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lcgordon View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 4:47pm
Just called delta and they do not have returns.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 5:45pm
Asking if they'll take back a used prop for a full refund is not the way to frame the discussion. . I have heard that story from several people and I think you are asking the wrong question.

Tell them your situation and which props you're considering. Allow them to give advice but I wouldn't let them steer you into anything besides the 913 to start. Ask what happens if you're not happy with the performance and see what they say. ("Send it back and we'll make sure you get what you need" is what I was told recently).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 5:59pm
Ok thanks thats good life advise I would think it would work with more than just props. I will give them another call in a couple days.

On another note you really think the 913 is the one for me to start with? That would be going against acme recommendations. Idk how much actually boat time they put in. You may have more time spent finding a good BF prop then they do.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 6:13pm
My next move if I were you would be 11" pitch with .060" cup, but unfortunately that doesn't exist. I really don't know of what kind of market you'd have selling the 913 if you didn't increase speed (and just burn a ton of fuel). I had no problem selling my 1225, 1609 or 543 to the ski boat crowd.

I'd be comfortable with the 1609 purchase. I really don't think you'll get more than 4400 rpm with any Acme nor will MPH increase with the 913 over the 1609 (and we'll likely never know.)

You're not overpropped with the 541. Elevation, engine and hull drag are your main problems. I just don't see an 600-800 rpm pickup with any prop change.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 6:22pm
They said that they could take the 1229 which is 11" pitch with .120 cup and make it a .08 cup. Wonder if that would be better?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 6:24pm


I generally like to move in 1" pitch increments. 1/2" gets you nowhere fast.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 6:32pm
Sorry HW, you're crazy. If he's turning that 541 4200-4300, he's over propped. Drop pitch and you're gonna gain rpm. It's not gonna stop increasing unless the engine can't pull it. A 260hp 350 won't fall off its powerband until he approaches 5500. Move the wot rpm to where the engine makes peak power and you stand to optimize speed (all else equal). It's not a difficult equation and altitude just requires a little adjustment.

I think the suggestion of the 13x11 with .060-.080 will get you in the 4600-4800 range (though probably the low side of it). Be aware that acme only charges full retail to protect their dealers, so it won't be a bargain. It's also a custom prop at that point so that may hurt its value even more than the 10.5" pitch. I think either choice would get you close.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 7:00pm
Thanks, I dont know what acme charges for a prop. Skidim charges 412 for the 541 so im guessing it would be the same for the other props. They offer a 10% discount and they allow returns but have to pay shipping back and a 5% restocking fee.

Acme will let me return anything paying shipping back even a custom order. Or they will fix that prop they customized for me. It just depends on the acme price.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 7:17pm
Oh and regarding prop recommendations, I am willing to bet that acme and delta are not trying very many props themselves. Acme understands reasonablg well how performance will change between their props once you have a baseline. Delta, a little less so. Still, they are largely regurgitating performance numbers supplied to them from their customers. Feel free to weigh opinions as you see fit but some of the customers providing performance feedback to acme and sharing it on this website have more hands on prop testing experience than some/most of the techs you'll get on the phone.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Orlando76 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 7:27pm
Not to discredit the advice given here but maybe post this question on ball of spray? There's a few guys there running higher elevations, especially left wheels. Maybe they've been down this road before.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 7:37pm
Thats what I thought. I kind of figured there advice is "perfect world" advice. In a perfect world you can just do the math and it will tell you exactly what will happen. The real world is not like that im guessing. Thats why I would listen to the people on here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 8:03pm
Once you understand and control the other variables, the math usually works quite well... It's that first step that is sometimes forgotten.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 8:13pm
I got ya that makes sense.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 10:35pm
Originally posted by Hollywood Hollywood wrote:

Get yourself a box of stainless cotter pins from McMaster that will last you a lifetime of prop swaps for under $10. Pretty sure I use 1/8" x 1.5". I use 18-8 but Pete will tell you 316 is better.

Thanks for the suggestion, hadn't thought of that. Looking at McMaster, 100 of the 1/8" x 1.5" in 18-8 are $12.55, and 25 of the 316 in same size are $8.31. Since 25 will last me a long time anyway, any reason to NOT go with the 316 stainless?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 10:59pm
Originally posted by 63 Skier 63 Skier wrote:

Looking at McMaster, 100 of the 1/8" x 1.5" in 18-8 are $12.55, and 25 of the 316 in same size are $8.31. Since 25 will last me a long time anyway, any reason to NOT go with the 316 stainless?

None at all. As Kevin mentioned, I would have suggested the 316 anyway!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2016 at 11:56pm
Man thats enough to replace them just for fun
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 4:49pm
Acme recommended me calling valley props in California. I did and they are running numbers and going to give me a call back. He is looking between the 1609, 1229 and the 913. He did mention that he saw why acme recommended the 1609 and not the 913 but did not state why. I think they have a decent return policy on non custom props.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:07pm
Originally posted by lcgordon lcgordon wrote:

He did mention that he saw why acme recommended the 1609 and not the 913 but did not state why.

Why would he even mention it if he didn't even tell you why? Sounds like someone who doesn't know his props but wants to make you think he does with his "crunching numbers"! IE: he needs to ask someone else!!    BTW, there are several software programs out there that can be used but, none of them are as valuable as the information you have already gotten here especially Tim's.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phatsat67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:11pm
+1 ^
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:24pm
He just called me back and told me that the 1609 is my best chance to gain a mph. He said the 913 will give me the rpm but wont be enough to give me anymore mph. This is also what acme recommended. He also asked for computer reports for the 541 fix that I have now. He said that he could do a proper fix on that prop if it was not fixed correctly. He seems to know what he is talking about. With elevation it does not seem as simple of an answer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phatsat67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:26pm
Forced induction
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:27pm
I dont know what that means
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:33pm
Originally posted by phatsat67 phatsat67 wrote:

Forced induction

It means adding a supercharger to add power by stuffing more air/fuel mixture into the cylinder.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:37pm
Thats what I thought but we were talking about props so I was confused. I am just so nervous about buying the wrong prop. TRBenj said that once you have a control down crunching numbers works pretty well. And this guy and acme both "crunched the numbers" or pulled a number out of a hat, and came up with the 1609 and thought this would be the only one to give me that elusive mph.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:37pm
Landis, is it worth saying the following to the guy - "I'm on board with running the 1609 that you are recommending, but a guy whose knowledge I respect feels the 913 may do the better job. Could I buy both, I'll run them carefully for a few passes to get the results, and will return one of them within a week of them arriving. Could you do that if I pay the return freight on the one I don't like? You'll have my money so if I damage the prop that will be on me, otherwise refund the price of the one prop."

I don't know what his answer will be, but they want to sell props and there's no risk for them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:39pm
If they are a good salesman they would seem like they know what they are doing. Are they willing to back it up if you don't get the results they say it will?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:40pm
Acme recommended calling Valley Props. Valley props said "let me get back to you". They both recommended the 1609. I'm not saying they are wrong, I don't have enough knowledge to know which prop is the right one, but think about it, Valley Props just called Acme, Acme said 1609 just like they told you, and so it appears they came up with it independently but I bet that's not the case, it's just Acme's finding.

Acme is a good outfit, I'm not for a minute saying you shouldn't be listening to them. Just have a feeling what I spelled out above is what happened.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:43pm
No prop shop is going to promise Landis anything. They're simply giving him their best recommendation. You can't possibly guarantee any hard performance numbers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phatsat67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:49pm
99% of the time Greg at acme would make a recommendation to me he would say (but you know more about the boat/hull/engine combo than I do so use your decision not mine). Likely, the info here is the best since Tim and or anyone has quite the amount of inboard seat time in testing different props/hills/engines. Acme uses a mathamarical analysis that pulls engine speed/power/mph etc to make a recommendation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lcgordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-05-2016 at 5:51pm
So this means get what TRBenj says which is the 913
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