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acme prop 4 SN92

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Munday View Drop Down
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    Posted: May-25-2006 at 3:14pm
Ok I'm thinkin I would like to have a new acme prop.Acme web page only lists 4 blade for my boat and I think I'd rather have a 3 blade.
Anyone have some input?
I wrote them an e-mail but who knows if the person that answers back will actually know?
I trust you guys for the no BS answers.

Thanks Munday
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Slicer Al View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Slicer Al Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-25-2006 at 4:01pm
I am also thinking of an acme four blade prop. From what I have been told, You will loose about one m.p.h. on top end, have more out of the hole thrust, and a smaller wake.

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Martinique87 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Martinique87 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-25-2006 at 8:20pm
Add me to the list of those thinking about a 4 blade prop. I recently bought an amce 542 and it performs well but the wake crests too much and I wondering if a four blade prop would elimite that.
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TRBenj View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-25-2006 at 10:11pm
Munday, if you wrote to Acme you can expect a response from Bill Weeks. He really knows his stuff. I corresponded with him for a while about my prop selection. On his recommendation, I went with a 3-blade. For whatever reason, Acme's website is not up to date. A better reference is Delta Propellor. They give better pricing than Acme will directly (they protect their distributors). Make sure you use the PlanetNautique discount code (PNACME06, I believe) for 5% off. I got my prop for $304 shipped.

As far as performance goes, I am very happy with mine. I got the #470, which is a 12.5"x15" 3-blade. Coming from an OJ 4-blade, I picked up some smoothness and about 200 RPM. Holeshot is stronger as well, and you can really feel the prop bite in corners- even hard ones. FYI, Bill said the #470 would outperform the #422 (12.5"x15.5" 4-blade) on our boats. The props would be comparable out of the hole, but the 470 would have ~1 MPH advantage in top speed and would produce a better ski wake. Both props have the same amount of surface area, which is impressive for the 3-blade... its truly massive looking!

My motor is stock (for now) with the exception of a DUI distributor. I turn ~4600+ RPM, so if you have a ProBoss motor you may be pushing close to 5k RPM with this prop due to the lower pitch. I think thats perfectly fine with the 351w though, as I have some upgrades planned that should put me in that range as well.

A must-have upgrade in my opinion!
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Munday View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Munday Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 12:07am
Thanks TRBenj

Thats the kind of response I needed,Glad there is a 3 blade for our boats.Mine is mostly stock mild cam up grade after it went flat,I didn't want to give up any idle quality so its pretty mild for me I tend to go the other way but its just a family time boat.My buddy has a sister 92SN and mine would always out run his,but now he has a very low hour 94 haven't seen him out yet sure would be sweet if ole red would show her heels to his newwer one too.
and he hasn't seen mine with new cam seems stronger but forgot gps last weekend but by speedos its maybe 1.5 mph faster than last year and couple hundred rpm.

Good luck Munday
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p/allen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote p/allen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 12:51am
There is a 4 blade prop called ambush on ebay .13 16 rh
1 inch $20.00 item # 4643716794
it's called an ambush .Run 1 time
Pat
My 72 Skier
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TRBenj View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 8:39am
Originally posted by p/allen p/allen wrote:

There is a 4 blade prop called ambush on ebay .13 16 rh
1 inch $20.00 item # 4643716794
it's called an ambush .Run 1 time


For a spare prop, you sure cant beat that for $20. Theres no way it will come close to the performance of an Acme though.

Munday, I have questions concerning your cam install. Ive got some upgrades planned for this year that include GT40P heads and a new intake manifold. While I have everything apart, I would like to put a new cam in as well. Picking a cam is one thing, but installing it is another. While my father and I are mechanically inclined, neither of us have installed a cam before. Any tips you can provide would be much appreciated! Ive found a few general procedures on the net, but any insight you have on our boats and 351w in particular would be very helpful. One thing my dad thought of today: does the pylon need to come out to put the cam in?

Out of curiousity, is your boat in the diaries? I didnt see a red '92 that matched your name. Id love to see a pic!

Enough questions for now, Im off to the lake!

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Riley View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 8:50am
I just switched from a 13x13 OJ Legend 3 blade to a 13x12 Acme 3 blade. Big improvement. Much less vibration, much better out of the hole, same top end. Well worth spending the money.
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79nautique View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 9:34am
tim you will need to remove the pylon if you are changing the cam with the engine in the boat. If the engine has a lot of hours then you may want to wait until you need to re-build the engine for the cam up grade. The reason is the cam bearings being worn out and need to be replaced. The main thing installing a new cam is that you do not scratch the cam bearings during install. Take your time and insert the cam slowly and be sure to use the lube supplied with the cam on all bearing surfaces and cam lobes. Also use new lifters and check the push rods and make sure none are bent before reusing them. You will want to clean them up and make sure that the oil passage is clean as well.
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Munday View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Munday Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 10:15am
Just like 79 said Tim,I put a long bolt in end of cam for leverage work it in nice and easy.I have always used comp cams I'm sure others are just as good.I always degree them to check manufacturs accuracy but have never found a comp cam off more than half a degree.My boat had over 900 hours on it,I didn't figure out it was the cam giving me trouble till this spring,so I just fed her a new cam but a rebuild is surely in her future.Also comp sent a sheet talking about how oil these days has been robbed of much of its high load additives I was running mobile 1 which I have for along time now I'm running mystic with lucas added myself,no diary pics yet I'll take some shots this weekend.Cya guys be safe this weekend and every other for that matter.....

Munday gone to lake cyaaaaaa
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David F View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David F Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 12:12pm
Munday:

I just got off the phone with an engine rebuilder about 10 minutes ago. My father-in-law blew his truck engine, so we went the cheap route and installed a rebuilt unit from my local favorite machine shop ($700.00 long block). Installe the engine and during the 20 minute cam break-in period, the camshaft failed! I mean it failed, wiped out the lobes. So, machine shop gave us a new engine that I assembled last night.

So, I spoke in length with the shop on why they think the cam failed. He said, no really knows, but it happens to about 3-4 of their engines each year. He said Crane Cams has/had a form letter that says trash in the engine causes it...our take is no way because the cam is lubricated by splashing from the crankshaft, not via oil passages. Then he said that new oils no longer have the anti-friciton modifiers/additives they once had because most engines now a days have roller/low friction lifters! So, he thinks this can be part of the problem.

So, I am going to add special break-in additives to the oil to help mitigate the possiblity of camshaft failure. It was not pretty, essentially destroyed the entire engine! Metal paste was globbed everywhere when we tore down the engine. Uggggly!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David F Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 12:24pm
Original topic was about props...sorry.

A bit less than a year ago, ACME recommended the #422 for my '93 SN (which I am runnign with satisfactory results). I was told that a suitable 3-blade (ACME) was not available for my boat. Maybe things have changed since then.
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Darrel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darrel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2006 at 7:58pm
I also bought the #422 for my 95SN. ACME said the 3 blade was still close to a year away but was going to be better than their 4 blade. I didnt want to wait. 4 blade is smoother than the OJ 3 blade, maybe lost 1 mph at WOT. Feels a little quicker out of the hole. The OJ is now the back up.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-27-2006 at 5:00pm
Just a few quick comments before I run back to the lake:

Munday and '79, thanks for the info on the cam. A full rebuild is in the motor's future, but probably several (~5) years away. It has 1160 hrs on it, but it runs way too good to tear it down now. In the meantime, Im adding heads and an intake. While its torn down that far, do you think its worthwhile to put in a cam? I know it would make the most out of the better flowing parts. I knew I would need new lifters- any other parts that should be done at the same time?

My dad and I went out yesterday to set my speedos. Afterwards, I did a few quick runs against his '03 196 with the 330 Excalibur (and stock Acme #422 4-blade). The boats were dead even out of the hole, though he walked away at 35+ MPH and had a good 4 MPH more top end. I have to say that this #470 prop is great.
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79nautique View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-28-2006 at 9:08am
since your tearing it down that much you mize will spend the other 150 bucks and get the cam. you will also want to rejet your carb about three sizes larger.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-28-2006 at 9:55am
79, thats what I was thinking. I will look into a new cam and lifters.

What jet size would be ideal considering these mods? Im not sure what I have on there now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-28-2006 at 10:11am
Anyone can blab you a number you seek, but jetting is a process. Jets are chosen on performance and plug readings or A/F ratio from a ox sensor, (which is hard for boats to do). Every sceanio is different and even if someone have the same parts as you you would be doing yourself a disservice using their setup. Optimum perforance is just a step or two from disaster and you don't want to use someone elses numbers, they may have entirely different PVCO diameters and you use their jet numbers and frag your engine.

Just get gaskets, a bunch of fresh plugs, and some jets +/- what you have in there.

79's advice regarding the jets is , safe.

If your going into the carb anyway, might as well optimize it, no?

This is not optional, don't think its safer to do nothing to the carb; changing cams you will likely be too lean now and cause more harm than good leaving things as is.
"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-28-2006 at 10:54pm
you'll need a number set of drills to figure out what jet size is currently in it now, Don't trust the number stamped on the jet. It took me three or four different tries before I was happy. It all depends on your skill level and knowing when the carb's to rich off idle. You cannot tell if the jets are to large at idle. So I would change the heads and do the up grades, adjust the idle mixture screws and get everything running good before you try missing with the jets. Running it lean for a short period of time isn't going to hurt the engine just don't spend the day on the water doing your normal gig until you get it jetted right or you will burn a valve and/or piston then your back to square one.
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