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Need Help With No Spark Issue

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    Posted: June-02-2018 at 1:05am
Originally posted by JackBShelby JackBShelby wrote:

1979 Correct Craft Mustang. No power going to the coil. Power is at the ignition switch but nothing at the coil when you switch on the ignition switch. Coil must get power from somewhere else because of no direct wire from key switch to the coil. Was ok when winterized but will not start now. Cranks over fine but no spark. Thanks for your help.


Jack you need one of these diagrams to find your problem on a 1979 engine assuming it's a 302 Pleasurecraft with points or maybe an electronic conversion that still keeps the ballast resistor in the circuit.



You do have a direct wire to the coil from the key and it passes through the ballast resistor.On the diagram follow the purple wire from the ignition switch to the coil and you'll see the resistor

If the resistor is dead (open circuit) you won't have any coil power like Spiralhelix mentioned earlier. You can check voltage into the resistor and voltage out of the resistor. .

The resistor is on the back of the engine

Or you can check it's resistance, if it's infinite the resistor is broken If it's about 1.2 or so ohms it's good and not your problem

A good replacement part number would be Echlin ICR23 at a NAPA store or it will cross reference to a variety of other brand resistors.

It should look pretty much like this and be around 5 dollars maybe a little more



You could also temporarily put in a jumper from one terminal to the other and see if you have spark, but if you run it that way it'll eat up your points fairly quickly.

If the resistor is good, it could also be that your ignition switch itself is bad or you have a broken or heavily corroded wire between the key and the resistor.but I'd try the resistor check first.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JackBShelby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 11:43pm
1979 Correct Craft Mustang. No power going to the coil. Power is at the ignition switch but nothing at the coil when you switch on the ignition switch. Coil must get power from somewhere else because of no direct wire from key switch to the coil. Was ok when winterized but will not start now. Cranks over fine but no spark. Thanks for your help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tryathlete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 11:29pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Just like a set of points, if you have the key on and the points are closed, you'll burn up a set of points and/or ignition coil in a short time..

The same thing happens with the "electronic switch" in the Ignitor

It wasn't necessarily fixed, you can still buy the Ignitor or you can pay more for the Ignitor 2


Dang I was gonna write that and ya beat me to it. My tree trimmer fried his points by leaving the switch on to his chipper. I ran out and got a set and replaced them. Two years later he still on that quick fix.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 11:04pm
Just like a set of points, if you have the key on and the points are closed, you'll burn up a set of points and/or ignition coil in a short time..

The same thing happens with the "electronic switch" in the Ignitor

It wasn't necessarily fixed, you can still buy the Ignitor or you can pay more for the Ignitor 2
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tryathlete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 10:56pm
Good to know that was fixed! What a glaring omission that was!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 10:29pm
Originally posted by tryathlete tryathlete wrote:

For those of you with Pertronix, be sure not to leave your ignition switch on as it will fry the module. SkiDim and I found this out along the way with my Supra a few years back.


You only get that burn up the module feature on the Ignitor (black module)

In the Ignitor 2 with the red module you can leave the key on and it won't burnup thanks to some electronic magic in the module It was one of the improvements in the Ignitor 2
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tryathlete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 9:13pm
For those of you with Pertronix, be sure not to leave your ignition switch on as it will fry the module. SkiDim and I found this out along the way with my Supra a few years back.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spiralhelix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 5:18pm
I didn't see a new thread yet, so I'll just post this here just in case. I came up with a little spreadsheet to help me keep track of my values and what I was testing. My normal values may be off for certain parts or may be different than what you have or it may need some tweaking, but it might help get you going. I, unfortunately, had to go through the process myself and even though my ballast resistor did in fact test to 1.5 ohms, didn't get a spark with a known good coil and for the $5 for a new resistor gave it a go as everything else was coming up as normal up to that point. The new resistor was the answer for me.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 4:34pm
Welcome Jack. It would be best to start your own thread stating what boat you have and year,what engine etc so we can help
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 4:31pm
Do not blindly start throwing parts at it. If you do not have a volt-ohm-meter, run to sears or walmart or auto parts store and buy one. They are cheap and useful. Then start tracing power starting at battery, then switch, then coil, then distributor. There are a ton of good videos on youtube on how to step-by-step diagnose ignition problems with your VOM. Works every time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JackBShelby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-01-2018 at 4:18pm
Hello all,

PLEASE HELP! I am having a similar issue however, I am not getting any power to the coil at all. I tried replacing the coil, but still no luck. Any suggestions on how to get power or what to do next?

Thanks,
Jack
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abolton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-03-2007 at 9:01pm
So embarrassed, but this site is so good I have to share. My problem turned out to be loose fuel line clamps. Sometimes it would start and sometimes not, it would suck air and the gas would drain back to tank. I thought it was the control module breaking down so it did cost me $130. to learn a little more about the wonderful sport of boating. If anyone wants a Petronix conversion kit, I will sell my old one cheap.   
ABE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abolton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-30-2007 at 11:02pm
Joe,

Very good, I too will try rotating the distributor Sunday, I was on a Offshore Poker Run today to Toronto, and couldn't work on the 78SN. I have spark at the coil, and will check for spark at the plugs tomorrow. I have a friend bringing over a timing light too. I will post how it go's,
ABE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote joed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-30-2007 at 12:36pm
You say you have spark... where? At the coil, or at the plugs? Did you try playing with the timing after you installed the new EI module? I know when I installed my conversion kit it would not start until I rotated the distributor a bit, got it started, then set the timing.

Good luck.

Joe
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abolton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-30-2007 at 10:54am
I replaced the control module and now it will not start at all, I have spark (new coil too) I have gas, (even starting fluid) cap and rotor are new too, but not even a sputter. So why did she stop firing up? first not when its hot, now not at all. Could it be I need a new distributer, it looks orig. What should I do ?????
ABE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-22-2007 at 11:42am
Seen that before... they do fail like that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abolton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-22-2007 at 10:25am
yes you are right on all that you said
ABE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nuttyskier2002 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-22-2007 at 8:12am
Abolton, I have to apologize.   I got you confused with the man who started this thread. Now that I've re-read your original post I see that you never stated that your EI unit is a new one or that it is a Pertronix brand. It sounds like you are describing a thermal breakdown issue with your ignition module. So, let me see if I have this right,....are you saying that you have spark when everything is cold, but once the engine is hot you lose spark? And you have replaced the coil right? And it ran okay for a while with the new coil but then started doing the same thing again,....is that right? If I have correctly re-stated your issue, then I think you are right in suspecting your electronic ignition unit is the culprit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abolton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-22-2007 at 7:38am
I just took off the stock coil and put on a blaster coil. I am using the ballast resistor, Not sure what the resistance of my coil is. I will check the timing, and set it at 8 btdc. I should change out the control module?
ABE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nuttyskier2002 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-22-2007 at 3:36am
79, I think he is saying that he has no spark when the engine gets hot.

Joe, is this correct? If so what coil are you using with the Pertronix? Are you using the ballast resistor? What is the resistance of your coil?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-21-2007 at 11:24pm
your timing is advanced to much most likely and when it's hot it won't crank because of it. So set the timing at 8 btdc and gofrom there.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abolton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-21-2007 at 10:08pm
If it was the timing wouldn't it be hard to start all the time, only when the motor is hot it doesn't have spark. Could it be the control module in my conversion kit? Napa wants $136.00 for it.
ABE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-20-2007 at 11:54pm
Originally posted by abolton abolton wrote:

78 SN 351 Ford w/ Elect. conversion won't start hot, changed out the coil and it started for a few days, but now its back. Gets gas, but when its hot won't start, any ideas?


your timing isn't set correctly
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abolton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-20-2007 at 7:08pm
78 SN 351 Ford w/ Elect. conversion won't start hot, changed out the coil and it started for a few days, but now its back. Gets gas, but when its hot won't start, any ideas?
ABE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2007 at 4:36pm
Originally posted by logicsound logicsound wrote:

and to add to my problems I turned the key off and they boat kept cranking??? had to pull coil wire. any ideas ? by the way I installed new starter and relay

Thanks


Trever, This is from my other post to you in "engine repair". Did you see it and did you check the voltage?

Quote: When the new starter stayed engaged, you may have another problem other than a bad starter relay. You will need a volt meter or a test light. Check that the 12 volts coming from the ignition switch to the starter relay coil is actually turning off. It is the small wire on the relay.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote joed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2007 at 4:13pm
Hey logic... did you just install the electronic conversion? If so... maybe you need to reset the timing.

After I installed the Pertronix my engine wouldn't start. I had to rotate the distributor a bit until it started... then warmed it up and set the timing.

I can't believe what a difference the EI kit makes... super easy starts, great idle, good performance. Best $100 bucks I've ever spent, and I learned how to use a timing light too!

Thanks for all your help and support guys... you rock!

Joe
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logicsound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2007 at 1:29pm
yes the rotor turns, tried new cap and rotor, and yes the spark looks good from the coil, but I could not hear it, then I disconnected they grey tach wire and it sounded alot stronger, and I am getting spark at the plugs, but still no start and to add to my problems I turned the key off and they boat kept cranking??? had to pull coil wire. any ideas ? by the way I installed new starter and relay

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2007 at 12:27pm
logicsound,Is the rotor turning???? If so sounds like a bad rotor or distributor cap.Are you getting a good hot blue arc out of the coil wire, you should be able to "HEAR" it fire,crack crack.........boat dr
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logicsound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2007 at 11:38am
i have a similiar issue, but i have the electronic conversion kit, (351windsor) I get spark out of the coil but no spark to the plugs..boat was running fine, What are my steps to troubleshoot this?

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote joed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-27-2007 at 8:50pm
Good news Brian! She's purring like a kitten. Installed new points and condenser... gapped, set dwell, and timing.

We're off to the lake first thing tomorrow.

My Pertronix EI should be here Wed or Thurs.

Thanks for all the help!

Joe
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