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this boat may drive me to drinking... |
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KENO 
Grand Poobah 
Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11112 |
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 Topic: this boat may drive me to drinking...Posted: November-05-2020 at 5:51am |
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It seems that he already bought the DUI a while back
It also seems like he vanished or something before he could put it in or update what his results were or maybe it's backordered or maybe the boat really did drive him to drinking Buck..............you out there?
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inglesideshawn
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Joined: April-03-2009 Location: ingleside, il Status: Offline Points: 203 |
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Posted: November-04-2020 at 6:44pm |
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Your having the same exact problem I had.. Get rid of the Pertronix and put a DUI in . Just put bouth wires on the same stud so its got a solid 12volts and does not drop down for the points. seriously the best money ever spent. but just my 2c
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1989 nautique
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KENO
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Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11112 |
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Posted: October-07-2020 at 8:25am |
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Your alternator is working since the battery is at 14.3 volts with the engine running. The heavy orange wire is the alternator output supplying charging to the battery and supplying the electrical system when the boat is running. 12 volts on the yellow wire to the alternator is low though. It should be up more in the 13.5 range. That is the excitation to the alternator, it'll work just fine with that voltage supplied to it but.........that voltage is also going to the choke which will be just fine also and the ballast resistor supply. Your points will work OK with that 12 volts into the resistor but the upcoming DUI will be happier with more voltage like the 13.5 mentioned earlier. It comes from the keyswitch in RUN back through pin 6 on your 8 plug connector and the wires are spliced together as shown in the photo below of that particular section of an untaped engine side wiring harness. It gets to the keyswitch through pin 5 so somewhere in that wiring you're losing too much voltage You're losing 2.3 volts between the battery supply and the ballast resistor supply which is a lot. Something around a1 volt loss would be much more normal and would be much better for your upcoming DUI distributor. You previously checked that you had about 12 volts with the engine OFF and the key in RUN, but you should do the same checks now with the engine running and see where the voltage is being lost. It could be any connection in the flowpath being loose or corroded enough to affect the wires ability to carry load like where the wire connects to the keyswitch or the ignition breaker as a couple of examples  A genuine PCM wiring job |
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uncle-buck
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Joined: June-14-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 327 |
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Posted: October-06-2020 at 8:16pm |
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With the engine running, there were 14.3 volts indicated at the battery and the heavy orange wire on the alternator. (is that the battery positive wire?) 12 volts at the yellow wire on the alternator. Thoughts?
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uncle-buck
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Joined: June-14-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 327 |
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Posted: October-06-2020 at 10:00am |
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Thank you, Ken!
I have been blessed with good health, a wonderful family, some great friends, and life in the most prosperous nation in the history of the world. And I can still enjoy a day on the water in and behind the boat. Your continuing assistance in facilitating that enjoyment is appreciated more than you know. |
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KENO
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Posted: October-06-2020 at 9:13am |
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Hey Buck
Happy birthday Maybe you'll get one of these a little ahead of schedule today  Or one of these too  Have a good one
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KENO
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Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11112 |
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Posted: October-05-2020 at 9:58pm |
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it was a nice day for a cruise Not nearly as much time as you donated to your friends Cobalt
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MrMcD
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Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3750 |
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Posted: October-05-2020 at 9:01pm |
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Nice Work Ken, donated your time to offer real world numbers that should help him fix the boat.
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KENO
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Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11112 |
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Posted: October-05-2020 at 7:49pm |
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Is that 12 and 9 volts with the engine running? I think you should have at least 13 to the resistor with the engine running if your alternator is working as it should. And a few volts drop through the resistor What's battery voltage when the engine is running? What's alternator output right at the output terminal I took some "representative numbers today on a boat with points and had the numbers below with it running:: 14.5 volts at the battery and also the alternator output 13.5 into the resistor 11.0 out of the resistor coil temp of 125 ish degrees after running for quite a while. To me that's warm but not hot These were with a 1.3 ohm resistor and a 1.5 ohm coil so 2.8 ohms total resistance. For the DUI, I think you'd want up around that 13.5 number with the engine running and the alternator supplying power. I'm wondering if the alternator is putting out the correct voltage.
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uncle-buck
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Joined: June-14-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 327 |
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Posted: October-05-2020 at 1:11pm |
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We didn't have an infrared thermometer with us. Will take one and check it next time.
The coil part no. is R117004A, purchased from Skidim for the previous setup with the Prestolite electronic ignition module. Primary resistance is 1.0 to 1.1 ohms (with engine warmed up). Voltage is 12 volts to the resistor, and 9 volts from the resistor to the ignition coil. That should provide 12 volts to a new D.U.I. distributor after the resistor is bypassed, correct? |
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peglegtoo
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Joined: July-09-2018 Location: Mass Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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Posted: October-05-2020 at 7:47am |
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On my boat the coil appeared very hot last year as well, the laser temp gauge for HF said 130 degrees. I thought that was too hot and installed a new flame thrower II epoxy filled coil. probably overkill but it helped my hot start issues. At the time I wondered the same question keno is asking now... how hot is hot. |
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KENO
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Posted: October-05-2020 at 5:20am |
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Gimme that bottle again Buck
Can you quantify really really hot? It sounds like you had no running issues with the engine even with the hot coil. Back in the first post of this thread you said you replaced the coil..........I guess I'm curious what coil you're using right now. Something like brand and part number or coil primary resistance (like maybe 1.5 ohms as an example) And.........if you're gonna check voltage from the resistor going to the coil, do it with the engine running and warmed up to get a number that will really mean anything |
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8122pbrainard
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Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Posted: October-04-2020 at 9:21pm |
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Check the volts on the coil side of the resistor.
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uncle-buck
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Posted: October-04-2020 at 9:18pm |
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No, I did not and never have.
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8122pbrainard
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Posted: October-04-2020 at 9:07pm |
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Bert,
Did you leave the ignition key in the on position without the engine running?
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uncle-buck
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Posted: October-04-2020 at 7:47pm |
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Yes, and it is connected to the ballast resistor with a purple wire.  |
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8122pbrainard
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Posted: October-04-2020 at 5:25pm |
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Is the coil you have exterally ballasted? If so, did you connect the coil to the low voltage side of the resistor?
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uncle-buck
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Posted: October-04-2020 at 5:13pm |
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Put the breaker points back in, waiting for the DUI distributor to be delivered. Boat ran well. No issues. But I noticed the coil got really really hot.
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KENO
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Posted: September-28-2020 at 7:09am |
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Well at least you had good results based on your alternator/no spark thread
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uncle-buck
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Posted: September-22-2020 at 5:44pm |
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Ken -- My spark plug wires are brand new and plenty long.
I *think* I can adapt/convert the distributor ends of the wires with a boot and terminal kit for about $10. Also, Performance Distributors recommends using a new hot wire connected to the distributor from the starter solenoid or a fuse in most applications. Finally, Summit Racing's website indicates the RED distributor won't ship for another month, but that's OK. They are great to do business with and I want them to make some money on this. Thanks once more for your help.
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KENO
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Posted: September-22-2020 at 5:24pm |
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Don't forget, you'll need some new plug wires too because of the male terminals on the cap.
Your choice of colors of course. Since quite a few people have done this swap, one of them should be able to tell you what wires fit. I made some from a universal kit so the wires would be plenty long.
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uncle-buck
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Posted: September-22-2020 at 1:59pm |
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Oh, it will definitely be RED!
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MI-nick
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Joined: January-12-2009 Location: Ypsilanti, MI Status: Offline Points: 812 |
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Posted: September-22-2020 at 1:58pm |
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that's what I keep telling myself
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As far as I can tell, I'm not quite sure...
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KENO
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Posted: September-22-2020 at 1:50pm |
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Don't sweat it..................Buck got the bad coil or ignitor or whatever
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MI-nick
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Posted: September-22-2020 at 1:29pm |
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i'll be heading up north this weekend to install ignitor II and flame thrower II in my boat. I was feeling pretty confident they would fix my no spark issue...i still am...but, definitely not as much...
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As far as I can tell, I'm not quite sure...
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KENO
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Posted: September-22-2020 at 1:18pm |
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I'd probably take them up on the offer. You'll have a new distributor with no wear on it. Jonny Quest will say it just has to be RED
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uncle-buck
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Posted: September-22-2020 at 1:09pm |
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Ken -- Still raining here. Am pretty aggravated with Pertronix tech support. Opened a support ticket on their website and it was closed without a reply or solution,
Summit Racing has offered to refund the purchase prices of the Pertronix EI module and coil. Am seriously considering returning them and purchasing a DUI distributor. Any thoughts? |
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uncle-buck
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Posted: September-20-2020 at 5:22pm |
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Ken,
I will follow your advice and try the Pertronix module with the old coil after the weather here clears in a few days. Am fairly certain the module was connected to the coil correctly, *but* it is possible that I made a mistake. Would be great if that's the case and all goes well when it is tested again. |
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KENO
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Posted: September-19-2020 at 7:32pm |
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Pass me the bottle
Since the coil makes the spark and the spark is weak, maybe the coil isn't any good even though it's new. The module just tells the coil when to make the sparks I'd probably put the Pertronix module back in and use the old coil and see what your results are spark wise. That should tell you some good info. I don't think I'd use the Pertronix coil with the Prestolite module though if it's the 0.6 ohm coil. It wouldn't play well with the Prestolite module. It might be a silly question but are the positive and negative terminals on the new coil connected right. If the wires were hooked up backwards the coil will still make some spark but not nearly the same intensity.
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uncle-buck
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Posted: September-19-2020 at 2:43pm |
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Ken,
I followed your instructions on adjusting the timing and it did not run any better. Also, following Pertronix tech support's advice, I sanded the distributor hold down bracket along with contact surfaces on the distributor and engine block to make sure the module was well grounded. In addition, I ran a jumper wire from the + side of the battery to the + side of the ignition coil to make sure the coil was getting 12 volts. No difference. If the Pertronix module isn't facilitating the distribution of enough energy to light up a timing light, it certainly isn't going to run the engine very well. Am reinstalling the Prestolite EI module and coil. If you have any other suggestions, they would be welcomed. Thanks |
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uncle-buck wrote: