gt 40 cooling issue |
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JLags
Groupie Joined: September-05-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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Posted: July-06-2014 at 12:36am |
So long story short, a new raw water pump did the trick. No more issues overheating even at idle There is still a bit more steam than it use to have but it seems to fine. Thank you everyone for helping.
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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If I was fighting a frustrating issue for a long time and I could fix it for under ten bucks before a summer holiday weekend, I'd be very happy man, even if said part could be had a little cheaper elsewhere.
So, did the original poster get his gasket and go skiing or what? |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Usually Mark they get caught in the trans cooler
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3736 |
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Thanks for the part number, my GT 40 has the gasket that looks like it came off an oil filter. Both my Nautiques have run a water filter/strainer. They do catch leaves and things all the time. My Malibu had no strainer on the intake water line. I guess all the leaves just end up in the block or go out the exhaust?
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13514 |
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9875K29. Same diameter canister, and therefore gasket, for the 1.25" big block strainer as well.
$8.78 for 10. I layed one of these over a PCM just last night and couldn't tell the difference. I also grease my threads, have come across some very stiff & sticky strainers. I typically boat in clean enough water to not need one but have been too lazy to cut a new hose from the hull to the trans cooler. |
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3736 |
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Hollywood, would you happen to have a part number for the McMaster source on the seals? Maybe what years it would cover? Thanks
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3736 |
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If your strainer is like mine, 95 GT40 Engine, a little synthetic grease on the threads will make installation much easier. The plastic on plastic threads are sticky and it is hard to tell when the strainer is actually tight or if you are just fighting sticky threads.
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3736 |
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I made a silicone gasket for my 78 Nautique, it worked for years. I filled the Oring slot with silicone, coated my cover with light grease where it would be touching the silicone. Installed the cover and let it dry. The cover still came off normally because the grease kept it from sticking closed. I used that gasket for years.
I think your lack of gasket created your issue. A minor air leak will give all of the symptoms you mentioned. Congratulations on a cheap fix although you had several headaches first. |
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13514 |
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You might as well look in the bilge for that gasket. You can get two 10 packs of them from McMaster for the price of one PCM from a dealer.
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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Nice!
Keep us posted. |
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wheels06
Newbie Joined: June-16-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Bri892001,
1. Correct 2. No 3. it's too hot to put my hand on, not just the gauge. 4. Impeller was done correctly with a PCM. It didn't have a paper gasket, but I made one. There is no leakage from pump. 5. No quick flush kit that I can tell. 6. BINGO! Gasket is missing. Just called "local" dealer...30 miles away. They open at 10 and I'll be there at open and they have them in stock. 7. No, I didn't see anything that would be a problem. 8. All gauges are working fine. I can't thank you enough for your advice! This site is great for advice! I'll update results tomorrow! Thanks again! |
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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John,
There's three different overheating at idle boats going concurrently in this thread, so it's easy to lose track. The set screw indicates which way the pump is facing. Per Hollywood, in is correct for a Left Hand Standard (Most GT-40s are) engine. Also, you'd be overheating at every rpm if it was faced wrong. 1.) Yours if fine anywhere but idle, right? 2.) Was there anything changed etc. before the overheat? 3.) If yours is getting hot at idle, 190ish, are the exhaust manifolds too hot to put your hands on, or is this just a gauge indicated overheat? 4.) You replaced the impeller: A.) Did you correctly position the thin o-ring B.) Did the kit come with a paper gasket and if so did you put it in (shouldn't reallymatter, but just wondering C.) Did you use a PCM or Sherwood impeller or an off-brand? 5.) Do you have a quick flush kit installed anywhere 6.) Did you check your strainer for blockage and presence of gasket? 7.) Did you check your tranny cooler for blockage, end crushage? Hose clamp snuggness? 8.) Any other gauges giving wonky indications? |
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wheels06
Newbie Joined: June-16-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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my apologies, my previous post was to the question of whether this issue existed before I replaced the impeller last yr. I just took the water pump off and noticed something. There was a post earlier, "the set screw is the key"...what do you mean by that? Mine is facing towards the engine. Is that correct? I have a Sherwood. Looking into the pump the impeller seems to be fine. I'll be checking hoses next. This is very frustrating given the weekend coming up.
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wheels06
Newbie Joined: June-16-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Yes it did, that was why i changed it last year. I was hoping it solved the issue.
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13514 |
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A blocked thermostat would give you cool risers.
Everyone wants to change thermostats but they rarely go bad. Like you said though, you can test it and also run without. |
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3736 |
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If none of the above solves your heating issue the engine water pump may be suspect. I have seen the impeller on some pumps rust away till it is ineffective and I have seen the impeller lose its clamp on the shaft and free spin rather than pump water. Rare and the last thing I would check but possible.
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3736 |
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Take the thermostat out and test with no thermostat.
Sounds like restriction for sure. It the restriction is not in the thermostat start flushing. Maybe back flush the hoses and block, see what you get out of it. Could be a large chunk of a previously failed impeller coming back to haunt you. |
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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Given the order of events maybe the manifold, or some hose or fitting associated with it, is in fact relevant.
I would remove the hose going to your new manifold, but not on the manifold side, on the t-stat side. Now, try to blow through the hose, so your blowing through the coolant passage in the manifold. I have to admit, I've never done this, so I don't know how much resistance to expect. But, I'd think you'd know if there's excessive back pressure. All of the water eventually needs to escape through the exhaust manfifolds, so if it can't escape for some reason, everything is going to overheat. |
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JLags
Groupie Joined: September-05-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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I wish it was that simple as a hose! I used another hose I had the same diameter for the bucket test that is new.
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3736 |
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Your leak may be the intake hose itself. A crack or tear, any leak path that will allow air to suck in rather than water.
Can you try the bucket test with a new hose? Sometimes these hoses are as old as the boat and they crack. The only way I can think of to test the hose would be to pressurize it. Plug one end and clamp a garden hose in the other end and turn on the water. If properly sealed you should see no leaks from garden hose pressure. |
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JLags
Groupie Joined: September-05-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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Timeline in the correct order.
-Pump was replaced by previous owner -You bought the boat -Exhaust manifold replaced (probably not relevant but just in case) -You noticed the overheat - I noticed the excessive steam too -You replaced the impeller |
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13514 |
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The pump is correct for your engine. The hoses should be tucked close to the block for Left hand rotation. It would overheat immediately if it was on backwards.
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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So, when did the overheating start, place the following in the correct order, sorry if these seems like a silly exercise, just trying to get my head around it:
-Pump was replaced by previous owner -You bought the boat -Exhaust manifold replaced (probably not relevant but just in case) -You replaced the impeller -You noticed the overheat |
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JLags
Groupie Joined: September-05-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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Yes it use to cool fine, the previous owner did replace the pump before I purchased it about 4 years ago. There is a Sherwood tag on the the pump. I put in a PCM Impeller and new gasket when I replaced it. I don't see any water leaks around the pump. The whole seems odd to me, I thought if the pump was in wrong there would be no water and overheat at all RPMs.
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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Did it ever cool correctly with the pump oriented that way?
That is one potential mistake that can be made. That pump is designed to work with a lefty or a right hand rotation motor, but the pump is turned depending on what you have. The little set screw, is the indicator. Did you install that skinny O gasket on the pump when you replaced the impeller? Are you using a PCM or Sherwood Impeller, or are you using an off brand like Sierra? |
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JLags
Groupie Joined: September-05-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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Okay I did the bucket test it takes about a min to pump a 5 gallon bucket full of water. I also connected longer hose to the raw water pump intake to take water directly from the bucket to bypass the strainer and potential clogs. The result was the same draws very little water still warms up to 190 at idle.
Can someone tell me if the pump is installed correctly. I have never switched the direction but it doesn't look correct after all the images I've seen. |
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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John, did the problem exist before you changed the impeller?
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wheels06
Newbie Joined: June-16-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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I am having the same issue. I have a 96 Sport Nautique, replaced the impeller last year, no water leaks that I can see and when I'm running at 10mph the engine cools right down. At an idle(once the engine is warmed up) it starts heading to 190 quickly. Goes back down as soon as I hit the throttle. I checked the strainer, it was clean. I pulled a hose on top while it was running and it was pumping, although I thought it should be a little more than it was.
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13514 |
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Since this is a new issue, I'd have to say it's due to an improper winter/summerization.
However, since there has been someone monkeying with the exhaust do verify the gasket is on proper. Water flowing to the underside of the riser should be blocked by the gasket. This forces cooling up to the top of the riser. There is really only 1 manifold, it doesn't know which way is forwards. There water outlets on both sides so it can be installed on either side of the engine. This makes gasket orientation key. The tab on the gasket should match the tab on the riser. It won't make a difference on your temperature gauge, but you will have a warm riser and excessive steam, possibly leading to a hose failure. Our Martinique was kindly delivered this way... *Don't ask me why there is a water inlet on underside of the riser. It could be a 2 piece core in the casting process, which would simplify the amount and orientation of them in the mold. Or there could be other applications with increased water flow that utilize all sides. |
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JLags
Groupie Joined: September-05-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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No quick connect installed for flushing. I guess I need to complete the bucket test.
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