Normal amt of rust at drain plugs? |
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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Posted: October-24-2015 at 8:13pm |
I drained by block today and was really surprised by the amount of rust I got out of it, especially on one side of the exhaust manifold drain. It was really tough to get off and then I had some big chunks of rust and what looked like sediment I fished out after I got it off. Im not sure the PO pulled all the plugs in the past. Im a little concerned about the corrosion I see on the threads, especially the manifold drains. See pics below:
I used some CRC Marine solvent to try and clean up the threads and the plugs some but they still look pretty corroded to me. Should I not be so worried about it or does this look like excessive rust. Anything I should be doing to clean and protect the threads on the boat side? Plugs are easy to replace, but what happens if the threads get too corroded on the the block or manifold? The plug on the bottom of the elbow at the water pump came out but its so corroded I couldn't get it back in, even after removing and cleaning the elbow. I ordered a new elbow to replace it with. |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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SNobsessed
Grand Poobah Joined: October-21-2007 Location: IA Status: Offline Points: 7102 |
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I would chase the threads with a tap, That is what I did with mine. On the exhaust manifolds, you will have to take the riser off to get access for the tap.
Might as well remove the whole manifold. Good time to replace the gaskets & repaint them. I cleaned mine out using 'The Works' toilet cleaner, probably could be cited by EPA for all the goo that came out. While he manifolds are off, might as well replace the valve cover gaskets (there is no end to this rationale). |
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“Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.”
Ben Franklin |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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The block and the U are 1/4' NPT and the manifolds are 3/4" NPT. They are taper threads so you won't want to cut any deeper just run it in to clean them out.. Then get yourself 2 of these from here part number 4921K2 for the block,that way you can drain it easy with out having to remove plugs. You can clean out the threads on your old U pipe and put in a new plug into it. If you have already ordered you might just want to keep it,that is the only PCM Ford cooling casting thats still available,all others are sold out and sounds like there will never be anymore. And like Chris says the exhausts can be cleaned up,many soak them in muriatic acid for a bit. Don't know how mechanically inclined you are,it can for some be more work removing them than it's worth.
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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Gary, I've never tapped anything before. Is it as simple as picking up a 3/4 inch tap to run it through it?
Also, do you still have to remove the stop cocks regularly to clean the threads out...assuming I will still get some rust building up there? |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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Is this what I need?
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Glen once they are in you just leave them in.The nice thing about the ones I linked you to is that you can leave the threaded base in the block and take out the removeable T part and poke in a wire to clean anything out in the block as you drain it. Pete recommended these to us many years ago,I have them in 2 boats now. Are you just running in fresh water? If you are I would not worry. As to tapping there is a feel to it,in this case these threads are tapered and are a plumbing standard. You don't want to cut new or in this case deeper threads you would just want to run the tap in until you had resistance and clean out the old threads. Try your first one on the U.
That link is what you could use but you only need a 1/4NPT and a 3/4NPT |
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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Gary, only fresh water. I will try to pick up some taps and give it a try.
I think I read some debate on her about using anti-sieze or something else when you reinstall the plugs. What about teflon tape? Is the rust inside the manifold normal...nothing to worry about? Should I drain them or flush more often? |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Glen,
The corrosion is normal. Uncoated cast iron rusts! Pick up some of the drains Gary linked. I feel as he is, you'll be very happy with them. The block drains should be 1/4" pipe and the J pipe should be 1/8". The manifolds should be 3/4" so you'll need some bushings. I suggest brass and 3/8" drains so you'll need 3/4" x 3/8" bushings. If you go this route, Teflon tape is a good idea even if you do go with the brass Chase the threads and as Gary mentioned, you will just want to clean them up and not go to much deaper. 1/2 turn once the tap gets tight will do it. |
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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Sorry Pete, you lost me on the bushings. Are you saying you add them because of the length of the drain pipe? If the bushings are the same size, I don't understand where your putting them? |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3735 |
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A bushing is used to reduce the 3/4 inch threads down to 3/8. You want 3/8 threads so one of the drain plugs can be used in that 3/4 inch hole in the manifolds.
Bushings are available at a good hardware store. I always have a #8 nail with me when I pull my plugs, almost every year at least one plug is blocked with crud or rust. The nail quickly pushes through and opens it up again. I swirl it around in the hole to break up any rust around the opening. Keep something on hand in the boat to divert the water so it does not hit your carpets. The dirty rusty water coming out will stain. Yep, done that with our old boat did not like it. Now I am more careful when draining. |
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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Gotcha. So you guys use these at all 5 drains, including the J pipe, right? Yeah I was brushing rust chunks up for while to get it off my carpet. Will plan better next time. |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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With the ones Pete referred us to you can solder a tube into them to attach a hose to and run it out the drain plug of the boat |
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DrCC
Grand Poobah Joined: April-12-2004 Location: at home Status: Offline Points: 2867 |
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Just a few more hoses Gary, and you could make it Winterize itself every time you turned the key off.
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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I tried to clean the threads up on the old J pipe but just couldn't get it to work. Even though I go the tap in and out several times, I couldn't get the drain threads to go in smoothly...like they were hitting something. I finally gave up and just went with the new J pipe. By the way, it is 1/4 inch not 1/8. As you can see from the picture, there are still plenty of threads exposed. Ive got it in there about as tight as I could get it. Im assuming thats normal? One thing I was wondering about. If this drains aren't pulled out at least once a year like you would a plug, is there more of a chance they might seize up? One of my plugs was stuck in there really good. Im assuming you are still going to get some rust around them and just wondering it they need to be pulled out the the threads cleaned up at some point? |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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SNobsessed
Grand Poobah Joined: October-21-2007 Location: IA Status: Offline Points: 7102 |
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Pipe threads are tapered so what you show is about right. I use anti seize grease on the drain plugs so they don't seize - also they don't need much torque to seal.
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“Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.”
Ben Franklin |
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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Do you ever pull the drains out to clean and add grease?
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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No,your good to go Glen. Don't worry about it
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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The rule of thumb for tapered pipe threads is you want 2 to 3 turns by hand before you need the wrench. When threading pipe, it's common to adjust thread depth since the female threads on purchased fittings have a pretty broad tolerance. .
Glen, Gary is correct. You do not need anything on the threads with brass to prevent them from seizing. With the nice drain cocks, you won't need to remove them anyway! |
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7953 |
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How do you probe with wire with a drain cock?
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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The T part of that valve unscrews Bruce. Think of a needle and seat in a carb. Once the T is unscrewed,it's a straight shot thew the part that is screwed into the block.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Bruce,
Through the years I've mentioned these removable stem drain cocks several times. They are fantastic and I highly recommend them. Here's the product description from McMaster: "Removable handle stop cocks can be disassembled for cleaning." I'm still in shock with that drain kit Skidim sells with the elbows. I'm surprised Vince still has them listed. |
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7953 |
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Unless you drain often, I don't see the benefit over a plug. Seems like a more complicated mouse trap.
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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No tools needed,threads and seal are never disrupted and you can open it up while running to see if pump is pumping and if done a couple of times a year it keeps sediment out. I was surprised how much came out after running at Quinners this year.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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So Bruce, you like to get the wrenches and thread compound out every fall and then fumble with getting the plugs back in? What's complicated with using your hand to tighten up a thumb screw? I have to ask, do you have T handle garboard drain plugs or square heads? |
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malcolm2
Senior Member Joined: June-13-2010 Location: Nashville Status: Offline Points: 239 |
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I put the "T" hand valve from Grainger everywhere on mine. But recently I find that I prefer to go ahead and remove it and get as much sediment and rust out as possible.
I had to use bushings to make everything fit and the bushings seem to block the sediment. To each his own, I guess. |
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Cumby
Senior Member Joined: February-03-2014 Location: Upstate SC Status: Offline Points: 209 |
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I was going to ask if that was safe to do and would help keep it a little cleaner vs draining once a year? |
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99 Ski Nautique GT40
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Clark, What drain cocks did you purchase from Grainger? Were they the removable stem drains? I'd say they weren't since you can't get the sediment out and are the cheap drains commonly used for radiators. Why the bushings? What size did you purchase? The only bushings needed are for the exhaust manifolds. I also have to ask you why Grainger? Their pricing is absolutely horrible and their web site is as well. The search feature doesn't get you were you need to go and I hate having to go through hundreds of listing to find what I need. |
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malcolm2
Senior Member Joined: June-13-2010 Location: Nashville Status: Offline Points: 239 |
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I have a business account with them. You are correct, their catalog, retail, prices are way up there. It was maybe 8 years ago, so maybe it was not Grainger. But they are nice brass valves and bushings, I also have an account with McMaster & Carr, could have been them.
Yes, the bushings were needed on the exhaust manifold. I don't think the block or the water pipe needed a bushing, or to have anything but the "T" removed. I had very slow water flow last year on the manifolds, so I took the bushings off and got lots of sediment out. Clark |
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