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Glass Layup Schedule on '82 2001?

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TRBenj View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-29-2017 at 11:05am
I agree with Joe. Sadly, the 2lb density foam is on the light side for structural (floor) support so the glass going over it will have to be thicker to compensate... but I definitely wouldn't put wood everywhere if I didn't have to.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-29-2017 at 11:30am
I debated the choice of wood for a while. It's not ideal obviously but I figured the extra support might be worth it.

If I were to just go with glass (no wood), would 1 layer of 10 oz followed by 2 layers of 1708 for the floor be sufficient. Or do I need more layers?

Regardless of wood or no wood there will be multiple players of glass on top. Do all layers "flash" up onto the hull or only the top one or two? All layers would significantly thicken the hull sides at the "flashed" area and didn't know if this was a bad idea. I haven't seen this covered in any other threads.
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2017 at 10:06am
I never got a response on the questions above and have found limited info on forum searches, particularly on flashing onto the hull.

Based on the floor layup info I've found it looks like I need at least two layers of 1708 and two of 10 oz cloth. I'm thinking of the following order... 1708 over the foam (mat side down), 10 oz, 1708 (again, mat side down), 10 oz on top. BTW- I did NOT use any plywood over the foam except under the seats in the front. I have the typical wood outriggers off the secondary stringers like the factory setup.

I haven't found any info about flashing the layers onto the hull around the perimeter of the floor. I don't see why all 4 layers would need to go up the hull. I'm thinking just the top two. Does anyone have an opinion on this?

One more question... I trimmed the old floor on the starboard side within an inch of the hull. It was firmly attached to the hull so I did not cut it flush to the hull and used the leftover floor flange as a guide to cutting the foam for the new floor. The floor on the port side was not adhered to hull well at all. In fact I was able to easily peal it off the hull entirely. Is there any issue with leaving the flange on the starboard side? I was planning on just glassing over it.

Thanks,
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wisky Badger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2017 at 10:23pm
I think if you flash/tab the floor to the hull with two layers of 1708 you will have enough strength.   

I personally would removing the old tabbing area off both sides of the hull.   You have done so much work so far and it will probably take less than an hour to get it removed.   You want to make sure that you get a really good seal and bond in this area so you don't get water in your brand new foam.

As far as your floor layup, your glassing schedule will probably work. I would recommend going heavy on the glass because you used 2lb foam and US Composites says that their 2lb foam is not structural.   I used 3 layers of 1708 on my floor with 4lb foam and that might have been a little over kill.

Keep up the good work and keep the pictures coming.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-14-2017 at 4:13pm
Welp, I have not worked on the boat much at all over the past 3 months. I did get the foam finished and the wood under the seats installed as well as the wood floor support strips on each side of the bilge installed. It's nearly ready for glassing in the floor.

However I've had to take a long break from the work due to some personal issues. As a result I've got a very important bullet point for the "Lessons Learned" stringer list... make sure your spouse completely understands how much time will be involved in this project and is 150% okay with it.

Mine did not, mostly because I underestimated how much time it would take, and I was trying to rush the boat into service this past summer by working on it most weekends for months straight. Big mistake!!!! My wife filed for divorce and nearly ruined the lives of 5 people along with my plans for family weekends on the lake. Luckily we have stepped back form the ledge and are on the road to reconciliation.

I'm not laying my personal dirty laundry out there to be melodramatic, but rather as a cautionary tale to others about to undertake this size project. Don't be a hard-headed idiot like I was and forget what's most important in life.

Obviously the boat was not the sole cause of my situation but it absolutely contributed.

Not sure when I will get back on it but I still have hopes it can be back on the water summer 2018. I'll continue my updates once I restart.

... and I thought my tag line just applied to the boat...
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-14-2017 at 8:16pm
Best of luck to you with the spouse reconciliation project. I agree with you that we need to keep a proper balance between spouse, family, boat, play, work, etc.

I'm glad to see that you are working toward staying together.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-10-2018 at 6:06pm
Well, I"m happy to say that I've resolved my personal issues noted above but unfortunately did not come close to getting the boat back in the water by this summer. In fact I haven't worked on it in a year. I did get to work on the trailer this weekend and that refurb project is almost finished. New paint and no rust makes it look 100% better. I did find a good bit of pitted steel under the wood bunks when I removed them last year. I cleaned them out and filled in the worst places with puddle welds and the rest with bondo.
However I'm concerned about it happening again and considered putting some type of water proofing mastic or liquid between the paint on the rail and the wood bunk since this area will remain wet the longest. Has anyone ever done this? Not sure what product would be best.
Hoping to get back on the boat project soon.
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote andrewmarani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-10-2018 at 7:29pm
Congrats on making it through the marriage crisis. Been there, didn't work out, started over a few years later and that has been awesome... Pretty much comes down to figuring out in what ways you are an idiot and need to grow up and fixing that.

On the trailer. I stripped mine down probably 10 years ago and found the same issue on the tops of the channels. After hammering out all of the rust, I primed and used rustoleum to protect everything and put it back together. 2 years ago I noticed rust and stripped the bunks off again, cleaned the tops of the channel down to steel and used bondo to make it smooth. reinstalled the bunks. Looks good so far. First time I used a double stick waterproof tape between the bunks and the channel, figured it would help seal out the water. Obviously didn't work and added 50% to the time required to clean stuff up for the second repair. Second time, I just painted everything well and put the bunks on directly over the paint.

Couple of suggestions. I used trex composit decking for my bunks, not wood, highly recommend that. I also installed a gradually tapering piece of trex under the bunk to curl the bunk to match the changing angle of the hull. I could tell from the marks on the bottom of the boat where the bunk hit, so I used a level and a bevel square and figured out the angle of the hull every two feet, then I cut the taper piece to match. It isn't a perfect fit, but it's way closer than the original bunks.

I used gray trex and thought about leaving off the carpet, but decided that the trex was too slippery, so I wrapped them in carpet after bolting the bunks down. I used the double stick tape under the carpet (on the tops of the bunk) and it has worked well there, carpet hasn't moved and the only wear spots in 10 years are where the bow lands as I power the boat up the trailer.

I used the same trex for the two vertical boards that hit the front of the boat to stop it's forward motion. I screwed stainless steel hose clamps to the boards (two on each), left the clamps loose until I put the boat on the tailer against the boards, then snugged them up.

While I had the trailer apart I replaced the wiring. I didn't want to scratch up the new trailer paint with those wire holding clips that slip over the edge of the channel, so in the inside corner of the channel, every two feet, I put a dab of rubber caulk and placed the wire in it, taped the wire down till the caulk set. 10 years later it's all still secure. Make sure you use shrink tube marine connectors and stainless steel screws at any grounding points to the trailer.

Seems like everyone tears up the last bit of wire between the boat and the truck, so I stopped the wire short inside the trailer tube and used a 4' tail with trailer connectors on either end to run the last few exposed feet, so I can replace it easily when I finally snag it on something.

And finally, the best license plate holder ever.

Edit:
http://www.socal-fishing-hunting.com/BOAT-TRAILER-LICENSE-PLATE-BRACKET-HINGED.html

I do not get how to do the hyper link thing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-10-2018 at 7:51pm


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-10-2018 at 8:21pm
Thanks Andrew for the kind words and lots of helpful suggestions. I like the idea of using composite bunks since it won’t absorb water like wood. Should help with the rust on the top of the rail too.   Maybe I’m thinking too much about protecting under the bunks. I’ve tripped down all the rusted and loose paint areas and primed with a high zinc Sherwin Williams marine grade primer (two coats) and three coats of SW oil based enamel. I do not want this thing rusting again!   I had the exact same concern on the wiring so I welded large fender washers in side the rails every 2’-3’ to rune the wire through. And yes I will use water proof connectors. I’m changing all the lights to LED and I added a prop guard to the back of the trailer.
Wonderful idea on the sacrificial pig tail on the front. I will do that as well.

I will also look into the trex idea.

Thanks again.
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-10-2018 at 9:57pm
Just FYI, Bondo is a moisture magnet.

Under bunks is not a good application for it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-25-2018 at 3:28pm
I should be getting back to work on the boat in a couple of weeks. First order of business is to install the floor.

I'm following the advice of others on here and added another layer of 1708 over the 2 lb foam. Therefore it will be bottom layer to top... 1708 (mat side down), 10 oz, 1708 (mat side down, 10 oz and finally 1708 (mat side up). I will tab the top two layers up onto the hull and down over the stringers.

Still working on the trailer. Painting is nearly finished. About to install the new leaf springs, bolts, etc. The old ones were rusted pretty badly. Before I bought it I think this boat sat outside uncovered. most of it's life.

I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote andrewmarani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-25-2018 at 3:48pm
Maybe I just did a good job with the painting two years ago, but I pulled one of the bunks up and checked under it a couple of weeks ago. Paint on top of the bondo was pristine, no sign of bubbling, rust or the bondo popping loose.

The old trailer guides were rusting out at the bend to the trailer. Since I was fixing everything anyway, I replaced them. Using the old trailer guides as a template, I had new guides done up in stainless by a steel shop we work with.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-25-2018 at 6:06pm
That trailer looks great! I am in the process of adding a prop guard to the back of my trailer (old style didn't have one). I'll try to post a pic when I'm done.
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-10-2018 at 11:49pm
After 14 months I’m finally going to get back to the boat project   i will be putting in the floor this week. i sanded all of the carpet and glue residue off the side hull but could not get the white residue off. I assume its a bilge coat. I tried power sanding with very course sandpaper but it wont come off without really getting into the hull. I’m afraid to get too aggressive since the hull is pretty thin on the sides. Does anyone know what the white is and can it stay in place and glass over it? that stuff is bonded to the hull really well.

I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-11-2018 at 3:00pm
Allen,
14 months not working on the project! Don't feel bad since I believe it was around 14 years with my Atom laying dormmate! Glad to hear you're getting back on it..

The white sounds like the coating CC used on every surface inside the hull.. It's just a pigmented poly resin used for appearance. I wouldn't worry about removing it on the hull sides since you won't be attaching anything structural to it.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-11-2018 at 6:45pm
The floor is certainly structural on a 2001. I would absolutely grind the gel off the wall anywhere you plan to glass. 6-8” up should do it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-12-2018 at 7:18am
Allen,
Tim is correct that the coating needs to be removed where you will be glassing in the sole to the hull sides.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-21-2018 at 10:09am
I was finally able to finish installing the floor last night. Other than working under the bow, it was fairly easy. I just laid the cloth in place, pour epoxy and spread it around evenly. A lot better than the stringers where I was wetting the cloth on a table and then placing it over the stringers.
The work under the bow was the worst part of the whole project so far. Sanding and grinding under there produced a dust fog so bad I could hardly see (even with fans and shop vacs) and then trying to work the glass while laying down (sometimes in the wet glass) was NOT fun at all.

Glad to be through with that stage! Still have some touch-up and misc glassing to do here and there plus the fairing.

Next step is to re-assemble the trailer and get the boat back on it. Hopefully that will happen before Xmas.



Sorry for the rotated pic. I can't get it to upload correctly.
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-01-2019 at 2:36pm
Another update... Finally after nearly 2 years I got the boat back on the trailer. Boat is now ready for bilge work and then carpet. Hopefully it won't be another 2 years to get that done

Only items left on the trailer are painting the winch post, prop guard, repairing the bow stop and making new guide posts.

I moved the boat back to it's permanent location last weekend. As you can see from the pics below, there was a lot of dust on the boat. So much so I trailed a large dust cloud for the entire 5 mile trip. It was much cleaner by the time I got there though.



I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote andrewmarani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-01-2019 at 4:34pm
Very Nice!

Below is a sketch I sent out to a steel fabricator to have the stainless steel guide poles made up for my trailer. Sketch matches the original, rusted out guide poles.

The only adjustment I would make would be to change the 81 degree rake to 85 degrees. They slope back a touch more than I would like.

Andrew
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-04-2019 at 10:49am
Awesome! Thanks for the sketch. I may have to tweak it a little since I added some stabilizer bars near the guide attachments for the tail light bar but this will be a great starting point.
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote andrewmarani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-04-2019 at 11:21am
What jack did you use on your trailer? Looks like you've got a new one from the photo. I've still got the original and it's showing it's age. I would like to replace it, but don't see many with as much vertical lift as the original.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-04-2019 at 11:38am
Originally posted by andrewmarani andrewmarani wrote:

What jack did you use on your trailer? Looks like you've got a new one from the photo. I've still got the original and it's showing it's age. I would like to replace it, but don't see many with as much vertical lift as the original.

Andrew,
How much lift are you looking for? etrailer.com has them up to 36" !!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-04-2019 at 11:48am
It's just a Pro series 1000 lb jack. It's only about 2' extended but works for my current truck. If I change the truck I may have to change the jack again. This trailer did not have the original jack when I bought it so I can't compare.
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-04-2019 at 12:50pm
Originally posted by Nautique Newby Nautique Newby wrote:

It's just a Pro series 1000 lb jack. It's only about 2' extended but works for my current truck. If I change the truck I may have to change the jack again. This trailer did not have the original jack when I bought it so I can't compare.

Allen,
It sounds like you have the wrong idea with the proper tongue height on a trailer. Whatever trailer you are pulling, the trailer frame should be as close to level as possible. That's why they make different height ball mounts for different height receivers. You don't change the jack stand just to get the trailer tongue higher or lower to get it on the tow ball.


You need to look into the proper height ball mount.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nautique Newby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-05-2019 at 2:11pm
I knew it was critical for multi axle trailers but not single axle. Mine is not too far from level. I actually have that exact mount you included.

Thanks for the tip. Once I get the boat back together I'll check the trailer angle.
I hope I don't screw this up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aghaydon993 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-10-2019 at 8:50pm
I need new sight guides made for my 86 trailer as well.. I really like your stainless ones. I can’t find anywhere or any one that makes these. Alex from Indy
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I need new sight guides made for my 86 trailer as well.. I really like your stainless ones. I can’t find anywhere or any one that makes these. Alex from Indy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote andrewmarani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-11-2019 at 9:39am
Hi Al.ex,
You won't find these on line or for sale in a store. I had these made up by a steel fabricator that also works with stainless steel. I'm pretty sure everything they need to know is on that sheet of paper (except change the 81 to 85 degrees).

I don't know your connections, but if you know anyone in construction they probably know a small steel fabrication shop you can contact. Many will work for cash. I don't remember the cost, it was 5 years ago, but it was expensive. Primed painted steel would be much less. If you do ask a steel fab shop to make this, ask for a price in stainless steel and prime painted steel, The stainless cost is going to be a bit of a shock.
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