well fudge....water in tranny |
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6107 |
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Posted: March-12-2015 at 10:23pm |
Tonight's spring get ready for summer project was change tranny fluid. Glad I did, because I don't do that every year. Well here is my raspberry shake. (looked fine on dipstick)
Even though we don't get real cold down here, we obviously get cold enough. I know this from a neighbor who toasted his engine a few winters ago. So I am very careful to drain after any use before or during the winter. That always includes removing both hoses from either end of the tranny cooler and blowing the water out. (I just learned tonight the cooler has two drain plugs....now I know) Anyway, I took the cooler off (yeah, that was fun, so hopefully not prematurely) I blew into the water intake and plugged the outlet. No air made its way into the tranny fluid lines. And I did every combination looking for possible communication and found none. So my question is, is there some way water could have gotten into the tranny without the cooler being compromised? (I ran the boat in the driveway for about 5-10 minutes last weekend, that's when it would have happened) Or is it a given and the thing is shot, even though there appears to be no air route of communication. Do I just put out my APB for a cooler now, or do I put it all back together to see if my new fluid turns into a raspberry shake? (hence my comment about premature removal.) Let me know, so I can go over to parts wanted and beg for a used cooler ASAP. Thanks. |
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21122 |
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If you didn't notice it on the dipstick and you don't change the fluid often, how do you know it happened last weekend on the hose and not over a long period of time?
It takes very little water to turn fluid to a milkshake, your fluid still looks pretty dark- there wasn't much water in there at all. Vd's are pretty tolerant of water, I wouldn't worry too much about running it like that for a short time to see of your cooler is actually leaky. The only other way for water to get in is from a flooded bilge- through the dipstick or case breather. FYI, you should NEVER use the drain plugs on the cooler itself, those fittings are just soldered on and break real easy. Just pull the lower (water) hose. |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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If your cooler does turn out to be bad I don't think it's worth your time to put a used one on----
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6107 |
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Thanks Tim. I put it back together and filled it. I'm sure there was still some pink in the bottom, so we will see what it looks like after running a little while. Thanks for the tip on the drains, I was definitely going to go that route next winter. Unfortunately, (or fortunately, sounds hard to get off) I don't have a "lower hose: because my cooler is horizontal.
Yeah, Gary, I see that now. I was pricing them and they are less than I expected, but for some reason the GM one is more than the ford one?...of course. |
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Larry,
Sorry to hear about the potential problem. Tim and Gary have great advice. I'd like to know more about how you tested the trans cooler. Pressures? Did you pressurize both the water and trans sides? I suggest putting the cooler in a bucket of water during the testing so you can look for bubbles. Is your dipstick the threaded type and by chance is the breather on the trans plugged? If so, a vacuum can be created when the trans cools drawing water into the trans from the cooler. Testing for this requires pressurizing the water side of the cooler and looking for the bubbling on the trans side. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Larry, Where are you looking? |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21122 |
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Ha, nothing engine manufacturer specific about a trans cooler! Trans hose fittings are likely going to be standard, only length and water hose diameter matter.
If you think the cooler is perfectly level, try parking the boat on a slope or raising or lowering the tongue. Most coolers aren't mounted all that solidly, just gotta get it tilted for a few seconds to drain. |
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IAughtNaut
Grand Poobah Joined: August-22-2010 Location: TN Status: Offline Points: 2568 |
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sorry Larry, I viewed your diary post yesterday
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Does anyone have a good picture of an oil cooler mounting on a pcm in the late 70's early 80's ?
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6107 |
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Pete, good suggestion on checking under water, but its all put back together now. If I take out again, I'll try that. Pressures? I just blew into it. Up and downstream on both circuits. Where'd I look? Just White Lake Marine, so far.
Adam, thanks for the heads up. I was totally flummoxed as to what happened, at least now I know there was a good reason. Yea, Tim, I figured not particularly brand specific. |
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_____________
“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5693 |
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It really isn't much water as Tim said. I would have tested it about as well as you did and then put it back together with fresh fluid a clean breather and hope for the best. Its possible you have a small leak that would only manifest itself when you had a pressurized hose hooked up, possibly even only after you turned on the hose and before you started the boat. I can bring you down a used cooler or two to white lake next month to try if you still seem to be picking up a drop or two somewhere. |
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80SN Barnfind
Senior Member Joined: December-13-2010 Location: Niagara River Status: Offline Points: 122 |
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Gary,
Here's a shot of my 1980SN from when I found it: Noel |
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Knowledge comes by taking things apart: analysis. But wisdom comes by putting things together.
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Morfoot
Grand Poobah Joined: February-06-2004 Location: South Lanier Status: Offline Points: 5312 |
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Larry, there could be the possibility that the water in the tranny is just from Condensation going on inside it. You do live in the south now and 50 degree temp swings in a 24 hour can occur resulting in condensation on ANYTHING cold soaked.
When we hit mid 60's from lows in the upper 20's I had condensation on everything metal and very slippery garage floor from the drastic temp swing. I walked across the floor in my bare feet and it was ice cold and sopping wet. Could have happened in the tranny as well. This is the very reason we top off the fuel tank in the winter months. To reduse the amount of water in the tank come spring.....We don't do that with the transmission. I'd bet that's where your water came from if you don't find any leaks in the cooler itself. |
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"Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman"
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6107 |
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Tim, could very well be, and as TimB pointed out, since its been two years since a change and it looked clear and fine on the dipstick, no telling how long its been that way. Engine was very damp when I opened it up for the first time a couple weeks ago. We'll see. I dumped new fluid in, which will likely be a little bit contaminated by old dregs, but I'll run it on the hose an bit tomorrow, or maybe, based on what Joe said, out of a bucket, and see what happens. Between blowing the water out last winter and last night's "blow test" I am guessing I am probably OK
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_____________
“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21122 |
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Larry, be aware that the pump and other internals hold a decent amount of fluid, so you'll still see traces of milkshake after another change or 2 even if all is well. It should be incrementally better with each change.
Tim, the case condensation crossed my mind, but I've never seen it happen. Have you heard of such a phenomenon actually occurring? |
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Morfoot
Grand Poobah Joined: February-06-2004 Location: South Lanier Status: Offline Points: 5312 |
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Tim, I personally haven't but after reading this thread and pondering it a bit it made me think of other possibilities. The garage floor was wet, the engine in the boat was sweating, along with the toolbox and beer fridge in the garage. I think it's worth a mention and a thought especially if Larry Boy flushes it out and it doesn't happen again.
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"Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman"
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6107 |
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What keeps coming back to me is that during one or both of the last two summers, I got caught off guard once or twice with severe rains and an uncovered boat resulting in water to the top of the stringers. (yes, it took a real man to confess this) I can't picture where the breather is on my tranny so I don't know if it would have been submerged or not. I don't like to think about that, tho, because it makes me wonder if I actually ran the boat hard with that crap in there. Have to check relative elevations tonight, not that it matters at this point, I guess.
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_____________
“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21122 |
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I would bet on that being the cause Larry... If it didn't get over the breather height (pretty much the highest point on the trans), top of stringers are higher than the dipstick for sure.
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JPASS
Grand Poobah Joined: June-17-2013 Location: Orlando Status: Offline Points: 2283 |
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When I forgot my drainplug a few months back, I had water breach the engine compartment and start spilling out from the dog house. when I changed my trans fluid afterwards, there was no signs of water.
Should I be concerned about my breather? |
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'92 Correctcraft Ski Nautique
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6107 |
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Was sitting at the desk the other day and my wife came in and said she whipped my up a little treat. Amused me that it had a familiar look to it.
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_____________
“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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