Cold weather pondering-hull design '70's SN |
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MourningWood
Gold Member Joined: June-13-2014 Location: NorCal Status: Offline Points: 886 |
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Posted: December-13-2017 at 10:55pm |
Here are some more weights:
Alternator w/ bracket: 11.0 Velvet drive 71c: 95 Battery: 51 Rear center floor: 26 Motor box (upholstered): 59.5 Biggest surprises so far, the cast iron timing cover, the super-heavy exhaust manifolds, and the motor box. And the Velvet drive. So with the changes I plan to make, this will take almost 300 lbs. off the water. I don't know if a 14.5% weight reduction alone will get the hoped-for results in wake improvement. Also, without Photobucket, what other easy ways can I post pics? Thanks |
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1994 Ski Nautique "Riot"
1964 Dunphy X-55 "One 'N Dun" 'I measured twice, cut three times, and it's still too short!" |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Here is Joe's build-
The fiberglass work does not start until page 4 but the whole thread is a great read |
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Gneil
Groupie Joined: December-07-2017 Location: Philadelphia Status: Offline Points: 42 |
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Donald,
Thanks for the tip to Tim B and Joe F. Just doing some materials research and would like the stringer fix (if necessary) to last. I got a good price on the boat and thought the fix could afford some good planning before I start buying stuff. Thanks again. |
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G. Neil
1980 SN |
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Donald80SN
Grand Poobah Joined: January-12-2009 Location: Denver, NC Status: Offline Points: 3888 |
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Greg,
Several on this site, Tim B., Joe F have used CAD to design and cut the stringers and such from composite board. They put the stringers back as composite. Donald |
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1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens
2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Online Points: 13510 |
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Good luck. Nobody seems to have wanted to pay for Kevlar or carbon fiber but they sure would be the best fabrics available. I am looking forward to your build!
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Gneil
Groupie Joined: December-07-2017 Location: Philadelphia Status: Offline Points: 42 |
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Hi Keno,
Thanks for the sage advice. I'll start a new thread and not confuse this one. I was thinking about weight with the new floor/stringer/foam etc was concerned. That was the logic. I'll start a new thread and not confuse this one. Cheers! |
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G. Neil
1980 SN |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10650 |
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Hi Greg
My first thought is that you should start a new thread you can call your own, instead of tacking on to this one It'll be easier to keep track of things that way without other peoples issues/problems mixed in. Otherwise if you've lurked here a while, you know somebody (most likely named Pete) will want to know where the pictures are. |
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Gneil
Groupie Joined: December-07-2017 Location: Philadelphia Status: Offline Points: 42 |
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Hey guys,
Im new to the group and have been loving the conversations through the forums. Thank you! I recently picked up an 81 with less than 1K hours, and considering the age, its in good shape. As most of the early fiberglass SN its likely that ill be doing a stringer job in the near future. With this in mind, Im currently doing some research into Coosa board as a substitute for doug fur stringers. I've read many forums and understand the different arguments pro and con. One topic i haven't seen is the one where modern materials like Coosa are used with carbon fiber or kevlar. Any thoughts in this direction? Additionally, I'm interested in fully documenting my rehab and recording the updates and improvements including pattern making for the stringers and related bulkheads. unless i can buy them form a reliable source. Any one know of such a thing? As I've worked in the design field for the past 25+ years, I'm computer capable. (CAD Sketch-up etc.) Any info would be greatly appreciated. |
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G. Neil
1980 SN |
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tryathlete
Platinum Member Joined: April-19-2013 Location: Lake Villa, IL Status: Offline Points: 1797 |
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In that case we can settle this on Deep Lake. Quinner will need to set the course up and this could be his motivation.
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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Nobody acknowledged or said anything about that old thread I linked above about reducing weight. But recent posts have talked about weight reduction other than the engine components.
Just by hull adjustments look how Paul was able to change how his boat sat in the water. |
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_____________
“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Roger, Looks like documentation used for calculating flotation! EDIT: Keith, How about putting the document Roger found in the misc./reference section? |
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uk1979
Platinum Member Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1410 |
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I found working on my gen 2 SNWeights
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10650 |
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I figure the complete engine with manifolds and transmission weighs 856 pounds
This link explains where I came up with that number. see page 15 I think the 856 is with a B/W transmission since that's what the diagrams in the manual show The whole boat according to CC weighed 2100 pounds dry. I borrowed Pete's abacus and came up with a hull weight of about 1250 pounds as a ball park number for the hull, just to give you an idea. |
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MourningWood
Gold Member Joined: June-13-2014 Location: NorCal Status: Offline Points: 886 |
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Yes, I do plan on weighing the hull while motor/trans are out.
As nice as the boat appears to be, pretty sure it has picked up some ballast in 36 years..... |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10650 |
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Maybe you should weigh the hull, or check under the floor, there could be a lot of water weight in the foam
Or you could just tell yourself it's an 81 that's bone dry under the floor and hasn't packed on any pounds over the years. |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Doubtful you'll find an aluminum timing cover with a water pump mount but you could go with a crank mount pump. Ditch the circulation pump like HM did but be prepared that they cool differently.
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10650 |
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You could slap in a new style permanent magnet starter, it weighs about half of what your old one does.
Advertised weight of 9 pounds, compared to advertised weight of 18 pounds for the old style. |
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Duane in Indy
Platinum Member Joined: October-26-2015 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 1578 |
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I definitely would and did go to aluminum on at least the first three items..
Water pump housings and timing covers are a little more difficult to scrounge the proper parts in aluminum |
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Keep it as original as YOU want it
1978 Mustang (modified) |
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MourningWood
Gold Member Joined: June-13-2014 Location: NorCal Status: Offline Points: 886 |
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Some weights so far:
Intake: 47 lbs. Heads, complete: 50 ea. Ex maniforld (stock PCM): 50 ea. Water pump (iron) 14 Timing cover: 13 Motor mounts (compl): 13 ea Trans mounts: 12.5 ea. Starter: 17 Thermostat hsg: 9 |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Yea those exhausts and a stock intake are not on the light side, velvet drives are not either. Spend the bucks and get some Hi Tek's to lighten the load
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MourningWood
Gold Member Joined: June-13-2014 Location: NorCal Status: Offline Points: 886 |
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Picked up the '81 on Monday evening. Had a couple other projects (cars) to wrap up, but managed to pop out the motor/trans and teardown.
Some of the Ford industrial engine/PCM marine conversion pieces are HEAVY! I'll post a tally of weights of some of the components I'd like to replace. I think I can get 150+ lbs. out of the drivetrain. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Gary, 176?? It's more like Wi. 29!!! |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Excellent idea Todd only one problem, Google Illinois route 176, he doesn't go any further south than that |
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MourningWood
Gold Member Joined: June-13-2014 Location: NorCal Status: Offline Points: 886 |
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I think I limited my performance 'comparison' to specifically wake shape. No claim was made that a Dunphy X-55 would "outperform" a mid-to-late 90's era ski boat in every respect. Just that the wake height, shape, and softness would be on par with, or in some cases, exceed those craft. Let's keep things there. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Ken, Thanks for the civil response. I now stand corrected that Leo did utilize a tracking fin and CC carried that through as an option when the they started building the 1st generation SN in 61. The X55 was produced between 63 and 65. |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10650 |
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Pete, If you read what he referenced you might notice the tracking fin option on the SN before the x55 ever existed
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Tim, Wow, thanks for the information. I never knew CCfan had a reference section. |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21109 |
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Pete, are you familiar with our reference section? What was the first year for the x55?
http://correctcraftfan.com/reference/bview.asp?id=52#image2 |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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One item I find interesting is Dunphy incorporated tracking fins on the X55 hull design and that was years before CC used them.
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63 Skier
Grand Poobah Joined: October-06-2006 Location: Concord, NH Status: Offline Points: 4232 |
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So, to summarize, we need a Dunphy/196 ski-off on a course that's 10 ft. away from shore and Larry's neighbor will film underwater hull performance from his sub.
I've never seen a Dunphy either. I think it's ok for me to say that I'm pretty confident a 196 is better to ski behind, just like Todd. Some things just are common sense. A lot more than raw wake height goes into evaluating a slalom boat. |
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'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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