor removal.

Before I start cutting on the floor, I had a question: What do you guys recommend to use to brace the boat so it doesn't sag any further when you remove the floor?

I'll get some pictures posted ASAP!

85 Ski Nautique 2001.
Stringer replacement job completed July 3 2014.
Exterior painted June 2015.
The Trailer is next.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gR@HaM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2013 at 12:23pm
As far as I understand you need to take the boat off the trailer and make some wooden mounting blocks for it, there are plenty of folks on here who have posted photos, I'll eventually be looking to do the same..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2013 at 1:17pm
No need to take the boat off the trailer... you just dont want to rely on the trailer alone to support the hull properly with the stringers and floor removed. The trailer plus some strategically placed braces (Ive put them under the chine at the rear and again under the windshield) should shore it up properly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iplan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2013 at 1:56pm
Originally posted by TRBenj TRBenj wrote:

The trailer plus some strategically placed braces (Ive put them under the chine at the rear and again under the windshield) should shore it up properly.


This is the question I'm driving at: What did you use as a brace?

85 Ski Nautique 2001.
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Exterior painted June 2015.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2013 at 2:30pm
Brace material isnt really important so long as its strong and stays put. Some people build their own fancy braces, some people make them adjustable, others swivel to account for hull angle, etc. On our BFN, we just chose some flat spots of the hull in the locations I described above and used cinder blocks and 4x4's (and some wood blocks/shims to dial in the height).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iplan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-20-2013 at 9:50pm
It turns out that I had to finish my building before I took the floor out (as it wasn't quite waterproof with no shingles or sides) ~ imagine that. It's still not "done" but today's the first day of spring, so I figured I needed to at least get going.


The carpet, engine, tranny, exhaust piping,etc., are all out.

I can not figure out the gas tank (I got it empty, but the hoses are immovable ~ essentially frozen. I was thinking I might just "cut" them off. Does anyone have a better solution?

Cutting the floor did not go as expected

I tried a circular saw, but that didn't work.

I also bought a 4.5 inch grinder, but I got the wrong kind of disks, so I couldn't even try it to see if it would be any better. If you recommend grinder, what disk would be best?

On the starboard side, the floor is mostly separated from the hull. I was really tempted to just pry it back from there (but I didn't want to break through the outer hull......).

Still now idea how to post pictures on this forum....

Best,
J
85 Ski Nautique 2001.
Stringer replacement job completed July 3 2014.
Exterior painted June 2015.
The Trailer is next.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-20-2013 at 10:20pm
Jonathan,
If the hoses are that hard, it would be best to replace them so, just cut them.

Why didn't the circular hand saw not work?

When you go to "post reply" (not quick reply) and click on the tree with the up arrow for picture posting, what happens?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iplan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-20-2013 at 11:42pm
Hey ~~~ that's why I couldn't do it ~ I was hitting the "Quick Reply" at the bottom.

This first picture shows the extent of floor separation (I put screw drivers in the crack so you could see how far it went).... It is basically separated from the air intake box to about 2 feet in front of the gas tank on the starboard side. You can also see the white line cut from the circular saw ~~~~~



The Port Side Secondary Stringer (below) has known issues.




No idea why pulling this tank is so hard. I'm cutting it tomorrow (I did get a fillup when I emptied the tank ~ so I'm still in the black). It also looks like there is a leak somewhere (see the dark stains running down the left side?)




Leveled and braced ~~~~~ For some reason, I'm really proud of this accomplishment.



As to the circular saw and the floor: It may have been a blade issue. I had a plywood blade ~~~~ little bitty teeth. It was brand new however, so I figured it would work on the fiberglass. I set the blade to cut about an eighth of an inch, but it was not happy, and made a lot of sparks. After a lot of forcing, it finally did draw a tiny line down the side, but that was about it. Once the line was drawn, it did not come free like I figured it would. I know this has to be a "user error" ~~~ any suggestions?

Best,
J



85 Ski Nautique 2001.
Stringer replacement job completed July 3 2014.
Exterior painted June 2015.
The Trailer is next.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2013 at 8:58am
Keep going! You have plenty of removing work in front of you.

I would caution you on the use of a level. It only works if the boat is level. I like to use a straight edge across known points like the old floor and then measure to the stringers.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2013 at 12:25pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

I would caution you on the use of a level. It only works if the boat is level. I like to use a straight edge across known points like the old floor and then measure to the stringers.


What the hell does this mean?


You are going to make a huge dusty mess inside if you cut and grind everything out now. Do everything except the stringers outside, on the trailer. Maybe someone who has done a SN2001 hull can further comment.

PS. Looks like Gary has been cutting off the [/ at the end of his quotes, probably just getting a little wild with the delete button while slimming down the quoted content.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2013 at 12:36pm
Originally posted by Hollywood Hollywood wrote:

Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

I would caution you on the use of a level. It only works if the boat is level. I like to use a straight edge across known points like the old floor and then measure to the stringers.


What the hell does this mean?

Yeah, Im not sure what Pete is saying either. Looks like he's trying to get the boat braced in place (level) before removing the old stringers. Thats a good idea, but doing all your demo work inside (grinding, etc) where you'll later be doing all your glassing will make a real mess.

Instead, I would suggest:
1. Take a lot measurements of the old stringers prior to removal. The most critical things are the engine mounts- get several reference points on where theyre located. Height and location fore/aft are critical. Everything else can move around a bit (floor height, etc).
2. Remove the old stringers and floor (outside). Might want to keep a lip of the old floor there as a reference point while you put the new stringers in (remove before new floor goes in).
3. Brace the gutted boat level. Use the gunnels as your side to side reference, and the old floor points as your front to back.
4. Commence with the rebuild, knowing that your boat is level, and thus, so should be all your new structure as you put it back in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2013 at 12:39pm
Originally posted by iplan iplan wrote:





As to the circular saw and the floor: ~~~ any suggestions?




I haven't done this myself, but I remember others used a sawzall for ripping the floor. You can just let it hug the hull side as you travel down the length.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2013 at 12:42pm
Originally posted by SNobsessed SNobsessed wrote:

Originally posted by iplan iplan wrote:





As to the circular saw and the floor: ~~~ any suggestions?




I haven't done this myself, but I remember others used a sawzall for ripping the floor. You can just let it hug the hull side as you travel down the length.

I know some have used a sawzall, but that can be real slow. Circular saw works great with a more aggressive (framing) blade. Stay a few inches away from the edges.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iplan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2013 at 8:15pm
Gas tank is out ~~~ finally.


BTW, when I was reading the initial stringer replacement threads, I was amazed by how many times people were washing the transom out..... well now I know. It's a filthy mess down there!

Removing the rudder assembly has me a bit unnerved. Besides taking lots of pictures and video does anyone have any suggestions?

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Exterior painted June 2015.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2013 at 9:23pm
Originally posted by TRBenj TRBenj wrote:

Originally posted by Hollywood Hollywood wrote:

Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

I would caution you on the use of a level. It only works if the boat is level. I like to use a straight edge across known points like the old floor and then measure to the stringers.


What the hell does this mean?

Yeah, Im not sure what Pete is saying either. Looks like he's trying to get the boat braced in place (level) before removing the old stringers. Thats a good idea, but doing all your demo work inside (grinding, etc) where you'll later be doing all your glassing will make a real mess.
3. Brace the gutted boat level. Use the gunnels as your side to side reference, and the old floor points as your front to back.
4. knowing that your boat is level,
Yes, I guess I wasn't too clear. The key is that Tim confirmed is the word "level" when putting all the new wood in. If the hull isn't level, using a level to the top of the wood is pointless. This is why I mentioned reference points like the floor to measure from.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2013 at 10:25pm
I used the diamond blade on a grinder... Joe recommended it in his rebuild thread.   I felt that it worked pretty well, but scared myself once I got to about the drivers seat.   I didn't cut the bottom of the hull, but sure could have.   make sure and give a good couple of inches to the hull side, then curve sharply to the keel line as you pass the pylon mount.   YOu'll have a better feel for where the side is once you get some of the foam out. Foam removal worked really well using a hand driven sheet rock saw, and a trenching shovel.   I did my floor cutting in the garage, but I used visqueen as a "booth" around the boat. I was happy with the way that worked, but will probably grind the bilge outside since it is starting to be less rainy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-22-2013 at 12:33am
I still don't get it Pete. How is a sides to side level on the stringers any less level than a side to side level on the gunnel?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C-Bass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-22-2013 at 2:21pm
I think this is what Pete is saying. If you were to use an actual level in this situation to make sure your stringers were the correct height, you would end up with poor results. If you assume the old floor was a good level reference, then this method would work.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iplan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-22-2013 at 3:24pm
Okay ~~~ My floor has separated from on the starboard side for most of the way down the boat, so I don't think the floor is a good reference point to determine whether or not the boat is level in this situation. Am I wrong?

More pressing matters:


1. What is the best way to remove wires running to the speed sensors, or does it matter? I've taken them out of their brackets, but I was wondering if I should unscrew the wire that runs from the panel to the top of the sensor, or the wire that runs from the bottom of the sensor and out of the boat? Again, I'm not sure it matters, but I thought I'd ask.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-22-2013 at 4:08pm
There should be a lip of fiberglass where the floor was glassed to the side even it the floor fell off. That will have to ground off it pretty solid.

There isn't anything level or straight in a boat, the more you look and measure the more you realize this. The straight edge is about the only way your going to get everything back close to where it was.


As for the foam removal, figure it's going to be 3 or 4 times the size of the space it came out of, many many trash cans full of foam and junk. I had good luck with a pic and a shovel geting fairly large pieces.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iplan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-22-2013 at 5:02pm
Well, I was able to figure out which speed sensor was unoperational afterall.








Then I got tired of fooling with the rudder, and decided to start cutting. The framing blade is the way to go on the circular saw. It made quick work of the fiberglass floor, and now I can see why my seat had a soft spot behind it (as well as in front of the ski pole). The foam staring at where the motor would sit, is soaking wet ~ even on top




BTW, my plan to mark the floor was to take measurements (every 6 inches or so) using a top down approach. Hopefully this is sound, as the "floor lip just came right off ~ like I said before, it wasn't attached in the first place.

Best,
J
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-22-2013 at 9:34pm
Originally posted by C-Bass C-Bass wrote:

I think this is what Pete is saying. If you were to use an actual level in this situation to make sure your stringers were the correct height, you would end up with poor results. If you assume the old floor was a good level reference, then this method would work.

Craig,
That's for the picture and explanation. It's exactly what I was trying to say. Now, maybe HW will understand!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iplan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-25-2013 at 12:39am
I've started foam removal. I'm attacking the port side with a hand held mini~pick. I've got all of the foam removed on the port side from the beginning of the secondary stringer to about half way between the motor mounts.

My thought was to "free up the port side secondary stringer by removing all the foam on that side. Then get my measurements and remove and replace that stringer. Then move to the port side main stringer doing the same thing ~ so that I move across the boat from left to right ~~~~ stringer by stringer until I'm done.

Is this a sound approach, or would a different plan be in order?
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Exterior painted June 2015.
The Trailer is next.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iplan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-26-2013 at 10:06am
Well, from the silence I figured I was doing something wrong, so I kept up with foam removal. My concern is the starboard side, where there is no floor lip as it was separated from the hull, before I started the project.

I initially took measurements, but was also thinking of marking the line with a grease pencil. Before I do it, is there a reason this might be considered a 'bad' idea?

Best,
J

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Stringer replacement job completed July 3 2014.
Exterior painted June 2015.
The Trailer is next.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-26-2013 at 10:20am
Keep at it your doing fine. As long a s you know where the stringers need to be you won't have a problem wit where the floor goes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-26-2013 at 11:00am
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Originally posted by C-Bass C-Bass wrote:

I think this is what Pete is saying. If you were to use an actual level in this situation to make sure your stringers were the correct height, you would end up with poor results. If you assume the old floor was a good level reference, then this method would work.

Craig,
That's for the picture and explanation. It's exactly what I was trying to say. Now, maybe HW will understand!

Im with HW- I still dont get it.

The remnants of the old floor are an "ok" way of judging level after the boat is gutted, but side to side, the gunnels are probably closer. Prior to gutting the boat (which is what is being discussed above), measuring level from the old stringers would be even better. The floor height/location is more of a resultant dimension than a driving one, especially all the way out at the edges. Ive seen original floors off by 1/2 - 1" (variation side to side) at this location.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C-Bass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-26-2013 at 1:13pm
I agree with what you're saying Tim. I was just putting pictures to Pete's words. It's also why I said "assuming the floor was a good reference point..."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-27-2013 at 1:22pm
Ok Craig your picture makes perfect sense but that is clearly not what the OP did. He layed a level across his old stringers and adjusted the boat until it was even.

So if that's really what Pete meant by your picture, I still dot know why he'd even be making up such a scenario.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-28-2013 at 10:15am
Mark where your separated floor was with a big sharpie. Then remember not to grind it off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JoeinNY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-28-2013 at 12:01pm
I am still a big fan of grinding out all the floor, and half the stringers. Bring in the boat, level it with an 8ft level across the gunwales. Replace the two stringers by transferring across from the two I left, take back outside finish grinding out the last two stringers, return, relevel, repeat.

Stringer location is important, floor location as mentioned above isnt so important, in fact it should be pitched a little towards the bilge so measuring accross the two sides as a way to locate the stringers is a bit sketchy
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