Velvet dip stick
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Engine Repair
Forum Discription: Engine problems and solutions
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=47220
Printed Date: April-27-2024 at 1:55am
Topic: Velvet dip stick
Posted By: jterr
Subject: Velvet dip stick
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 12:10pm
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Any suggestions on how to fix the dipstick rubber on the transmission? After seeing the price of $50-$125 for a replacement, thought I would try and fix. Will post a pic later when I go back to barn. 
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Replies:
Posted By: illiniball2000
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 12:22pm
Go to your local hardware store and get an expanding plug for a couple bucks, then keep your dipstick for when you need to check the level. ------------- Beer is my friend 87 Dominique Had 67 Starflite |
Posted By: phatsat67
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 12:42pm
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Could also probably just swap the rubber from the new expandable plug onto the existing dipstick. The title of this thread sounds very inappropriate. |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 1:01pm
I was thinking similar, went straight to the gutter ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
phatsat67 wrote:Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 1:15pm
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Thanks all easy fix. Sorry for the inappropriate Post Title 
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Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 3:52pm
This tells me that Zach has never tried to get the rubber off his dipstick and put a new one on. Sounds kinda kinky  On a B/W like Jterr's picture you'll be cutting it apart and having to make new pieces. |
Posted By: phatsat67
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 4:23pm
| Didn't look at the photo. Figured the stick was welded onto the bottom. |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 6:09pm
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Wasn’t velvet dipstick Quinners college nickname ? ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 6:46pm
 ------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 9:17pm
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One on eBay right now 36.50 + 2.00 shipping ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-26-2019 at 9:42pm
Good idea and then just use the old worn out plug when you what to check the fluid level. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 9:27am
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jterr's post reminded me that I had a dipstick that looked just like his that I'd been meaning to fix so that turned into a small project yesterday. I used stuff that was in the garage, but if I went to the store, it might add up to 5 dollars or so. I had to cut the shaft on the old one, then tossed everything but the cover that the shaft ran through. I used a 5/16-18 stainless bolt 6 inches long and cut the head off and extended the threads so the threaded area was 1 5/8 inches. Then after a little guesswork and measuring I cut the shaft to 5 1/4 inches in length. Also had a stainless wing nut and a stainless t nut that i had to grind down a little to be about the same OD as the hunk of rubber hose that would be the "new" seal. Speaking of the new seal, it was a piece of 1/2 inch oil cooler hose with an OD of about 3/4 of an inch. I cut it about 7/8 inch long. A nut and a couple of washers pretty much rounded out the parts used. Slapped it all together and it works as good as an original B/W dipstick. The wing nut and the hex nut are just double nutted and provided for a little adjustment of how much you have to turn the wing nut to get a tight seal. I do have to go to the hardware store and get a stainless nut though 'cause the regular steel one under the wingnut will just drive me crazy if I don't replace it. Then I'll either tack weld the wing nut to the shaft or use some red loctite to keep it from coming apart accidentally. No fancy tools needed, the 5/16-18 die being the fanciest. Otherwise something to cut the bolt and trim the T nut. I used my favorite "precision machining tool.".........a 4 1/2 inch angle grinder I'm sure there are variations on how this could be done but this worked for me. If somebody else is thinking of doing this, measure yours first in case you have a different length dipstick and adjust your dimensions as necessary. The pictures will give an idea how it all went together and a comparison to an original dipstick.      |
Posted By: phatsat67
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 10:43am
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Nice work Ken. Side business charging half what PCM charges? ha The new sticks are a round aluminum notched piece so yours looks closer besides the wing nut. |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 11:01am
| Nice. Any way you could have kept the old handle so that it looked the same from the outside? |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 11:17am
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Did you check the compatibility of the different stainless steel parts?? Neoprene vs. rubber hose?? Assuming you used stainless steel welding rod also. Oh yes, what grade rod. Was it American Welding Society approved material. Do you have the MSDS sheets on file?? Hope it all went thru quality control and that you performed the necessary stress testing. The grinding wheel could have contaminated the stainless steel if you had previously used it on mild steel or another material. These are all things that should be considered since you are a non degree'd hack.  BTW, Nice job and thoughtful engineering. ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: phatsat67
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 11:37am
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The original style handle looks like a stamped piece that is welded to the end of the threaded rod for the stick. Even a round T would look pretty good tack welded to the rod end. Or drill a hole/thread and counter sink a retainer screw to hold it to the rod. Below is what the new style looks like. 
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Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 2:27pm
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I have one of those new ones Zack , real easy to read and kinda what gave me the idea for the homegrown one. As for you Duane..............you should know I took absolutely none of that into account and just whipped this thing together Call this the prototype that you could use to make a good looking dipstick and sell them to people. Kinda like Mike with all the numbers after his name at GT40 ECM .com you could start your own outfit and call it B/W Dipstick.com or something like that. You better hurry though, Mikey may jump all over this idea. By the way, I got my stainless steel nuts this morning I still have all the old parts so maybe there will be another version coming along
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Posted By: phatsat67
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 3:01pm
| Thevelvetdipstick.com |
Posted By: 75 Tique
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 3:14pm
ACBS deductions -1 - non original part -4 - piss poor attitude ------------- _____________ “So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 6:27pm
Nice work Ken. Great on the engineering skills.  ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 8:33pm
Aw shucks Pete, just some of that backyard engineering that can come in handy at times. If I can find the right size freeze, core,casting, expansion plug (or something along those lines) then the whole thing could be built without needing any parts from an old one. I'll have to do some measuring in the morning |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-27-2019 at 8:57pm
Ken, I think Brian's idea (in his post above and I quoted) of starting with on off the shelf expansion plug could be used. https://www.mcmaster.com/expansion-test-plugs" rel="nofollow - McMaster lists T handled plugs in 1/2" all the way to 4". The center "draw" bolt could be changed out like you did with the one you built. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: February-28-2019 at 9:06am
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I think that would work too or also instead of the cup shaped top a fender washer could be substituted and would work but look a little funnier. I'm gonna weld the original handle to a nut to take the place of the wingnut and see how that looks. It would still be able to be disassembled to replace the rubber if necessary. |
Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: February-28-2019 at 9:35am
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...Alll over a dip stick. ------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: February-28-2019 at 10:49am
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Two words - cold out😲 ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-28-2019 at 11:05am
And to make Timmy happy: ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: February-28-2019 at 7:49pm
Tim and Zach Ignoring the peanut gallery and their "amusing" comments I figured I'd see what I could do to make it look reasonably normal and still be able to be taken apart It's a little taller than the original (about 1/2 inch) but looks pretty good and it's a little easier to use. The handle was welded to a nut, put on the shaft and double nutted along with some red loctite, then a little crude machine work was done to make the hex nuts round A little silver paint and it's done Probably about 3 dollars in parts Duane would be proud.................maybe 
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Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: March-01-2019 at 12:20am
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Ken, If I were jterr I would have made you an offer by now! ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-01-2019 at 12:48am
Ken, You could work for me any day. Nice job  ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: rosconole
Date Posted: March-01-2019 at 3:23am
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I probably got a spare one. lol ------------- 1989 ski nautique ,1991 barefoot nautique, 1993 Mustang Cobra 1998 5.0 Magazine shootout invitee |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 12:12pm
Now that the dipstick has been resolved  Seeing as I have all this out of boat, should I rebuild the Velvet Drive? When I bought the boat I never had a chance to drive because stringers were so bad. I have looked for rebuild in forums but can't find, still not asking the right way I guess. Thoughts and Suggestions Thanks JT |
Posted By: wheedle
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 12:43pm
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If you have something to spin it with, you can test it. Keno has talked about using a pto off of a tractor. I have read this before, but have yet to rebuild mine. https://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=53874" rel="nofollow - https://www.mastercraft.com/teamtalk/showthread.php?t=53874 |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 12:53pm
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Very good info, think I will rebuild as I have it out of boat. Thanks |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 4:50pm
Why jump to conclusion that it needs rebuilt?? I think lake testing would be my choice. But first drain the fluid out and look for debris. If it does not show a lot of metallic particles and or chunks then chances are good that it is OK. Rebuilds are not the easiest thing to do. Get a manual and review it. There is a video on Master Craft forum that is very helpful also. Some special tools and an arbor type press are needed for the clutch pack. Seals and gaskets don't constitute a rebuild.. One of our senior members was going to report back to me what a "full rebuild" consists of but I can't seem to find that post. Good luck ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 5:47pm
Motor and tranny are out of boat sitting in barn...... |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 5:50pm
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OK, I and others have rebuilt them. If you need assistance it is only a "post" away ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 6:35pm
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John, Good advice from Duane. Drain and pull the suction screen at the bottom of the case looking for debris. If it looks good, don't open it up. I have 54 years on a velvet at it still runs like new. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 7:41pm
Don't be too surprised if the screen is missing. Some have been tossed. ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 7:46pm
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Don't expect the price to be the same as this one was.  ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 8:38pm
Ok before I just start unbolting things , where is this drain plug and screen located
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Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 8:56pm
John, The screen will be behind the cooling line (hose) fitting towards the bottom of the case. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 9:10pm
Will check it tomorrow, if it warms up going down to 35 (WTF in Florida) tonight.   
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Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 9:32pm
Here in the link below is how a real backyard hack would test his transmission ,(partway down the first page). You can at least see that it spins in fwd and reverse and check pressures in fwd and reverse too with a couple of gauges. Duane, I see some words about what a rebuild is or isn't from that senior member you refer to in the same linked thread http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=42241" rel="nofollow - link |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-05-2019 at 9:39pm
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A little light reading from the reference section of CCF in the link Page 54 has strainer info If you have a 10-17, it's a later version of the 71C and most of the same info applies. You can find later manuals that also cover the 10-17 but not in the reference section of CCF http://www.correctcraftfan.com/Downloads/Velvet_Service_Manual.pdf" rel="nofollow - link |
Posted By: MrMcD
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 4:43am
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The tranny is like an automatic. Fiber Plates inside squeezed between Metal plates when you engage. There will be material in the oil. These are very durable tranny's and easy to repair when broken so I would vote for use it after installing new fluid. Run it a while and install new fluid again just to make sure it is clean and ready for long term use. I made the mistake of using my reverse as a brake in a panic stop and broke mine. the clutch plates fractured. It was not hard or expensive to fix it. I was 20 years younger then so maybe it would be heavier and harder to do now. ------------- |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 8:35am
But Mark, using reverse on a boat are the brakes. Is there another way to slow a boat? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 12:26pm
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Speaking of reverse... Is this a reverse rotation engine. I looked for a tag but I guess when the PO did all his crap to this engine took it off. It is a 351w PCM I'm guessing as it is painted a gold color???? Also while removing the alternator it wasn't hooked to anything , so it is probably wrong also....  |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 2:13pm
Take a pic of the prop. Or if it is an ACME prop then post the part # ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: MrMcD
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 2:17pm
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Pete, going to neutral probably would have been just as quick of a stop but I was rolling at 40mph coming around a blind curve in the river to find 4 boats coming at me head on, one jet boat cut hard right for some reason which put us on a collision course. I went for panic stop, avoided any collisions but scared the poop out of me. We avoided contact by about a foot, no more. My reverse at full throttle came from many years driving jet boats, the technique worked much better in them. Blew the clutches right apart in the velvet drive. I still had enough forward gear to make it back to the dock without reverse. Fixed it in one day in my garage. They are pretty tough. ------------- |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 2:21pm
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Guessing you only broke the reverse clutch disc and then it lost mesh. Should not hurt anything else. (other than your pride) ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 2:41pm
You could pull the plugs and distributor cap and turn the engine from the harmonic balancer bolt. From the front turn it CCW and if the rotor turns CCW you have a reverse rotation engine. That'll be a definite way to tell without having to make any assumptions |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 3:29pm
I think I make out a XX RH 13????
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Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 3:31pm
| Speaking of props, what is the difference in a 3 blade and a 4 blade (I have on my 79) |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 3:54pm
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1 ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: 75 Tique
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 4:33pm
Pete, I am guessing by context and how he said it, he wasnt braking for a nice gentle stop while idling into the dock. I get the sense it was a pretty quick 35 to 0 in 15 feet kind of stop. ------------- _____________ “So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 5:19pm
Was wondering if the 4 blade will work on the 83
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Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 6:14pm
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Well theoretically a one blade prop will “work” . What you need to ask what prop would be best for my boat and my use. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 8:19pm
Back to the tranny , I took this out  , it is just a metal tube no screen.Is the correct part to drain and check? If so I saw no debris in the fluid although ( drained it though a paper towel filter) it looked a little dark. That being the case might just keep as is and replace fluid and see how it runs once I get boat back. |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 8:41pm
Told ya so ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 8:52pm
| Where can I find that hose and fittings in picture? That fitting is rusted pretty bad and I can't get it to thread back down into the tranny, as it is binded up at the top of elbow. |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 9:44pm
Go to the link and it'll tell you length of each hose and where you can get them. I'm sure there are other places that are cheaper if you do some looking They might have the fitting or you could try ebasicpower.com http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41890" rel="nofollow - link Or you could go to Pete's plumbing department at Home Depot and probably find the fitting. It's just a pipe threaded reducing bushing |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 9:53pm
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I know I ain't too smart at times but I'm wonderin' how a fitting that is always submerged in oil got so rusty that you couldn't fit it over the tube?
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Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 9:55pm
| I'm sure I can get hydraulic lines in town ,but that fitting with the tube in it for the filter not sure. |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 9:57pm
No this is on the outside of trans, with the tube on it that holds the screen on the inside of tranny. Hope that make better sense. I went back and redid previous post to make it clearer... |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 10:08pm
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Clear as dirty transmission fluid How about a picture of the fitting with nothing else hooked to it? I could probably give you a B/W part number but would rather see what you're talking about to get it right |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-06-2019 at 11:22pm
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1 red - threaded part to lower tran where screen should be 2 blue - part of same fitting rusted 3 yellow - hose to cooler 
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Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 11:50am
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Update: Called Vince up at Discount Inboard Marine and he has what I need. Thanks JT |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 12:05pm
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Well that picture seems to tell me that the same guy that handled your wiring job akso dabbles in plumbing Here are a couple of pictures showing what the screen and associated parts look like. We'll call it a typical setup since they changed some over the years, but this came from a mid 80's 10-17.   You need the elbow fitting and depending on what the hoses you have are you may also need hoses to properly mate to the fitting. It's 3/8 male NPT on one end and 1/2 inch flare on the other. Like you said SkiDim has the parts They'll sell you some different fittings like part number 122611 and 122711 that will work or you can get their part number 122511 that works in place of the other 2 and is what Borg Warner used.. By the way, did you physically look in the hole to make sure the screen that slides over the tube isn't in there. They tend to stick in there and have to be pulled out or maybe like Duane said, somebody chucked it. |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 12:12pm
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By the way, it only seems fitting that if you're gonna ask for advice and then you call SkiDim or somewhere else, you should update the post with more than just saying you got parts Something for the next guy to refer to would be nice |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 1:02pm
John, Check the hose end size. It's may not be a JIC-7 but rather a JIC-8. A - 7 will have an OD of 11.5mm (.44") and a - 8 OD will be 12.7mm (.5") ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 5:21pm
Sorry wasn't trying to bypass y'all . I just couldn't find the name of that part, and I had talked to Vince before(Used to live right down the road). I didn't say I got the parts , I think it was they have them if needed. I went to Lowes and found what I think is the same brass fittings, will let you know after I go start working on it this afternoon. Thanks again, JT |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 5:23pm
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I will take a bright light and look in there for screen. Thanks Ken for reminding me.... JT |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 6:30pm
John, I highly doubt the Lowes fitting is correct. What you most likely got was a 45 degree flare fitting typically used on soft copper pipe for low pressure. JIC fittings or 37 degree and meant for high pressure. McMaster has them. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 6:32pm
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https://www.mcmaster.com/jic-fittings" rel="nofollow - JIC fittings at McMaster ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 6:33pm
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Sorry, double post ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 6:53pm
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John, I went to Lowes and my suspicion is correct.Don't even try to use it. Just because the threads fit, doesn't mean it's the correct fitting. Return it the next trip back to the store. https://www.lowes.com/pd/B-K-1-2-in-x-3-8-in-Threaded-Flare-x-MIP-Elbow-Fitting/1000157651" rel="nofollow - The Lowes fitting is a 45 degree flare ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 7:18pm
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10-4 on the lowes stuff, I think I might have saved all mine, except will replace the hoses for sure. And look what I found thanks to KENO suggesting I look in hole..... 
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Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 8:13pm
And for another suggestion I'll suggest that you talk to SkiDim about whether you have a need for a JIC 37 degree fitting like Pete thinks or whether the original hose takes an SAE 45 degree fitting I measured the angle of what was in the transmission and shown in the picture from earlier today and it's a 45 degree angle. mated to an original PCM hose with an Aeroquip tag complete with the PCM part number.. But I'd verify this just to be sure. Now whether Pete thinks that's right or not, that's a completely different story. |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 9:09pm
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John, Yes, as Ken mentions, do check and I suggest using the correct fitting. Mixing 37's and 45's is not sound practice and you could end up with a mess. I happened to find a trans Ken worked on where he mixed up the fittings back yard hacking. . I sure hope there's a couple quarts of ATF on board:  ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-07-2019 at 10:27pm
That's way beyond my capabilities Pete
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Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 8:53am
| Pretty sure I’ve used hardware store JIC fittings on my transmission. Obviously you shouldn’t mix types... but I’m with Ken- where did the notion that a special 37deg was needed come from? |
Posted By: phatsat67
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 10:37am
| I recall only ever seeing a 90 degree coming out of that port on Nautique installed BWs. |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 11:01am
Tim, What hardware store carries JIC 37 degree fittings? A JIC 37 degree fitting is NOT special but, they are common to hydraulics. Where did the "notion" of 45 degree fittings used on hydraulics come from? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 11:11am
We're all used to seeing a 90 degree fitting there Zach. The discussion is about the angle of the taper on the end of the fitting where the pen in the picture is pointing to. A 45 degree angle is commonly called an SAE fitting and a 37 (really 37.5) is a JIC or AN fitting.. The JIC is for high pressure hydraulics among other things. The SAE is for lower pressures. A B/W transmission is not exactly high pressure hydraulics in action The regulator in the transmission will keep pressure under 200 psi. Per the B/W installation manual cooler pressure is about 40 psi at 2000 rpm. That's going to the cooler not the higher pressure to the clutches Maybe with really cold fluid and about 6 thousand RPM you might see 250 ish to the clutches You could fill a book with info on fittings but generally with the JIC stuff they're made of stainless steel for the higher pressures involved along with better sealing ability due to the angle/amount of contact between the sealing surfaces. Generally is the key word since you can find either kind of fitting in a variety of different metals 
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Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 11:13am
Take that up with BW/PCM, not me! |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 11:15am
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Pete You have a B/W, why don't you go find that fitting and unscrew the hose and measure the angle. It's the same fitting over at the cooler, you can remove it without losing any fluid that way |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 11:16am
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Still cold out I see ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 11:47am
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Couple of updates: After I got fittings apart here is what I got-  And took advise earlier on Raw Pump brass plate-   Thanks JT |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 11:47am
Meet me down at the boat house but wear your long johns. It has warmed up and this morning it's up to - 5. Sorry Ken but I have never had a need to measure the flares on my B/W Velvets so I never realized they would hack and go with the cheap low pressure fittings. On second thought, it's who marinized the engine. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 11:57am
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How about we meet at SJRR and put some real hours on your trailer queens ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 12:33pm
He'd look funny down there in his momogrammed long johns Gary |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 12:36pm
Gee that looks just like my picture from the other day Probably the only thing that might be needed is a new hose since that fitting looks pretty rusty but with a little time and effort I figure it would work just fine.. |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 12:48pm
Yea, I got to replace the "90 fitting" as I messed up the threads. Are those special hoses are will a standard hydraulic hose work_I can have them made here in town?? |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 12:57pm
A standard hydraulic hose would be JIC 37 degrees so, do take the fitting with you to the hose shop for a match.. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: MrMcD
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 2:45pm
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The Hydraulic shop will want to know what pressures and temperatures this hose will be subjected to. I suspect pressures will be less than 300 PSI and temperatures less than 250 degree's F but that is my guess. Maybe one of you have details? If you don't know your pressures and temp needs they might sell you a hose that is over kill for your application as some hydraulic applications need to handle over 3,000 PSI. ------------- |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 2:54pm
Bear in mind that the trans fluid goes to a cooler that is make of copper (or brass) and it is only capable of lower pressures. Kinda looks like a brass fitting. And it kinda looks like it only sealed up on the end of the angle. That leads me to think that in fact it was two different angles. Maybe enough torque and it seals up? Not the right thing to do but "maybe" it would work?? Don't jump on me to say it wont work, just my guess as to what may have happened. ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 4:22pm
Duane, Good eyes. Yes, to me it does look like they mixed up the 45's and 37's! Now Timmy boy wants me to call PCM and B/W but, who actually installs the trans and cooler? Is the engine marinizer buying the trans, fitting it on the engine and then sending it to the boat manufacturer? Or, is the boat manufacturer buying the engine and trans and combining the two? Considering that the paint matches, I'd be inclined to say it's the marinizer but does anyone know for sure? John, When you get to your hose shop, make sure you ask some questions regarding the 45's vs: the 37's and combining the two at one assembly. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 5:19pm
For ones that don't understand any of this, like me-
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Posted By: jterr
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 9:27pm
After going all over town searching for above parts, I did get the 90 degree , but found out I messed up the threads on this and can't find one with threads all the way through . Suggestions JT |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-08-2019 at 9:47pm
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John, You'll need to purchase a 3/8" pipe tape and make one yourself. With the tap, it's possible you could even clean up the threads on the old one. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |