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Guage Wiring... 99 Super Air

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Treybizttu View Drop Down
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    Posted: July-09-2019 at 12:56pm
Has anyone gone with a bus bar ground on their gauges as opposed to the daisy chain? My 99 super air has a few additional gauges (I bought it that way) along with Perfect Pass and this weekend PP started freaking out, then quit working, and so did the tach/hour meter. I believe it's a voltage drop/ grounding issue but i'm not 100% yet.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-09-2019 at 1:05pm
Yes.

PP is a decent current draw. May benefit from direct power from batt rather than wiring off the dash. Certainly without cleaning up and upsizing/adding additional power/ground to the dash.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Treybizttu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-11-2019 at 5:29pm
Ordered a mess of Stuff from Amazon: Wiring, Terminals, Bus Bars... Going to try and get it set up a little cleaner this weekend if I get some time.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyweed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-11-2019 at 7:31pm
Yep...ground buss bar behind the dash..and heavier ground wire run from the engine to the dash. Then separate grounds from each gauge to the buss bar.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-11-2019 at 7:53pm
Originally posted by flyweed flyweed wrote:

Yep...ground buss bar behind the dash..and heavier ground wire run from the engine to the dash. Then separate grounds from each gauge to the buss bar.

Yes on the upgrade for the ground but don't forget the + power up to the dash.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 2:08pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Originally posted by flyweed flyweed wrote:

Yep...ground buss bar behind the dash..and heavier ground wire run from the engine to the dash. Then separate grounds from each gauge to the buss bar.

Yes on the upgrade for the ground but don't forget the + power up to the dash.


Still looking at doing this. I get the ground part, but where is the + coming into the dash?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 2:14pm
Tim's diagram:



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 3:16pm
Nice thanks. Will any marine grounding block work or is there one you would recommend. Also, assuming 10ga wire for both going to the dash?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 3:25pm
Gary,
I'm not aware of marine specific terminal blocks. I don't feel the block would be as important as running marine rated wire and then using heat shrink adhesive lined crimp terminations. I'd be inclined to run heavier than 10. Have you figured out the amp load existing and potential future? Also, I always like to use the 3% voltage drop for wire sizing.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 3:38pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Gary,
I'm not aware of marine specific terminal blocks. I don't feel the block would be as important as running marine rated wire and then using heat shrink adhesive lined crimp terminations. I'd be inclined to run heavier than 10. Have you figured out the amp load existing and potential future? Also, I always like to use the 3% voltage drop for wire sizing.


I do not know existing load (No quite that savvy) but it is stock with Perfect Pass added. I have a stereo installed with a seperate battery for that and use the 2nd accessory switch to turn it on and off. With that info can you recommend gauge of wire. As always I appreciate any advice.

Thanks,

Gary
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 4:03pm
So from the diagram, I would start at the solenoid and go through engine and dash breakers to the dash with the + ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 4:17pm
Gary,
The hardest part is getting the wire up to the dash. Use the old to pull the new in. I'd run 8 ga. up there. I would go to the terminal block first and then go to the dash breakers. This eliminates the + daisy chaining too.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Treybizttu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 5:05pm
Originally posted by 91NaughtyQ 91NaughtyQ wrote:

Nice thanks. Will any marine grounding block work or is there one you would recommend. Also, assuming 10ga wire for both going to the dash?


I'm running 8GA from the battery and picked up a couple covered "Marine" Blue Sea Bus Bars.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertskier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 5:20pm
I just ran a second wire from the protected side of the 50Amp breaker on the engine to the dash ignition breaker input. Pretty sure it was 10 gauge. If you leave the existing wire and run the second one in parallel you should have plenty of current carrying capacity.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 6:18pm
Originally posted by Treybizttu Treybizttu wrote:

Originally posted by 91NaughtyQ 91NaughtyQ wrote:

Nice thanks. Will any marine grounding block work or is there one you would recommend. Also, assuming 10ga wire for both going to the dash?


I'm running 8GA from the battery and picked up a couple covered "Marine" Blue Sea Bus Bars.


Thanks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 6:20pm
Got it. Thanks a bunch. Going to take care of it this weekend. Been dealing with the chirps and stuff long enough.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote flyweed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 7:34pm
Pete helped me a TON when I ran new ground and Hot (+) wire to my dash. I ran 10 gauge both black and red from the engine compartment up to the Dash. I fished it through and it wasn't very hard.
Also, the grounding block I used, it's stainless, with a plastic cover that goes over all of it.

Bus Bar


Pic of new Ground in engine compartment:


New Hot and Ground wire coming out behind dash:

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2019 at 10:24pm
Awesome thanks. Yeah Pete has had input on every project I have worked on.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-13-2019 at 5:48pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Gary,
The hardest part is getting the wire up to the dash. Use the old to pull the new in. I'd run 8 ga. up there. I would go to the terminal block first and then go to the dash breakers. This eliminates the + daisy chaining too.


OKay so I went at this today and pretty much stopped immediately because what seemed to make sense on paper made absolute zero sense once I got into it. Can you help me with these questions-

my + and - go to the dash from the back via a harness - Where do I tap in for the HOT. In existing PIN slot and can you even do this?

New ground and terminal block - Do i just run it up after grouinding on engine and hook all NEG from the dash to it? If so what about existing ground coming from rear?

Don't know where to start with the dash daisy chain but assuming each - from each instrument would go to the block and no daisy chaining?

Anything I am missing?

Thanks for any help. The labor is the easy part, but the lack of understanding is stopping me.

Gary
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-13-2019 at 6:37pm
Gary,
For the +, a good place is:
Originally posted by desertskier desertskier wrote:

I just ran a second wire from the protected side of the 50Amp breaker .

Then for the -, a convenient spot on the block but, check to see where the - battery cable is hooked up to the block. That would be the absolute best spot.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-13-2019 at 6:44pm
If you try to tap into the existing harness, that will become the weak link in your new wiring.since the harness has smaller wiring that you'd be splicing into

Run the 2 wires back to the engine compartment and the ground can go to the engine right where the battery ground cable hooks up. as shown in Flyweed's picture

The positive could be attached to the output side of the main engine breaker so it's fuse protected like Desertskier did or alternately from any good 12 volt source back there and put a fuse in the line to protect it like others have mentioned.

Edit..............look at that me and Pete agreeing again   

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 5:14am
KENO - So last night I ran the new ground and terminal block as well as a parallel hot starting it on the "safe" side of the 50 amp breaker at the back (the same spot the original to the dash starts RED # 10 see diagram). I ended it at the dash tying in with the existing hot coming from the same spot. Is this correct for the hot wire coming from the 50?

I will be grounding the individual gauges etc.... today.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 5:52am
That works for me, It's what Desertskier did.

Hopefully you tied it back in at the upstream side of the 20 amp dash mounted ignition breaker like he did so that breaker is in the circuit too.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 7:14am
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

That works for me, It's what Desertskier did.

Hopefully you tied it back in at the upstream side of the 20 amp dash mounted ignition breaker like he did so that breaker is in the circuit too.



I tied in right there

Is this correct?

Thanks to you and everyone else for all the info.

Gary
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 10:44am
Originally posted by 91NaughtyQ 91NaughtyQ wrote:

Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

That works for me, It's what Desertskier did.

Hopefully you tied it back in at the upstream side of the 20 amp dash mounted ignition breaker like he did so that breaker is in the circuit too.



I tied in right there

Is this correct?

Thanks to you and everyone else for all the info.

Gary


I think so
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertskier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 11:27am
I also added a two pin connector at the dash for the new + and - so the dash pod could still be easily removed. Other than that it sounds like you wired it like mine. Also, before you connect the battery back up it is a good idea to take a meter and measure resistance between positive and negative to make sure you accidentally didn't short them together somewhere.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 11:29am
Thanks. I reread DesertSkier's post and that is exactly how he did it. Just got in off the water and two problems are cured from just adding the + wire. (Temp Gauge always reading high) and (low volts) I gained 2 volts on the volt meter. Hoping the grounds will take care of the chirps and other little aggravators.

Thanks again guys.

Gary
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 11:32am
Originally posted by desertskier desertskier wrote:

I also added a two pin connector at the dash for the new + and - so the dash pod could still be easily removed. Other than that it sounds like you wired it like mine. Also, before you connect the battery back up it is a good idea to take a meter and measure resistance between positive and negative to make sure you accidentally didn't short them together somewhere.


Would you possibly be able to post a pick of that? If so that would be great!

Gary
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertskier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 11:52am
I don't have a picture but it looked something like this:2 Pin connector
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-14-2019 at 12:06pm
I think I got it now. The two pin connector was installed to make removing the dash easier, but all this can be done with out it correct?

Gary
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