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mamigacz
Groupie Joined: June-08-2014 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 96 |
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Posted: October-24-2015 at 10:59am |
Good point!
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mark c
Gold Member Joined: May-09-2012 Location: Massachusetts Status: Offline Points: 534 |
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You need to block the engine from rotating though, as soon as you put air pressure into the cylinder it will start to rotate and the valves will start to open. If you back the rockers off the engine will rotate to BDC and stay there. DO NOT put a lot of pressure into the cylinder 10 or 20 PSI is plenty to check for air leaks.
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mamigacz
Groupie Joined: June-08-2014 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 96 |
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If you don't want to take the valve cover off and loosen the rockers, you can do the same thing when number 7 is at TDC. |
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mark c
Gold Member Joined: May-09-2012 Location: Massachusetts Status: Offline Points: 534 |
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Pull the ignition coil lead, jack your carb butterfly valves full open, run the compression check on # 7 again. Then add a 1/2 teaspoon of oil to the number 7 cylinder thru the sparkplug hole and run your compression check again on the #7 cylinder. If compression improves you have a ring issue, might be stuck (doubtfull if you've run the engine for any length of time) if it doesn't improve its a valve issue, either the intake or exhaust is not sealing properly and the head will have to come off. Leakdown won't tell you anything at this point, with 1/2 the pressure of the other cylinders you obviously have a leak. The only question is if its rings or valves, and in order to fix it the engine has to come apart....You can back the rockers off #7 and put 10 or 15 psi into the cylinder thru the sparkplug hole and listen to the exhaust, intake or the block itself (you will have the valve cover off to loosen up the valves) you will hear air whistling in one of those locations and that will tell you a little more about where the leak is coming from.
Had this boat sat for a long time before this issue was found? It's possible the rings are stuck on that one cylinder but without some more info its hard to tell |
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Waterdog
Grand Poobah Joined: April-27-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2020 |
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70 psi is to low. Do a leak down test maybe you need a head. Swap'em out for a set of GT 40p's and gain some HP.
On the other hand if its rings the hole engine will need to be rebuilt. My 86 Silver Nautique had 237 hrs on it and the engine was junk, cracked block, rebuilt another one and never looked back. You know its a reverse rotation engine - right, uh left or is it right ? |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Chris,
We have repeatedly tried to explain the compression not caused by a manifold problem and to find a new mechanic. Besides him saying a 87 should not be running, now he wants to replace all those parts? Where did you find the back yard hack? (sorry Gary ) |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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A manifold leak,either a intake or exhaust will not cause a compression issue. Compression is created within the cylinder and head ie with any manifold removed a compression test could still be done. You need a new mechanic,one that can do a leak down test-----
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Chrissn2001
Newbie Joined: May-02-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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So, here's my update: Got my boat from the mechanic yesterday. I figured I will put the project on pause and pick it back up in the spring. On a warm test my numbers were: 1) 125 2) 130 3) 130 4) 140 5) 140 6) 130 7) 75 8) 130. He is sticking with the leak in the manifold as causing the issue with number 7. Is this a brackish/saltwater thing? He often refers to this when talking about the enging. He says I need to replace the carb, water pump, impeller, and fuel pump. I feel like I could probably do those things. He says then the boat will run, and doesn't think I'd notice a difference in performance even with #7.
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13513 |
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as long as you don't strip or stick anything to far into the chamber there isn't much damage you can do
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Chrissn2001
Newbie Joined: May-02-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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My skills are pretty inconsistent...I don't trust myself, but I'm probably a little better than I think. I'll take a look for the videos. I just don't want to do further damage...
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Chris,
I've noticed you have been visiting after all the suggestions regarding getting a new mechanic and the engine worth saving. Have you given the ideas any more thought? How mechanically inclined are you? A leak down is really pretty simple that you could do yourself and as stated would be a great starting point. Many auto supplies will rent or loan the gauge set and then all that's needed is a air compressor. There are some fantastic tutorials on Utube on the procedure. |
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Jonny Quest
Grand Poobah Joined: August-20-2013 Location: Utah--via Texas Status: Offline Points: 2957 |
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A little bit of lovin' and that Ford small block will be purring again. Don't give up yet. That boat should have a lot of life left in her.
JQ |
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Current
2003 Ski Nautique 206 Limited Previous 2001 Ski Nautique Open Bow 1994 Ski Nautique Open Bow Aqua skiing, ergo sum |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Gary, I have a funny feeling that Ken would know how to run a compression as well as a leak down. |
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74Wind
Grand Poobah Joined: August-02-2011 Location: Georgia Status: Offline Points: 2101 |
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Yikes! Any so-called boat mechanic who says an 87 351 shouldn't still be running and is not worth reviving clearly needs a new line of work.....I'd be peeling rubber and spraying gravel to get my boat away from this guy ASAP.......
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1974 Southwind 18
1975 Century Mark II |
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JPASS
Grand Poobah Joined: June-17-2013 Location: Orlando Status: Offline Points: 2283 |
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Definitely find a new mechanic. 440 hours is nothing.
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'92 Correctcraft Ski Nautique
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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I agree on a new mechanic but quit knocking back yard mechanics Pete, Ken Warby's record still stands almost 37 years to the day-----
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Find a new mechanic and:
A "leak in the manifold"?? You absolutely need a new mechanic. Is this guy working in his back yard? Chris, Do you understand that a manifold leak will not cause a low reading with a compression test????? |
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Chrissn2001
Newbie Joined: May-02-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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Okay, just talked to the mechanic. He almost seems determined to bury this boat. He's convinced that an engine from 1987 shouldn't still be running and is not worth reviving. It seems like people on this site would see it otherwise.
He reported that the 7th valve is running at 75. The others are doing fine and 120+. He thinks there's a leak in the manifold that is causing this. He says it's going to need a new carb, new fuel pump, new water pump kit. I can't believe that the damage would be so permanent with the number of hours (440) and the fact that it's sat for 4 years... I think I may want to get a second opinion... |
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3735 |
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If it is coming back from the dead, a long term storage you might run it a while, couple hours maybe and retest that compression in the weak hole. It will either improve or not but it is worth checking. A stuck ring may loosen up and you will be fine. A rusted valve face may pound itself into a good seat again. A burned valve will have no change.
Best of luck. |
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Chrissn2001
Newbie Joined: May-02-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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This was the only info that I got so far. This is the second time he's doing the compression test. The first time was cold and brought numbers at around 120, but the #7 was at 70. I asked him to do it again with the engine warmer and he did. We haven't spoken directly, so I was just taking what was on his phone message.
The engine is PCM 351- 1987 SN2001. I don't have pics because it's out of the area right now. Thanks guys! I'll add info. when I talk to him. |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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+1 also more helpful would be a leak down test.Little more work involved but would tell you where the problem actually is, ie rings or head.
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JPASS
Grand Poobah Joined: June-17-2013 Location: Orlando Status: Offline Points: 2283 |
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We're going to need a little more information that that.
With a compression check, the general rule is that there should be no more than a 10% difference between your lowest and highest cylinder. There is also a low threshold that would indicate the engine is in need of a rebuild. What were the numbers for all 8 cylinders? What motor are we talking about? Boat model and year? Some pics and a little more info would go a long way in getting you the help you are looking for. |
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'92 Correctcraft Ski Nautique
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Chrissn2001
Newbie Joined: May-02-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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Hey guys, I'm trying to bring my boat back from the dead. The mechanic I'm having look at it seems to be a little pessimistic about it, but I want to see what you all think. He did a compression test and found that one cylinder (#7) is running lower than the others. He put in a borrowed carburetor (hence my other post regarding that), but what's my level of concern about this weak cylinder? What's the outlook of the engine in this situation? Thanks!
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