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should I replace the choke?

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flyweed View Drop Down
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    Posted: April-24-2019 at 2:39pm
Hey guys,

Kinda been off of here since last fall, when I put the SN to sleep for the long winter here in Wisconsin..and it was LONG and COLD!

Anyway, at the end of last season..my boat wasn't starting as easy as it normally would. My normal start procedure was to run blower for a couple minutes, turn key and boat started at idle..needed NO movement or "neutral idle" input or "throttle pumps"

The last few times last year, I'd have to put the throttle into "neutral high idle" to get the boat to start, then I could move the throttle back into the 12'Oclock position, and let it warm up.

I've read in some other threads of guys replacing the "choke" or "auto choke" on the carb. Should I do this? Could it be time?

Any thoughts or input would be much appreciated.

Thanks
'93 Ski Nautique NWZ, Air Boom Tower
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tryathlete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 3:11pm
I’d lubricate and clean the thing first: and clean all the connections. Setting the choke by advancing the throttle forward all the way and a pump or two is actually proper technique. When you turn the key on after that, if I recall correctly, within a few seconds the auto choke should move towards close based upon temp.

I’ve moved to fuel injection too long to remember all this stuff but there’s nothing wrong with setting it before you crank it. Popping neutral and advancing the throttle open should not be necessary if things are working properly (in my opinion).

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 3:18pm
Dan,
As Peter mentioned, check to see if the choke is working. If not, get the VOM out and see if it's getting power and if it is, Ohm out the coil.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 3:52pm
2 or 3 FULL pumps on the throttle should richen the air/fuel mixture so that a choke is not needed. That is assuming that your accelerator pump is working properly.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GHTILL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 4:21pm
I wound up replacing my electric choke on my 93' and glad I did. Easy fix and starts much easier now. Many here on the forums will disagree but Holly originally placed them on their carbs for a reason.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 4:24pm
Originally posted by Jonny Quest Jonny Quest wrote:

2 or 3 FULL pumps on the throttle should richen the air/fuel mixture so that a choke is not needed. JQ

I pump the 2 or 3 times AND my choke works. Yes, the accelerator pump works too! I've always found Fords to be on the "cold blooded" side. My 312 is the same.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 4:25pm
Originally posted by GHTILL GHTILL wrote:

Holly originally placed them on their carbs for a reason.

Correct!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyweed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 7:04pm
so can you guys clarify..when you say "pump throttle" two or 3 times....is that with throttle handle "pulled out" so you aren't engaging transmission..or left "in" ????
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tryathlete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 7:07pm
It doesn’t matter before you crank it. It won’t crank if it’s out of neutral with the lever moved forward if neutral safety switch works properly anyways.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyweed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 7:16pm
got it....thanks.

I may order a new Holly electric choke..as I KNOW mine is original. and more than likely in need of replacing sooner than later. Been thinking of ordering a rebuild kit for the carb as well. I know it's never been rebuilt. I just like things being done, so I know the age and "wear" of those items. Just sort of "preventative" maintenance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 7:25pm
Dan,
A new choke? Why not test it first as recommended before you just start throwing parts at it? My 64 and my 77 chokes still work and they are originals!!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyweed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 7:32pm
Pete,

sorry..wasn't more clear....I MAY order a new choke, along with a full rebuild kit, to have on hand WHEN..not IF...these things need replacing. I know SkiDim sells that electric choke for almost $50, but you can pick up the exact same part on Ebay for $15.00 (Holley). If I have the parts on hand when I start to diagnose, if anything needs replacing I'll have it here on hand.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 8:32pm
Dan,
You sure must be in a hurry to get that boat out on the water. I'm still looking at ice on the lake up here!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyweed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 8:41pm
Pete

LOL.......yeah....down here near LaCrosse, however, we MAY actually go out with friends on the river this weekend and do a "picnic" on one of the sand bars. :)

But yeah..I know it's a different story up there. I DO plan on being up at our place in Minocqua to open up sometime the first week of May. We want to build a deck on before it gets busy up there..so I have to get up that way...I would LOVE if you ever have some free time to come over at some point and go for a ride with me on my boat... when I am pulling skier's and I am hitting the throttle hard to get them up out of the water, I get a little vibration, but then goes away as I speed up. Just want to get your thoughts on if it may be prop, or need a shaft alignment, or ????
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 9:49pm
Dan,
Regarding the vibration, my first thought would be the prop or a bent prop shaft.

Where are you shopping for the lumber for that new deck? If it's the Rhinelander HD, see if I'm on duty when you are there. My primary department is plumbing but occasionally I fill in at the lumber/building materials depts.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 10:32pm
Originally posted by tryathlete tryathlete wrote:

I’d lubricate and clean the thing first: and clean all the connections. Setting the choke by advancing the throttle forward all the way and a pump or two is actually proper technique. When you turn the key on after that, if I recall correctly, within a few seconds the auto choke should move towards close based upon temp.

I’ve moved to fuel injection too long to remember all this stuff but there’s nothing wrong with setting it before you crank it. Popping neutral and advancing the throttle open should not be necessary if things are working properly (in my opinion).



I think you need to review how a Holley marine electric choke works.

There's no "setting" of the choke. You adjust the choke to get the appropriate gap between the choke blade and the air horn when it's cold and as soon as power is supplied to the heating element, it starts to open over the course of roughly the next minute or so. If you have the key in the RUN position with the engine off, the choke opens since you're supplying power to the element.

When you stop the engine, as the element cools off the choke starts closing eventually getting back to the cold position.

Pumping the throttle does nothing other than squirting some gas into the engine via the accelerator pump.

A car choke setup with a fast idle cam is probably what you're thinking of "setting" by pumping the gas pedal.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tryathlete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 10:38pm
Thank the lord for KENO to save me from myself. Thank you for the correct description of the actual operation of the choke!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 10:41pm
Originally posted by flyweed flyweed wrote:

Pete,

sorry..wasn't more clear....I MAY order a new choke, along with a full rebuild kit, to have on hand WHEN..not IF...these things need replacing. I know SkiDim sells that electric choke for almost $50, but you can pick up the exact same part on Ebay for $15.00 (Holley). If I have the parts on hand when I start to diagnose, if anything needs replacing I'll have it here on hand.


If you want to test the element you have now, disconnect the 2 wires and check it's resistance. It should be about 10 ohms plus or minus a little .

You could take the element off and put power to it and watch the bimetallic spring "unwind"
as it heats up for a physical check that it works.

It would be good to have a rebuild kit on hand too like you're thinking, whether it gets used now or later

Plenty of info on CCF about choke adjustments and plenty of disagreement about choke settings too . You've already seen some in this thread
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyweed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2019 at 11:23pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Dan,
Regarding the vibration, my first thought would be the prop or a bent prop shaft.

Where are you shopping for the lumber for that new deck? If it's the Rhinelander HD, see if I'm on duty when you are there. My primary department is plumbing but occasionally I fill in at the lumber/building materials depts.




Pete,

I will most definitely be getting my AC2 lumber for the deck over in Rhinelander...Cheaper than any place in Minocqua.   I'll have to message you or something when I am up there.

Dan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyweed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-02-2019 at 4:28pm
Hey guys. alright, I pulled the winter cover off today and opened up the old girl (93 SN)...I wanted to check both continuity and resistance on my old electric choke, as the end of last sesason I was suspecting it, for not great cold starts. Anyway, I took some pics to get your thoughts.

First I tested continuity (alarm style) and when I touched positive to positive on the choke and negative to negative on choke, NO SOUND..but when I touched positive on choke and another "ground" in the engine area I got sound.

Here's some pics:
Here is my carb and what it looks like when "cold" is the choke gap correct?


Here is the Ohms readout on the boats old choke:


Here is what the "readout" said when I did continuity, and there was NO "beep" sound:


Here is the brand new choke resistance:


Any thoughts here??

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phatsat67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-02-2019 at 4:45pm
Just leave the key on and see if it moves. No moves=put new choke puck in.

Or you can just jump 12v to the hot side with a jumper wire while leaving the ground connected.

Test your choke ground by connecting your meter to a positive supply source. No voltage = bad ground wire.

Looks like Sperry is branching out from just the boat shoe business.
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