91 nautique excel will not throttle up under load |
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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Posted: June-24-2018 at 1:59pm |
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Good morning, I had just put a rebuilt engine back into my 1991 excel nautique last week. With this process, I have gone through new fuel lines cleaned the gas tank it has an hei pertronix distributor on it. I got it running on the trailer and it runs great, will rev up and go in and out of gear fine. I set the timing at idle too at 10 degrees before tdc on the trailer too. I took it to the lake yesterday and it would stall going into gear and out. Once I would get it into gear, it would not rev up. It would only go about 6mph and I tried moving the distributor around and it would not go. Any ideas? also while i was messing with it, I noticed the tranny slipping so I looked and tranny fluid was laying in the bottom of my boat. I went and got some, added it, and it didn't leak any the rest of the time. (I think it came out of the vent) Thanks in advance
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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What about the V drive? How's the prop shaft alignment? |
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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I did not check the alignment, when I do, I will get back to you on that.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Josh, I noticed you were searching for "prop shaft adjustment". Here's prop shaft alignment. "Alignment" is the key word. |
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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Thanks for that!
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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I am still a little unfamiliar with using this site yet for searching, I did check my prop alignment and I could spin it with one hand by grabbing the prop, but i had to use two hands to spin the shaft. I used a feeler gauge and could not get it to slide into the coupler at any point in the rotation. I just happen to try to spin the transmission mount alignment nut by hand when I was looking at the alignment. So the previous owner did not have those tight. This boat does have a vdrive on it.
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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Now that I am thinking about issues, my tachometer seems to jump around a little bit and does not work right. It is a new gauge I put in this winter and at idle it says its at 2000 rpm and it doesn't really move through reving the boat up. Could this be a timing issue and since the timing is messed up, would it make my tach messed up?
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Josh, You've missed the point of how the feeler gauge is used. Yes, with the coupling halves tightened, you can't get the gauge in. but, the coupling halves need to be loose. You use the feeler gauges to check for parallelism between the coupling faces. It sound not be out of parallel more than the .003". However, if you can spin the prop by hand it does sound good. Check it out anyway. |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Lets not get hung up on alignment issues when the real question was it not running right.
Why did you do the rebuild in the first place? Is the ignition system the same as it was before the rebuild? |
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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At idle and on the trailer it sounds like it is running just fine, but when I try to set the timing, i cant quite get it to run at 10 degrees before tdc, it isn't happy there but will run if I adjust the idle speed up higher, and I did the rebuild because I bought it In the Fall last year and the previous owner did not winterize it right (the block was cracked) I did not know this until this spring when I took it to the lake and after aout 2 hours it was full of water. I used the block out of an 1989 ford truck with my camshaft and the truck bottom end, the truck motor only had 20,000 miles on it. The crank is drilled both directions so it can run in reverse. This is the same ignition system as last trip on the lake when the engine filled with water. (engine ran fine then)
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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I did miss that point, I will loosen the bolts and do the alignment that way, Thanks for all the input I have gotten from everyone as I would like to have this sorted out before July 4th
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10680 |
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What's your firing order and have you double checked that the wires are run correctly?
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Where are our Excel experts?? By that time frame '91 were they using right hand engines? By then most SN were using lefty's
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10680 |
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Far from an Excel expert but they had RH engines at that time. Here's an old thread Gary, complete with pictures old thread |
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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It is a RH engine and I have checked the firing order and plugs, all match up. I just did the alignment, and it was already perfect.
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10680 |
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But what is the firing order?
People have screwed up their firing order,cylinder numbering, mixed up a couple of plug wires etc and had those same symptoms trying to accelerate which were magically cured when they realized it and then got it right Here's a picture |
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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Figure 6 matches the numbers on the tag on the engine, and that is the way I have it set, because I had originally thought it was a couple crossed wires.
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Years ago, before this site, when I rebuilt my HM 302 in the Mustang,I bought a reverse rotation cam from Crane. Used the firing order on the cam card and ran it in at 2k at the dock. Went to go for its first drive ran much like yours. Long story short the cam card showed the reverse 302 firing order when in fact they ground the cam to the reverse 351 order which is different. I had to pull the valve covers,turn it over by hand and watch the rockers in order to figure out what they did. Just saying.....
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Let's not get hung up on firing orders as a possible cause of the engine running right. Gary, My early thought was since the engine was just dropped in without an alignment it could have caused such a bound up prop shaft that could limit RPM's |
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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I know the cam is correct as it was an original one with the factory motor
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10680 |
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Gary's not saying your cam is wrong. He's giving you an example of what happened to him with firing order, plug wire mixups, but you've obviously at least double or triple checked all this so it must be something else |
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Duane in Indy
Platinum Member Joined: October-26-2015 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 1578 |
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Keep it as original as YOU want it
1978 Mustang (modified) |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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Duane, You didn't read the events in the order they occurred. I've done it too! I brought up the alignment as a possible cause BEFORE he checked it. Then of course Gary has to step in and work me over for even bringing up the alignment! |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10680 |
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So how's your carburetor?
Idle mixture screw adjustment good ? Accelerator pump adjustment/clearance as it should be? How's the anti siphon valve at the gas tank? |
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JohnH
Newbie Joined: April-07-2017 Location: Rocklin, CA Status: Offline Points: 2 |
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I installed a Pertronix distributor and coil on my BB chevy and it ran great for about 50 hours. Suddenly I had the same symptoms as you: it would idle and rev with no load but would not accept throttle under load. The problem was a bad Pertronix coil. I changed it for a generic GM oil filled coil and it was back to running great.
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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I had a professional rebuild the carb while I was rebuilding the engine, he told me how to adjust the air screws, I got the one side to adjust but the other side would not make a difference if I screwed the screw all the way in or out. I will check the coil.
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Shua4242
Newbie Joined: June-24-2018 Location: 45880 Status: Offline Points: 28 |
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I never knew there was a valve in the tank so I will pull the sender and check it. Thanks for the help guys.
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10680 |
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Don't pull the sender, the anti siphon valve is external on top of the tank. The hose to the fuel pump connects to the valve. unhook the hose and unscrew the valve. Then you can see if it's plugged with debris. It looks just like a barbed hose fitting, but there's a ball and spring inside of it |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10680 |
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Here's a picture anti siphon valve s on the left, the suction tube for the tank is on the right
It's a good time to blow out the suction tube too. |
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Air206
Grand Poobah Joined: September-28-2008 Location: Roanoke, VA Status: Offline Points: 3000 |
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Since you'll have the rear bench out and the floor off, It is a good time to switch to a WEMA sender for that tank. (stick, rather than float arm). Measure to the tank bottom through the sender hole. Order a sender 1 inch shorter than the tank (11 inches IIRC for my Excel). They are worry-free and tame that big tank slosh better. Original gauge is 240-33 ohm American Stewart Warner type (Not European, 0-80 ohm).
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