New ECM to GT40 -1998 (?!)

Check out this thread:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=25584&PN=1&title=poor-mans-gt40-diagnosis

Within it you will also find a link to this:
Google Docs GT-40 Spreadsheet Make sure you scroll all the way down and side to side to see all the options.

See if any of it helps. There has really only been one case of someone having to replace the ECM that I know of.

that's not very encouraging to all the GT-40 owners out there (myself included) who plan on keeping their boats for a while. if the ECM pukes, what are the options?? seems like replace the ECM or replace the engine...

Gary S wrote: If it were me I'd check into something like this seems like they can programe to what you need. It would be worth a call because a dealer sure won't help you.

Unless someone has figured out a way to break into PCM's firmware, Im not sure that those guys would be much help. They keep their engine programming pretty tight to the vest, and the stock ECM's are locked down tight. Starting from scratch could prove challenging, time consuming, and/or expensive. Unless youve got considerable skills/time/money (or at least 2 of the 3) then its probably worth paying the king's ransom for the OEM parts.

At least, thats what Ive gathered! Personally, Im waiting for Joe and Dan to develop some decent tunes.

I believe Joe confirmed that the ECM is in fact a standard Ford part, so nothing special from a hardware perspective. All its value is in the software/firmware... and thats why PCM guards it so tightly. Lots of hours and $$ wrapped up in developing it! I dont blame them for locking it down, really.

If someone can successfully unlock the code and figure out the baseline, then youre in business. By all means, make some phone calls and see if its doable! I suspect I know what the answer is, though.

If you cant find someone who can fix the old one for cheap, and dont have the skills/time/money to start from scratch, then I guess youre stuck paying out the nose for a NOS piece that someone still has on the shelf. Or, convert to carb?

I agree with TR in that the ECM is probably just a generic EEC-IV. These things can be programmed to run a huge variety of engines and transmissions. The key, of course, is the tuning, or firmware code if you like.

There has been some success in reverse engineering the EEC-IV code but it is mainly limited to the 5 Litre Mustangs and a few other popular variants. There is hardware available to interface with the EEC-IV and software to modify the tuning parameters. It takes a huge amount of time and effort to do this kind of thing, so I doubt very much if anyone has seriously tried to reverse engineeer the marine tune, even though it should be a lot simpler than an emissions controlled road vehicle

There is one possibility though, depending on how many different firmware versions were available for the 351 marine engines. If there are only a few, it is probable that they would be very similar. Rather than try to crack the code, another approach would be to put a known good marine coded ECM on a test bench and data log ignition timing and injector pulse widths under all speed and load conditions. This information could be used to either modify one of the popular EEC-IVs for marine use, or use it to develop the tuning parameters for an after market ECM such as Megasquirt. This would require a lot of time and effort as well, but in the end you would end up with the results of the many many tuning hours that the developers of the code had to invest. Probably the main benefit would be a chance to extend the life of the system for as long as the other parts would be available.

TRBenj wrote: ... Or, convert to carb?

I'm curious about that. At what point that just makes sense.

If they can make a kit to retrofit the Protech engines, why not a kit for this? It's still a similar, 351 Windsor at the end of the day, right?

When the dealers want it and there are no more spares they will make a fix, as long as they can keep selling them for inflated prices why should they stop. The only alternative is a new motor.

Proper Link

I have noticed most intermittent type problems with the ECM seem to be heat soak related. The large metal plate at the the rear of the engine that the ECM is attached to gets quite hot. This heat would then transfer to the ECM box.

I have spaced my ECM away from this plate. The air gap should help with heat soak type problems. The EEC1V ECM was designed for 185F (80C) continuous and 212F (100C) intermittent. I have not put a thermometer under the closed engine cover but I bet it gets hotter than 185F after a long 36-40 mph run when engine is shut down.

Like most electronic components they degrade with over heating and eventually fail. If you can reduce the heat the ECM experiences you will get better reliability (MTBF) of these electronic components.

any ideas on price? not sure of any pcm dealers over here to ask. just curious as a gt40 owner!.

d.

I think it was Henry Ford who said: "If I could be guaranteed exclusive rights to sell parts for my cars, I'd give my cars away" or something like that.

$600 to $800 for an ECU! Putting it in perspective, a Megasquirt 1 kit C/W a relay kit is under 250 clams. Yes, you have to assemble it, which anyone with basic soldering skills can do. If you don't have the skills, prebuilt units are available for less that twice as much. But, if it breaks, which they very seldom do, they are repairable by anyone with basic soldering skills and the most expensive component in them is the processor, which at last count was about $35.

Yes, it has to be programmed, but once programmed the program is open source and can be distributed to anyone. This is prime stuff for a group project for those wanting to keep their GT40s alive for the foreseeable future.

I admit to a bias for programmable EFI, but I see such a waste that these good factory EFI systems cannot be kept in service simply because of the cost and/or availability of replacement parts.

Pity.

I am as likely to build and program a custom controller as anyone else in the world, but to think it would be a reasonable thing to do to avoid a 600-800 dollar replacement cost of an ecm is kinda silly. You would do a bunch of work and countless hours, not to mention the possibiliy that you destroy your engine in the process simply to save 300 bucks. No way, it has its uses but as a realistic choice to save money over a stock ecm if you could get one for 6-800... thats a stretch. If they were NLA or say 1500 bucks that would be different.

Florida Inboards wrote: $1200-$1500 is now the going rate as they are "New" NLA!

ouch! pricey.

75 animal gives very good advice.

From my experience with programmable EFI, your complete electrical installation has to be perfect, or at least as perfect as one can get it. It is an "Electronic Fuel Injection" system after all.

Ground offsets can create lots of problems which are hard to isolate. Things would be simpler if there was no common ground return path, but that's not a practical solution in the automotive electrical world in which we live.

It's been said before that the thing most commonly blamed for a problem is the ECU, and the thing least likely to fail is the ECU.

Failed or poor common grounds are the most common cause of failures. Next would be electrical connections on the line side, probably next would be sensor failures, but they are not all that common either. Last on the list would be the ECU itself.

These are the probabilities. If you just have bad luck, then it could be anything or worse yet, a combination of things.