anyone towing with a 3.6 Pentastar

As much as I hate spending money on cars I am in the market for a new tow vehicle. I need to find something with decent gas mileage since it is my daily driver as well as have towing duties. I don't want anything large like a Tahoo or Expedition so I drove a 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee. Size wise it's perfect but I am concerned that the 3.6 v6 Pentastar will have enough guts for highway towing.

I currently use a jeep Liberty with the 3.7 and although it's fine around town it really is marginal on the highway. In all honesty it gets the job done but I am going to burn it up eventually. I do have a lifetime drivetrain warranty on it but I still would like to move up to something better and not have to wonder when it's going to explode.

The 3.6 has 290 hp over the 220hp in my current Liberty plus an 8 speed trans.

the obvious choice would be their eco diesel which will get 30 mpg highway and should tow like a bear with 420lb/ft of torque but we're talking about a $5000 upgrade on an already pretty pricey ride because you can only get the diesel in a limited or higher trim package so we're starting at $43,000 before the diesel. Hard to justify the expense even with better gas mileage. Also this will probably be leased so the time frame and mileage allowed won't ever allow the diesel to pay for itself.

Anyway, does anyone tow with one of these now and how does it do on the highway. Our rig is minimum 4500#, with the 3.6 it's rated for 6200#. TIA

Dreaming wrote: Alan,    I don't have any experience with the 3.6, but was wondering if you might be in the market for two cars?   I keep my diesel pickup on my insurance year round, just because I need it a few times a year.   Over all it is pretty cheap, tows the boat really nicely, and keeps me from having to load up my family cars with whatever yard debris, or tools that I might need to transport this year.   If you like the Tahoe or Expedition, you might consider picking up a used older one to tow with and keeping your options open for the Daily?   Good luck with whatever you decide on

Nah, the Tahoo or exped are too big for a daily driver for us. I'm considering buying a smaller fuel efficient car as a daily driver and keep the Liberty just for towing the boat but that still doesn't really solve my problem of highway towing. I may go that route but I really don't want to have to register and insure 2 vehicles and still settle for a subpar tow rig.

We're most likely going new because this would be a company vehicle that's why the lease looks good to us right now.

81nautique wrote: The 3.6 has 290 hp over the 220hp in my current Liberty plus an 8 speed trans.

I understand what your saying Alan. Right now we have 2 vehicles per family member,the herd needs to be thinned. My needs are completely different from yours but I have been looking at Chevy Avalanche's. Maybe I'm off on this but I don't think you can compare a GC w/290 with a Liberty w/220. We have a GC with the old 6 and the Cherokee with the same and because of the weight difference the GC is a dog. If I had to do it over I would have got the v8. It looks like there are 500 lbs difference between the GC and your Liberty with only 70hp to carry that weight so other than maybe increased wheelbase it might be a wash between the two IMHO

Do it Alan! They have enough poop to put them in the truck and still give it a 4500 lb rating in crew cab 4x4 configuration. Gearing changes the towing capacity greatly.

The one thing the guys are saying about the 8 speed is with so many close ratios you don't see gear hunting. Clearly it's much smarter than prior ecms so they say it will stick it in 6 or 7th highway to satisfy power needs rather than downshifting and revving up to 900000000 rpms and then back into overdrive.

But, I can't speak about the engine actually towing only what reviews I read. Both of my roommates are running GCs with the 3.6. One has about 55k on it so far.

I would put a healthy sum of money down on that the 3.6 coupled to the 8 speed would make the liberty look like a redheaded step child.

I drove a half ton with that engine and was actually thinking about trading I was so impressed with that transmission and engine combo with the economy.

That being said, It pisses me off the eco diesel isn't available in lower trim options. What if I don't give a rats ass about how it looks but its a work vehicle that needs to get 30mpg highway? Guess they don't care about that consumer.

So is the Liberty leased? Where is the Aztec going?!

Sorry Zach but I'm with Gary. I just don't see the benefit/cost here.

Good around town MPG and towing guts on the highway are about as conflicting as can be and any vehicle is going to be a compromise.

Alan, only solution I see is going from a "Livin large as a Trailer Trash Day Boater" to a water side property owner.
House and property will not depreciate like a vehicle but inital investment is greater.

There's no confusion who the real dummy is!

I have been less than enthused with v6 offerings in the past as well, but hp numbers and gear counts keep going up, so that should improve the experience. Fuel costs being what they are, one needs to weigh towing frequency and make a compromise sometimes... Diesels and big v8's aren't for everyone.

Alan's 200 is heavy, my Tahoe with the 5.3 worked pretty hard towing that beast, when the sail was up we were only getting single digit mileage, while Alan was driving and haulin the mail I might add.

Hollywood wrote: So is the Liberty leased? Where is the Aztec going?! Good around town MPG and towing guts on the highway are about as conflicting as can be and any vehicle is going to be a compromise.

The liberty is owned outright so i can trade it or sell it private.

The Aztec as ugly as it is is a very functional delivery van for the shop and is also paid for. I have no car payments, for now!

The GC with the 3.6 will get 25mpg highway, if it tows decent then it's a no brainer especially considering the two gas pigs I have now, neither is a good daily driver.

phatsat67 wrote: The one thing the guys are saying about the 8 speed is with so many close ratios you don't see gear hunting. Clearly it's much smarter than prior ecms so they say it will stick it in 6 or 7th highway to satisfy power needs rather than downshifting and revving up to 900000000 rpms and then back into overdrive.

yep I drove one last night and the 8sp is pretty slick, real close together.   When I have to drop a gear in the liberty I duck in case a piston comes through the hood.

phatsat67 wrote: That being said, It pisses me off the eco diesel isn't available in lower trim options. What if I don't give a rats ass about how it looks but its a work vehicle that needs to get 30mpg highway? Guess they don't care about that consumer.

Yep, you have to go from the Loredo E to the Limited and that's a huge jump in price then add the $4K for the diesel. With only a 15K mileage allowance on a 3 year lease you can't make that expense pay especially with the cost of diesel. If I was buying the story might be different. I'll have to run it by my accountant and maybe he'll talk me out of the lease option, if so that changes the long term disposition of the vehicle.

Looks like some more homework to do, I really hate buying cars.

81nautique wrote: The liberty is owned outright so i can trade it or sell it private.

If you have the factory tow package on it (the hd cooling part is a little tricky to add aftermarket unlike the hitch), you might want to sell it private party to another boater, on here or otherwise. Might not get much on trade, but that setup has some extra value to someone who knows what it is and how hard it's getting to be to find.

81nautique wrote: Looks like some more homework to do, I really hate buying cars.

It's a little tricky, since some of the traditional options for less than full sized tow vehicles, like the Explorer and Pathfinder have dropped to a more car like setup. Those two give way better mileage than they used to and can still drag 5k, but sounds like you may be cutting it close on weight.

Too many wine coolers on the road trip??

The 3.6 is 94 lbs lighter than the 3.7 and is much more freely revving.
Peak power in Jeep trim is 290hp @ at 6400 and 260 ft lbs @ 4800.

3.7 (turd city) 210hp at 5200 and 235 ft lbs @ 4000.

The only argument I could see here is that the peak torque is higher in the RPM band but that aside I almost guarantee you that with variable cam timing that torque comes on a much flatter curve prior to that than ye old 3.7. Add in almost 100 less pounds and a bevy of gears to select from and I don't see how it could come anywhere close to the poo reputation of the 3.7.

If I remember correctly the 3.7 won't go much of anywhere until it hits or gets close to that 4000 rpm number with liberal throttle application.

One of my jobs in college was running parts in a 3.7 powered half ton 2wd Ram. Probably about as slow as the VW 914 Porsche I had. Totally gutless. Didn't mind the 3.7 quite as much in my moms Nitro (very similar to current liberty platform). We only used that to tow to and from the ramp.

Chrysler finally kicked that filthy habit of cutting down their V8s to build terrible 6 bangers. The harmonics of the 3.7 are horrific the higher the rpms go.

Look how sharply the torque comes on and how flat it is throughout the rpm band.

Disclaimer: These are the only sheets I could find and I don't think they are from ma Mopar.

Alright then let me throw a new twist in this for ya. Accountant says buy over lease and take the large first year depreciation over the lease right off over three years. Another reason would be that we have two cars that are getting old now, if I lease for 3 years then turn the vehicle in I end up with 1 car that's 3 years older and no equity in the leased vehicle to put towards replacing it. I save money now but set myself up for a real costly dilemma in 3 years.   I've sort of fallen behind in my vehicles because with the way business has been the last 5 we went conservative and simply stopped spending money, now I need to make that up or I'll be stuck buying 2 cars at the same time.

I love talking myself into buying stuff,LOL

Now for the good part, this afternoon I drove an Eco diesel. That was a big mistake because I drove a pentastar after that and there is absolutely no comparison. The diesel is amazing, powerful, smooth, responsive to the foot. A real solid vehicle.    The pentastar GC felt a lot like my liberty when putting the gas to it. I can tell without going any further that it will do a better job than the Liberty hands down but it is not going to be enough better to drop 40k on.

Doing some comparisons we drove identical 60 mile routes in both vehicles, combined highway/ city. The diesel got 27.3 mpg and the gasser got 20.1.    Doing that math even figuring the added cost uf diesel fuel and a more expensive oil change the diesel still come in cheaper to run per mile. The real cost is a $4500 upfront cost for the diesel, other than that it's a win/win.

Consider that we are now looking at owning the vehicle longer than three years, the lower operating cost and the superior towing we have our answer. All that's left is getting the right price for the Liberty and negotiating with the dealer on the new one.

I will say the pentastar GC is very nice but the diesel is an amazingly different vehicle. The engine differences make the gasser feel like a fancy SUV and the diesel a fancy truck ready to go to work.

Thanks for the work on the graphs zach

81nautique wrote: not going to be enough better to drop 40k on.

This is what I was getting at earlier and some dummy called me a dummy!

Very cool, Alan- that diesel JGC sounds like an awesome machine. Glad you were able to talk yourself into it, ha.