How is Delta Prop with CNC repairs?
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Category: General Correct Craft Discussion
Forum Name: General Discussion
Forum Discription: Anything Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=24009
Printed Date: April-28-2024 at 4:58pm
Topic: How is Delta Prop with CNC repairs?
Posted By: M3Fan
Subject: How is Delta Prop with CNC repairs?
Date Posted: October-31-2011 at 6:11pm
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Just curious. I'm doing a from-the-coupler-back drivetrain refresh next spring and want to send my 422 in for a tune-up. Any recent experiences with Delta on CNC prop repair/tune-ups? ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Replies:
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: October-31-2011 at 6:22pm
| I've sent 3 props to Delta to be repaired, one which was a CNC, and have been happy with both their price and quality of work. |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: October-31-2011 at 6:34pm
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I haven't used delta, but I used ACME at the end of the season. They were quick and the prop came back looking good.. couldnt tell how it ran out though cause using the very large pitch backup prop was not well received by the motor. I figured going back to the source couldnt hurt. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: jimsport93
Date Posted: October-31-2011 at 8:33pm
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Joel, had a freind of mine mangle my 422 back in '09 (along with the strut and the shaft). Sent the prop to Delta. Got it back in a week. Been running it ever since with no problems. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2798 - 93 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: GlassSeeker
Date Posted: October-31-2011 at 9:34pm
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Delta Prop in Lodi CA? ------------- This is the life |
Posted By: 86BFN
Date Posted: November-01-2011 at 12:19pm
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Delta Propeller Co. in Cleves, OH (Cincinnati)(also a site sponsor) is the source for ACME, OJ and Michigan Wheel props for your Correct Craft. Use Coupon Code DP5CCF08 to receive an exclusive discount.
I've used them with good luck, but it was not a CNC prop. ------------- 👣 Steve http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4057&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1986&yrend=1986" rel="nofollow - 86 Barefoot Nautique 89 Martinique Former Owner: 93 Hydrodyne 350 MAG |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: November-02-2011 at 1:08am
Haven't had the same luck. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
JoeinNY wrote:Posted By: WAKE-up
Date Posted: November-02-2011 at 12:12pm
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i have used 2x- 1 for 542 that had some edge rash tried file 1st but little vibration remained sent to delta 109$ later runs clean and true
bought used 612 for short $ on ski it again had sent direct to delta for tune up before i ever saw not sure why rpm stayed same at wot as 470 on 99 sport w/ gt40 but i do get 1mph+ didn't have orig 612 baseline to compare pre repair was told ccf discount *only applied to new prop purchases* have a couple of other props that i would send there before any where else particularly when local shop i contacted wanted $140 for repair to 13x16 oj though he did indicate that it would be shined up real nice -polish this as i'll send to delta ------------- paul |
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: November-02-2011 at 6:59pm
| Paul, was that NE Propeller? That's who I used to use. They do a great job, but they aren't even close on price. |
Posted By: RainDog
Date Posted: November-02-2011 at 11:44pm
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Joel,
While I hate to bash a sponsor, I wasn't happy with Delta. I sent the prop from the SAN in to Delta to get fixed. It came back an entirely different prop. Lost 9 mph on top end and hit the rev limiter at 3/4 throttle. I used a local guy for my 2nd prop for the SAN who specializes in off shore racing custom props and is an ACME dealer. Now I lost 800 rpm at WOT and 5 mph from peak. The only thing I can try next is to send them to ACME to get them fixed or maybe swapped for new. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1868&sort=&pagenum=1 - 62 Classic http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5242&sort=&pagenum=1 - 2002 Super Air |
Posted By: WAKE-up
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 1:01am
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bruce that was in fact NE prop, was working nearby and thought i'd drop off gps couldn't find the place- works out of small garage behind a bldg, low overhead and still looking for 2x the price?
for all the touts of cnc accuracy strange how "same" prop will generate different results on others "same " boat-model, driveline ------------- paul |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 2:05am
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The last prop I sent to Acme came back with some odd vibes/harmonics. Sent it back again and it came back again the same way. So, that option is out. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 11:05am
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I had one Acme repaired by a shop up in NH... Accu- something? Fancy measuring equipment, etc. Prop worked great, but the repair wasnt cheap ($140ish). The last prop I had reworked was done by Acme and it came back just fine... no strange vibrations and pushed the BFN as fast as it had ever gone. Seems like its luck of the draw sometimes?
As I understand it, the Acmes (and maybe all modern CNC props) require special pitch blocks. If a shop has them, they should be able to repair a CNC prop as good as a hand finished one. Otherwise, there is nothing special about a CNC prop repair- the tools and methods are the same for all props. ------------- |
Posted By: skutsch
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 4:59pm
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Joel, ACME outsources the repair of their props. Tim is correct on the special blocks, there are actually only 8 (or maybe 9 guys) in the US that have (made the investment in) the blocks. One of those guys is right here in Racine. Unfortunately, I have had to have both my ACME 422 props repaired. The guy does a great job, cost is about $180 both props have come back and worked very well. If you want I can pick your prop up in Schaumburg and drop it off. Just let me know. ------------- Our http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4669" rel="nofollow - 98 Sport Nautique My Dad's 63 Ski N |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 5:01pm
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Sent it off to Delta. There was nothing wrong with the prop, really- but I figured I'm replacing the DS/Coupling and strut bushings in the spring so I may as well have the prop tuned up.
So, if Delta is listening here- there is a nice 422 headed your way from the greater Chicago metropolitan area and I'm SURE you'll do a great job so I have no worries! [cough, cough, nudge nudge] 
DAMN Steve. Missed your post by minutes. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 6:06pm
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http://www.foxlakeprop.com/services.htm - Fox Lake Prop, now in Spring Grove
"We are equipped with a large variety of different pitch blocks, which enables us to repair all types of propellers, even ACME props." Jim has a winter discount, really cool guy too. He can weld anything, and build you a cool suit of armour. ------------- |
Posted By: GlassSeeker
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 6:08pm
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Delta Propeller in Lodi CA has the Acme blocks and my friends boat shop has sent 40 or 50 props for repair and has no complaints. I just had my new Acme fixed there. I had just got the new prop and on the second time out hit something that bent the rudder and bent all three blades without leaving a mark on the prop, the guy at Delta put it on the balancer and it swung heavy on one of the blades which had no grind mark- meaning it had not been balanced by Acme correctly in the first place- then he put it on the blocks and the blades were about an inch off- I had it back better than new in 3 more days. ------------- This is the life |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 7:10pm
Great. Another late but helpful post. Keep em' coming guys  ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 7:29pm
[whisper]Waste of money! Next time youve got $100 burning a hole in your pocket, send it to me![/whisper] Hows that for helpful?
In all seriousness, I would think that having a prop repaired (ie, whaled on with a hammer) would take more life out of it than continued use. Next time, unless you have some sort of damage that you need to have fixed, dont bother getting it "tuned up". ------------- |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 8:10pm
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I have a hard time believing a prop can push 2500 lbs+ through the water for 5 years, 350hrs and still be the exact same shape it was out of the box.
We've had lots of idle-speed hits on old stumps, etc., but nothing that noticeably dinged the prop. I figure if I'm putting 500.00 into the drivetrain I'll do the hundo on the actual thing that makes the boat move in the water. Ass. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: November-03-2011 at 9:30pm
Joel, We still need to meet up "up north". When it does happen and you come by, bring your extra cash with you. I'd be more than happy to relieve you of that burden. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: November-15-2011 at 5:37pm
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For the skeptics out there, they just finished with the prop and it was definitely not in spec when they got it. So, either I'm being lied to by them or my suspicion that a prop might not be perfect even though it looks "OK" to the naked eye has been confirmed. Maybe this extremely precise, thin metal thing that moves my boat through the water pulling course skiers for 6 seasons might have needed some beating around with some hammers. Maybe I haven't "wasted" my money? What a concept? Time will tell, of course, if I've once again foolishly done worthless preventative or over the top maintenance- something I know is rare for this group of CC fans.
Eager to try it next spring. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: November-15-2011 at 6:20pm
Joel, this was the part that I disagreed with.^^^
This on the other hand, is a different story. Any strike is likely to do *some* damage, and sometimes you cant see it with the naked eye.
A statement like this needs to be quantified... what is the "spec", what was "out" and by how much? Were they measuring to ISO 484/2? Class I? ------------- |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: November-15-2011 at 6:59pm
I certainly can't argue 100% either way as far as general prop use causing metal deformation to some degree over time without a more solid understanding of the physics at play. Is it physically possible for a prop to change shape at all from hard use? If not, that's all I need to be convinced as I'm no engineer by trade. If nothing else it's an interesting topic. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: November-15-2011 at 7:06pm
| I remember one of the arguments for SS props when they came out in the '90's was that they did not flex under a load. If Nibral props actually flex, wouldn't that not only cause the prop to change shape, but to also weaken? |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: November-15-2011 at 7:51pm
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If the prop actually permanently changed shape no matter how little, ie underwent permanent deformation as a result of standard usage then it would not last very long. The fatigue loading force needs to be far away from the amount of force that would cause permanent deformation if you want to be far enough down the S-N curve for it to approach a limit. Considering the number of stress concentrations left by the machining process, I am going to assume the loading is in fact low enough relative to yield strength that the engineers considered the effects of the stress concentrations trivial and fatigue not a relevant factor over the expected life.
In non engineer speak take your paper clip flex it back and forth a few thousand times.. no problem if you never flex it enough to bend it permanently. But if you do bend it permanently no matter how little it will break within relatively few cycles. Long term material creep changing the shape I deem not likely although theoretically possible... not likely due to the low temperature of use and the fact that the loads are not steady nor of considerable duration and the material is not particularly susceptible to creep. Now the prop might start to flex easier over the years due to any residual work hardening effects slowly dissipating over time, but I would submit with a CNC prop there would not have been considerable work hardening to begin with. Either way you are not likely to get enough work hardening from someone hitting it against the block to make the rework effective at restoring any youthful vigor So to this engineer anyway … no way I would have anyone take a hammer to anything that hadn’t already hit something harder than the water at some point. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: November-15-2011 at 8:31pm
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Joe, great explanation. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: November-22-2011 at 5:00pm
| Joe, good explanation. The nibral props seem to last forever and the SS props that came out in the 90's actually had failing issues, so perhaps a little flexability is a good thing? |