DUI Distributor question |
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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Posted: November-07-2018 at 3:08pm |
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Can someone interpret for me what seems to be conflicting info in this ad.
https://www.jegs.com/i/Dixie-Racing-Products/314/M12620BL/10002/-1?CAWELAID=230006180037481813&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=15769068431&CATCI=aud-194671897271:pla-213811363271&CATARGETID=230006180037475786&cadevice=c&jegspromo=thirdparty&gclid=CjwKCAiAt4rfBRBKEiwAC678KZlXg7Bhl1vlH9t5ArJC4vNIwAvUdxcuwABiXfG5B5UUCDRApSu4bBoCvPsQAvD_BwE So the product title says "with EFI External coil" I took that to mean it uses a coil like my existing points distributor does. Same one, hopefully. But I dont know what EFI means in this context. I am guessing not "electronic fuel injection" as that is not a coil descriptor. Googled it in this context, but found nothing. Now the write up below the picture says "with no external coils or ignition boxes required" OK, which is it, external coil or not? Then in the Features, it says: "internal 50,000 volt coil (internal)" OK, so once again, which is it. Sadly, the guy I talked to at Jegs had no clue, so I thought I would ask you guys. I know most of the DUIs have the square black box coil mounted on top of the distributor, but that is $100 more, and if this one runs on an existing coil (or has one inside????) then that would be my preferred route. Let me know your thoughts. Thanks, |
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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Orlando76
Grand Poobah Joined: May-21-2013 Location: Mount Dora, FL Status: Offline Points: 3108 |
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It does take an external coil. I think Jegs has a generic cut and paste description giving false info. And trying to get reliable info from somebody at Jegs is about as possible as getting reliable info from somebody at Grainger. I’d call DUI direct, the guys there were great to deal with. What’s wrong with deleting external coil? Would make it cleaner.
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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Well, got my answer from DUI. This is no good for me. Apparently the advance is computer controlled in conjunction with the EFI (found out that does mean "EFI") So I guess I am looking at the next model up, with the integrated coil. Nuts....more dough.
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7946 |
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Why are you looking to change from your current dist. to a DUI?
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21109 |
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Trying to keep up with the ford guys, duh.
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Online Points: 13510 |
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He's got money to burn, duh.
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7946 |
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Lol, I love Ford engines, but you have to modify the heck out of them to keep up with a stock SBC. Larry's engine is a great example of that. It's a 305 as I remember, which was a dog of a car engine, but it smokes every stock 302 out there in a Correct Craft.
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7946 |
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I'm sure he does, but he keeps it hosed down and it never ignites. |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21109 |
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Interesting selective memory there, Bruce... I remember it running pretty fast at the LG reunion where everything seemed to be running about 2mph faster than they typically did (at least my boats were)... but last I heard, Larry’s 305 Tique was running about 46 on the gps- a good bit slower than some of the faster 302 boats I’m familiar with (48-50 on any given day). I know he has an optimistic speedometer and tach also- possibly what fueled the “fast Chevy” rumors in the past? |
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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LOL . I dont know if I've got money to burn, but otherwise, this is quite true. How come? I am all for keeping it original (points), and the heritage of points, and believe that they can work for ever and be reliable and I am all for not spending any $ I dont have to. But.... The replacement mallory marine/sierra points distributor I bought 2 years ago has been a dog. Constantly replacing components, constantly fiddling with adjustments, constantly planning on going skiing and having it run like crap. So I gave up. I have an old espark unit laying around I was going to put in (ran one of those for years and was always happy with it) Was going to put it in this past weekend, but the cam is absolutely fused to the shaft and will not come off (some of you may recall the old photo of my rusty old cam in one of my prior threads about this) Just decided it was time for the upgrade. |
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7946 |
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I thought it GPS'd over 50 at Northwood Lake? And not selective memory, just memory....Could be that replacement distributor is causing it to run along side the Fords.
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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Yeah, 50.7 and northwood, just inching out the 454 for 4th place. It has gotten a little tired in the past 9 years, but on a good day is still 47, maybe 48 by GPS. Cited speeds were never based on "an optimistic speedometer". And since top end isnt a real high priority, I dont tend not to drop hundreds or thousands of dollars per mph to keep up so I just let it ride. Good enough for skiing and footin.
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7946 |
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Who's 454? You must have humiliated the poor guy.
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5693 |
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I believe we are talking about Eric's 454 which was in a 2001 hull- right around 50 seems to be what you get out of 330hp in that hull so I would say it was healthy enough. I could be wrong but I don't think we have seen anyone that dropped an excal 330 into a 2001 hull do any better. |
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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Yeah, Eric, couldnt remember his name. He ran a 50.4 +/- in his 454 2001. I typically dont get too involved in speed runs, but thought, Hey, I think I might be competitive with that. So on the way back to the dock at the end of the day, with Dave Hart in the back manning the GPS and Reid alongside, pacing us in his classic, we hit 50.7. Dave recorded that as an official entry, and I got a hip plaque to take home.
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7946 |
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I don't remember much about that race, except for your boat running over 50 and Reid's Classic running close to 54 as those speeds were so impressive.
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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OK, this thread got wicked sidetracked to a general ford/chevy performance discussion, plus, I have been away from it for a few months, working on a house reno project. So, now, back to my distributor. So I passed on the DUI and (once again with some help from Ken) put my old espark into my distributor. Fired right up, everything good. You can hear it run in the first part of this clip. But then, after about 15 minutes of run time, getting the timing dialed in and just sort of test running it (in the driveway) it started running rough. So what happened? Why was it good and then go to rough? No more points to be not set right, no more condenser to act up, Espark conversion included rotor and cap. You can hear it in the second exhaust section of the clip. Sounds like it is missing. Put my timing light on every wire and all 8 are firing. One thing I did notice. Cylinders 2 - 8 flashed at a uniform rate. Cylinder 1 seemed to be an erratic pattern. Could that mean something? Didnt check plugs but they are new last summer. When it started running poorly it was smokey and smelly. Possible carb/gas issue?
The first 2 "scenes" of the video are it running OK. The second 2 scenes, exhaust - engine/exhaust are when running poorly. The difference is fairly apparent. Any thoughts? |
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21109 |
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Sounds like it’s running on less than 8. Inconsistent spark and unburnt fuel smells would be consistent with that theory. How’s the gap on the pickup? Anything loose under there?
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phatsat67
Grand Poobah Joined: March-13-2006 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 6147 |
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Have you tried a coil ? They act up after some run time when they start to get heat in them. Is it still ran through a ballast resistor or direct 12v to the coil ?
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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Thanks for your input.
Tim: concur on maybe not all 8, but like I mentioned, have "signal" to all 8.. but like I said and you acknowledged, the signal to 1 seemed erratic. Not sure what you mean by gap on the pickup. What connection are you referring to? Zach: Went back out later after everything cooled. No change. The espark calls for a resistor, either external or internal in coil. The coil I had (bought last summer in anticipation of going to espark) is supposedly internal resistor. I say supposedly because Ken told me the mallory 29219 was the proper internal resistor coil. As I was in a hurry at the time I went to local shop and they cross referenced that to a Duralast (yeah, yeah, I know) C877, again, supposedly internal resistor coil, but I have found no documentation to verify that. So I have the coil coming off the 12 v end of my external resistor and the espark wired to the coil instead of the low voltage end of the resistor. (as directed in their instructions) If the coil is not internally resisted, I think I would have killed the espark rather than just running poorly. My experience is, esparks dont get sick, they just die. But in either case, maybe I will rewire coil and espark to resisted end of resistor. |
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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phatsat67
Grand Poobah Joined: March-13-2006 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 6147 |
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I’m not sure an internally resisted coil will be giving the e spark the voltage it needs if it really needs a resisted signal. You’re still feeding the coil 12v and the internal part of the coil isn’t going to effect much on the exterior terminal. Try a jumper wire from your stock resistor to the e spark hot wire. Can’t hurt anything.
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21109 |
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Yeah but a shiddy/inconsistent signal to all 8... is going to make the boat run shiddy (inconsistently). Inspect very closely the pickup and trigger mechanisms, confirming that everything is tight/secured and the gap between the 2 is per factory specs for your kit. |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10650 |
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It's an E spark so there's nothing to adjust, you just have the shutter wheel and the optical unit. The optical unit comes mounted to the base plate with no provision for any kind of adjustment. And there's no adjustment on the shutter wheel either. You can clean the optical pickup with electrical parts cleaner though Since it cooled down and then you started it and it acted up right away it wouldn't seem to be because of something heating up.. Have you looked down the carburetor throats to make sure it'd not dumping too much fuel? Maybe you have a chunk of junk in a needle and seat. The coil should be 1.5 ohms. The Mallory 29219 works well with no ballast resistor. You can find suggestions for every combination of ballast resistor wiring you can think of on the net. I figure I've got at least 25 "Pete years" of use on one with no resistor and the Mallory coil mentioned previously wired per the Mallory instructions Check the plugs to see if the issue is affecting all 8 and somebody might ask if the firing order has been double checked too. |
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SNobsessed
Grand Poobah Joined: October-21-2007 Location: IA Status: Offline Points: 7102 |
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I had a 260 SBF in my Sunbeam Tiger on which the PO (my brother) had put on solid copper plug wires.
Well it developed a miss that I just couldn't figure out. A drag racer friend knew exactly what it was, cross firing. Apparently #4 & #6 wires don't want to be next to each other. So maybe check cap & wires for possible problems. |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21109 |
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Adjustable or not, id be inspecting and measuring the darn thing to make sure it’s not dirty or damaged or wildly out of spec on the spacing. I’d revisit the coil and how the whole thing is wired up also. |
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6100 |
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Just to fill in a gap or two. I dropped in the espark a couple months ago, It started but ran like crap, I had no time to work on it, but just assumed it needed timing since I didnt have time to mess with it. This weekend was my first time back. Started it, ran like crap, adjusted the timing and thats when it smoothed out nicely and ran nicely for around 15 minutes. That is why I kind of doubt wrong wiring, but I do need to check quality of connections.
Ken - Yes firing order. Before starting it yesterday, I did check that, since it ran crappy a couple months ago and I had just changed over the wires to the new cap. And Chris, funny you mention the crossed wires. Thats a memory that goes back to my teens (late 60s or early 70s) My dad's mustang (boat) was running bad. He did some research and discovered the crossed wire thing. I've always remembered that and checked accordingly. I didnt have time to implement everyone's suggestions today. But since we are forecast to get into the teens tonight i did have to go out and drain it. While out there, I did move the coil feed and espark feed to the downstream end of the ballast resister, just for grins. Didnt start. I will put things back to the way they were next time I have a chance to trouble shoot. Will check/clean carb, will check connections. Not sure after that. I'll keep you posted. Thanks all for the input. Tim, What spacing? Like Ken said, not a whole lot of adjustments on the esparks. |
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“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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