I GIVE UP, calling in the big expensive guns.
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Boat Maintenance
Forum Discription: Discuss maintenance of your Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=48560
Printed Date: April-18-2024 at 11:19pm
Topic: I GIVE UP, calling in the big expensive guns.
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Subject: I GIVE UP, calling in the big expensive guns.
Date Posted: April-15-2020 at 10:39pm
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I give up. I beg for help, I'm calling a tech tomorrow to schedule a time to come to my house. I feel defeated after so many parts orders, time sweating, crushing kids hopes, bloody knuckles......you know. I purchased a 2002 Pro Air Nautique with "A blown engine". Come to find out it was the starter seized and had the engine locked in place. Now I can't get it to run.....at all. I get a backfire, that's it. Things I've done: Oil change (Engine and Transmission) torque plate and seals Replaced the plugs/wires/cap/rotor, yes, I checked the routing and rotation. All in place Replaced the low pressure pump, wasn't running even after changing the relay and jumping relay. High pressure pump runs, changed filter. Checked pressure at fuel rail, I have pressure! New gas New water pump, thermostat New raw water pump New belts, hoses, and oil lines Fresh battery Checked all grounding wires, looks good. Checked for spark, I have spark. I'm at a loss.......All I get is great oil pressure while turning over and an occasional backfire. A backfire to the point it blew the exhaust flap off. Any ideas? |
Replies:
Posted By: bfootr
Date Posted: April-15-2020 at 10:50pm
| Have you checked timing? |
Posted By: C_Heath
Date Posted: April-15-2020 at 10:53pm
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Have you put a timing light on it ? Wait, it won’t run, forget I asked. lol ------------- 1979 Calipso Runabout (the boat that got it all started) 1988 Mastercraft ProStar 190 (sold) 2000 Pro Air Nautique/GT40 |
Posted By: dockedwages1
Date Posted: April-15-2020 at 11:13pm
| If he can’t get it started how would you check for timing? |
Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: April-15-2020 at 11:17pm
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Dumb question but is the engine turning the correct direction? And you might want to check your muffler to make sure the strong backfire didn’t cause it to crack. ------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: April-15-2020 at 11:20pm
| Exactly, can't check timing if not running. Also, the timing is controlled by the ECM so I don't believe this can be adjusted anyway. |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: April-15-2020 at 11:22pm
At this point, if I cracked the muffler then I will replace after it's back up and running. |
Orlando76 wrote:Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: April-15-2020 at 11:25pm
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Ah yeah I see now in original post you said you verified rotation. A cracked hull hugger muffler could be dangerous if your on the water. Just a reminder. If while testing at the house you feel there’s more water in bilge than should be..... ------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 12:10am
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Fill us in a little more please did you end up replacing the block or did you have it rebuilt? Was the distributor taken out of the block? And yes you can use a timing light put it on #1 cylinder and see if your getting spark ie the light will flash and see where it flashes on the harmonic balancer's timing marks, should be somewhere near TDC. A GT40 has to be adjusted to the proper base setting for the ECM to adjust from there, There is also a procedure to time it to base as well. If the distributor wasn't put in the proper way in the first place this very well could be your troubles. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 12:13am
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Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 12:17am
| How did you determine where to put cyl #1 (on the distributor)? |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 12:24am
I used the diagram in the nautique manual. 
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Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 12:34am
| And therein lies the problem |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 12:39am
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What Tim is leading to is you put #1 piston on it's compression stroke- pointer on the timing cover will be at TDC on the harmonic balancer. Then as you drop the distributor into place make sure the rotor points to #1 position on the cap as close as possible. If your off a tooth one way or another you will be able to adjust for that. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: MrMcD
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 4:19am
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Keep in mind that the engine will be on Top Dead Center twice in each complete cycle. Once for exhaust stroke and once for Compression stroke. you can pull the spark plug in #1 and put your thumb or a compression tester in the hole. Now rotate your engine slowly and you will feel the compression building or see it on the gauge when you approach TDC on the compression stroke. As you look down on the front of your engine below the distributor in your Ford you should notice one of your Heads is about 1" forward of the other head. The First plug in this forward head is your Number 1 cylinder. As you feel compression building start watching for your timing mark to come and align the harmonic balancer line with the TDC mark on your engine. Top Dead Center at your Zero mark. Once engine really is at TDC you can pull the distributor cap off and make sure your rotor inside the cap is actually pointing at the #1 plug wire on the distributor cap while you are at TDC. If the Rotor is not at #1 you need to adjust. At this point if you are off you have two options. Move the Plug wires on the cap to the correct spots based on where your rotor is pointing or unbolt your distributor and lift it up to rotate the rotor to the place you want #1 to be pointing, as you drop it back down you will notice the rotor moves as it settles in, this is normal you just have to try a couple spots till you get it pointing to the spot you want. The engine does not care where #1 is located as long as the rotor is pointing at the #1 plug at the proper time and all the following wires are in the correct order for your Engine and they circle the distributor cap in the proper direction your rotor will spin. It is always a good idea to have your #1 be in the same spot the factory set it at so the next wrench to touch your engine has an easier time. ------------- |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 9:14am
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Back in August of 2019 in your first thread, somebody local seems to have volunteered to help you out. I think he knows his way around an engine  Here's a quote from that thread
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Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 10:26am
| A backfire doesn’t go out the exhaust. You’ve got some fundamental misunderstandings and it’s time to get help. |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 10:44am
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Back-fire |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 10:46am
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Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 10:46am
I guess you would call that loud noise out the exhaust that can happen when the timing is wrong, something else then? My wife says I have some fundamental issues cause I can backfire from my mouth and my a** at the same time. I just belch and fart and tell her "it's a guy thing" |
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 10:50am
| Turning the ignition off for a few seconds then turning it on when cruising through a tunnel used to make a pretty loud noise out the exhaust. |
Posted By: Donald80SN
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 11:02am
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On this site, there is a GT-40 trouble shooting guide. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens 2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
Posted By: zwoobah
Date Posted: April-16-2020 at 1:25pm
Unburnt fuel in the exhaust does make for interesting noise, and potentially popped mufflers. Little different than a backfire but can be caused by the same issue. ------------- 1968 Mustang 16 - 351W powered |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: April-17-2020 at 10:59am
Thank you again for the thoughtful response! Last night I verified my timing is correct. What I found interesting is that none of my plugs were wet. I assumed since I had fuel in the rails, pumps were working that I was getting fuel. Now that I have eliminated the timing issue my focus leads me to injectors clogged and not working? A little more history, the gentlemen I purchased the boat said it has not ran in years. The date on the oil filter was somewhere around 7 years ago so there is no telling when this engine ran. The tech is slow and I won't be able to drag it down there until tomorrow, I might try and test the injectors this evening after work and see if they are seized. I wouldn't think all eight would quit but after years of fuel sitting in them, they could be gummed up. |
Posted By: SNobsessed
Date Posted: April-17-2020 at 12:54pm
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Squirt some gas (like less than an ounce) into the manifold (put flame arrestor back on) & see if it comes to life. IIRC there is an inexpensive fuel injection relay that can fail. ------------- “Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.” Ben Franklin |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: May-18-2020 at 6:11pm
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Well, it's back! After a month at the shop the fuel injectors were the problem, all 8. They were removed, sent out for a rebuild, and now runs like a champ. I threw an alternator belt but that was my fault for not looking at the alignment of the pulleys, that will remedied this evening. Now, this boat has never floated on my watch. We slid it in the lake on Friday and ran it for a little while. I did find out we are taking in too much water to be comfortable. The bilge will run for about 1-2 minutes after a 5 min run around the lake. The search for the water starts. |
Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: May-18-2020 at 6:42pm
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1-2 minutes? Wow that’s ALOT of water. ------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: May-18-2020 at 6:43pm
------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: May-18-2020 at 7:17pm
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Correct engine rotation, check. The water is a little strange so far. It really only enters the boat when I'm running. Sitting in the water and idling there is not noticeable water intrusion. If I run around the lake, boom water in the aft of the boat. I'm thinking it could be from the rudder leaking or....well I don't know. More investigation is needed. |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: May-18-2020 at 8:40pm
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Is the bilge water warm? ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: ShyDookie
Date Posted: May-19-2020 at 2:20pm
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Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: May-20-2020 at 3:40pm
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Problem found (kinda) and solved (band-aid). Somewhere in my ballast fill system I have a leak. When cruising water is being pushed in past the pump and draining/leaking into the aft compartment. It's a pretty big leak and these hard tanks are not helping me figure out where it's coming from, can't see anything! The easy fix to take the wife and kids for a ride is that I closed the ball valve in the engine compartment until I have some time to start taking it apart again and diagnosing the failed parts(s). I was out in it today on my lunch hour, ran it up and hit around 40 mph. To be honest, I was thinking this boat would do more than that. I wasn't pushing it (4500 rpm) so I'm not sure. I don't think I have any reason to go that fast, more a curiosity than anything. |
Posted By: desertskier
Date Posted: May-20-2020 at 3:58pm
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I just replaced the hoses and pumps going to the hard tanks on our '99. The hoses were cracked at the hard tank fittings and underneath the muffler. I just disconnected the hose at the thru hull fitting and used a garden hose to find the leaks. The bad news is for our boat I had to pull the fuel tank to be able to replace the hoses. PITA but while I had the tank out I installed a new steering cable and greased the rudder. The drain and fill fittings are on the bottom of the tanks. Yours is newer so you may get lucky and find the leak before the hoses go under the tank. ------------- 92 SN - Owned since 93 99 Pro Air 89 SN - Went to live on a lake in Texas 75 Donzi 16 - Sold in 93 |
Posted By: NautiqueHack
Date Posted: May-22-2020 at 5:45pm
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Smart boater! I already had the tank out and I never checked these lines, duh. I did replace all the fuel lines and steering cable so I did some of it. Wish me luck that I don't have to tear into this too much in the Florida sun. |
Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: May-23-2020 at 1:35am
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Park it in the shade. No sense fighting the Florida sun. ------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: May-23-2020 at 2:55am
Hence the reason not to live in that hell hole 
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Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: May-23-2020 at 6:03am
------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: May-23-2020 at 10:27am
Yea don’t forget to add the 99% humidity the bugs the gators the hurricanes and the blue hairs 
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