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Winterizing problems with 69 Mustang?

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Big Jim Slade View Drop Down
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    Posted: October-11-2006 at 2:50pm
Attention all "do it yourself" experts. I spent yesterday getting the boat ready for winter hibernation (or so I thought). The procedure I followed came straight from my original 302/351 owners manual (pages 29-32). My first hiccup came at step d. This step outlines pouring NUCLE.OIL (??) into the carb until it stalls. First off, I got a spray marine fogging oil. Step d has a warning in BOLD LETTERS saying this: GREAT CARE SHOULD BE TAKEN NOT TO INTRODUCE OIL TOO RAPIDLY. HYDROSTATIC LOCKING COULD OCCUR WHICH WOULD SERIOUSLY DAMAGE THE ENGINE. After reading this, I was concerned that my limited experience (first do it myself winterizing) might keep me from knowing how fast was too fast. I tried spraying this fogging oil into the carb very scientifically. A little at first, increasing the amount slowly as I went. No matter what I did, I couldn’t get the engine to stall by spraying this into the carb. What am I missing?
     Next problem (the big one) came at step h (and relates to step h & k). Step h outlines removing a plug from the elbow between the thermostat housing and the circulation pump (facing straight down in the picture). Problem here is that my boat (and it’s configuration) doesn’t look anything like the picture in the manual. On my boat, the fresh water intake comes in/up on the port side. After pa$$ing through the transmission cooler, the plumbing connects it to the bottom of the water pump. Once the fresh water enters the water pump and pa$$es through the impeller, it exits out the bottom on the other side. In other words, both the input and output face straight down. The “plug” to remove is on top and faces straight up. It’s easy to remove, but nothing comes out (obviously). This minor issue will mean more when step k comes into play.
     Step k starts by saying; remove the hose from the upper connection on the raw water supply pump. I would surmise this is the “out” from the water pump. Regardless, I DON’T HAVE AN UPPER, THEY BOTH FACE DOWN.      Step k relates to getting coolant into the block (pretty sure). Regardless of what side I disconnect from the water pump, coolant has nowhere to go. If I pour coolant into the input side (useless I know) of the water pump, it flows back towards the transmission cooler and out onto the ground through the inlet on the bottom of the boat (serving no purpose). If I pour coolant into the output side, it starts to fill the plumbing running up to the inlet to the block, but without the pressure from the water pump/impeller, it just overflows back out (again serving no purpose). Since my boat seems to be quite different, I’m now trying to figure out how to make this happen. The only idea I have might be to try getting coolant into the block through the two copper drain plugs in the block itself. Anyone who might be able to add some illumination this situation (good rhyme), please let me know.      
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joed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote joed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-11-2006 at 3:22pm
Others more experienced may have better advice... but one solution for the coolant issue would be to disconnect your inlet hose at the hull fitting. Then fit a length of hose to that that runs into a bucket of coolant... then suck the coolant thru the system that way. Just be sure that you warm up the engine first so that your thermostat is open. I would think that would work for you.

Hope that helps.

Joe
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Big Jim Slade View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Jim Slade Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-11-2006 at 3:34pm
You’re thinking along the same lines as I am joed. According to the Pleasurecraft instructions, at this point fuel line is shut off, carb has been fogged (until engine stalls), plugs have been removed and fogging oil has been sprayed into each cylinder, manifold drains are open, drain plug at the elbow joint (the one I don't have) is still open. To do what you propose, many of the previous steps would need to be un-done.
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TRBenj View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-11-2006 at 3:42pm
Jim,

You will want to pour antifreeze down the output hose of the RWP. My guess is that youre struggling because the hose is so low. I would say to find a way to raise the height of that hose (extend it up) so gravity will do its thing.

You must have an earlier 302 with that pump set up. Im sure there are others here with similar motors who have figured out a good way to winterize.
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Big Jim Slade View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Jim Slade Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-11-2006 at 4:08pm
I'm with you. All these hose sections are so short; I almost need a dedicated (longer) hose for winterizing that I can connect right to the upper inlet on the block. Another issue is that all these hoses are right behind the belts, so access is a complete pain.
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Tim D View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tim D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-11-2006 at 7:45pm
Just warming up the engine wont do it. You must recycle the antifreeze mix until it steams, then you know it's in the block. When the thermostat opens, it's not going to stay open very long. So warming up the boat, then disconnecting the raw pump and sticking a hose in a bucket and drawing it up isn't going to do it. Most will be pumped right out the exhaust. I recycle the mix until I see steaming antifreeze and I watch the temp gauge for a slight raise in temperature. I don't use alot of water because it will mix with water already in the block. I take the carb off and dump the gas out and mist down the inside with WD40. You must have the old sherwood pump like this one.
Tim D
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-11-2006 at 11:25pm
Big Jim Slade. Big Jim Slade. Big Jim Slade. I like the sound of that.
Mullet Free since 93
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eric lavine View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-12-2006 at 8:00am
i dont remember the set-up but i remember in the early days of pulling the thremostat out and pouring anti freeze thru there, nowadays im not to worried about the antifreeze because if you do a good job draining the block YOU wont have a problem, the only people who have problems with cracking are the guys who dont bother winterizing at all. i go by four main drains 2 block 2 manifold drains. the main reason for anti freeze is for block protection, as in corrosion
"the things you own will start to own you"
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Big Jim Slade View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Jim Slade Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-12-2006 at 1:04pm
Thanks for the info people. That's the pump Tim. I'm definitely glad I "called in sick" on Tuesday to Winterize the boat. Although I didn't get everything done (see above), the block was drained and the timing couldn't be better. Minneapolis's actual temp today is 25 (it was 80 on Oct 2nd). Including the wind-chill, it's 13. By the way (The Dude), my Big Jim Slade name (actual boat name) comes from The Kentucky Fried Movie. The Big Lebowski’s not a bad movie either.
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63 Skier View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-12-2006 at 4:40pm
Hi Big Jim, since others have helped out with the coolant (and I just drain the engine and don't fill with coolant), I thought I'd comment on the fogging. In years past instead of fogging oil people just used light motor oil. I still use motor oil to this day, I figure for over 40 years my boat has started right up in the spring so why change now. I believe fogging oil is just lighter and may have some other additives to make it "stick" longer, not sure.

Anyway, by pouring oil down the carb I can stall my engine when I fog it, but I prefer to pour it slowly until it labors and begins to smoke, then I shut it down. The hydrostatic lock mentioned in the manual would occur if too much oil was sucked into a cylinder leaving no room for air, the oil couldn't be compressed on up stroke and damage would occur. You'd have to pour pretty fast for this to happen, and I don't think it could ever happen with a sprayed in oil.

Bottom line - if you've sprayed a good quantity of fogging oil into the engine, OK to shut it down, you've coated the surfaces with oil.

I hope this helps for the future.
'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Busted Knuckle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-13-2006 at 6:57pm
your spray in fogging oil is fine

I figure it this way

if the engine can suck the water out of the lake why can't is suck it out of a bucket?

put some fuel stabilizer in the fuel during last lake run

extend a hose were needed and run it temp
on bucket with a garden hose feeding it

the only reason the engine needs to be hot is help the oil drain when changing it , oil does flow too fast under 100 degrees
with the oil change out of the way
drain the water from the block and exhaust manifolds
once it stops dripping tighten itall back up

remove the t-stat

run the engine on the bucket again
using your anitfreeze solution
start the fogging spray witha gallon or so to go , leave it wet , meaning don't drain the antifeeze , if you used the right kind ( not RV) it will have rust inhibitors in it.

you can loosen a plug here or there and test the fluid for piece of mind.

some say to remove the impeller , easy enough to remove so take it out the rubber will take a set over the winter, and will get brittle with age

good luck

BKG
Volante Barefoot Skier built by American Skier Boats -
www.footngear.com
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