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HIGH OIL PRESSURE

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    Posted: November-24-2008 at 2:36pm
I just changed the oil and filter in my 89 BFN. I put in Valvoline VR-1 Racing Oil straight 30 weight and a NAPA Gold filter because we have been doing some cold weather footing, that is what the PCM manual said to use in the reference section. Prior to the oil change I was running around 20-25 PSI at idle and 60-65 PSI at WOT. Last night when we started it up the pressure was high and stayed high. At idle it was 65-70 PSI and then we took it out to run it real quick and see what the pressure would do... it pegged at 80+ PSI. This has gotta me very worried, I don't want to cause any damage. Any suggesting would be much appreciated, Thanks in advance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-24-2008 at 5:16pm
The straight grade will give a little higher pressure cold than a multi-vis. But my concern would be the oil filter. Have always used Ford parts for Ford motors, FL-1 A is the only filter I will use. There may be an issue with the internal design, check valve etc. that could give you this high a reading.
Throw that NAPA stuff in the recycle bin and install the proper filter for this application........Boat dr
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-24-2008 at 5:54pm
Ford or Chevy?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-24-2008 at 6:05pm
Come on, Doc. Motorcraft makes a decent filter, but Wix makes a good one too. Every article Ive ever read says so. (This writeup is referenced pretty frequently.) If you read that, you'll notice that the Ford filter shares many of the same design elements as the Purolator (another good filter) and is just rebranded. Whats the OEM filter on that BBC, anyways? For all I know, it could be on the list of filters to avoid.

Footer, I cant fault you for your choice in fluids/filters, but thats not to say they werent the cause of the high pressure. I assume you let the boat warm up before picking up the RPM's? Ambient temps had to be pretty chilly in IN, I assume.

FYI, I get 55-80psi of pressure with the 20w50 VR1 in my SBF. I dont notice very big swings from cold to hot- but like Doc says, thats likely due to the multivis.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-24-2008 at 8:26pm
jesus Doc please give us a break. There's nothing wrong with the napa gold filters pretty decent filters if you ask me and not the source of the any restriction or pressure increase for that matter.

The increase in pressure is because you are using a much thicker oil that does not thin out as it gets hot. Should have stuck with the 20w50 no real reason to switch just because it's cooler out if anything should use a thinner weight so it doesn't labor when cold.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tullfooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-24-2008 at 9:11pm
Footer89, Ben is that you?
Welcome aboard!
If so, break out the pics of the boat that you stole, er I mean bought out from under me.    You must be just changing the oil, and not winterizing. You, Jake, Buckethead and Dan have a couple of weeks before the ice gets too thick. Post some of the pics of you clowns footing last weekend.
Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote footer89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 12:30am
Yes, Steve it is me! Thanks for the welcome. I will get some pics up soon, been super busy. Just ended up draining all of the water an hour ago just to be on the safe side, I would be crying the blues if the garage door ever got left open was super easy.

Boat Dr:

I am not sure if the Napa could be the cause of the problem... I will change if you think that is the problem. My dealership uses Napa Gold and suggested it for our boat. And again the straight grade was insisted by the dealership as well ... def. not saying you are wrong just givin you the details.

Buffalo- Chevy BB

TRBenj- Should we change over to the multi viscosity? I am not sure what the PO used. Def. a big change in oil pressure to make me comfortable. We let the boat warm up for almost 20 minutes; I was working on the trailer and just let it run. It was about 35 degrees outside I was sure what the water temp was, but it was def. cold.

79- Multivisocity Oil even though the manual says so?


All the help will be much appreciated. Thanks a ton!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 7:44am
Originally posted by footer89 footer89 wrote:

We let the boat warm up for almost 20 minutes; I was working on the trailer and just let it run. It was about 35 degrees outside I was sure what the water temp was, but it was def. cold.


What was the temp gauge showing? The outside ambient and the water temp won't make a difference unless the T stat is stuck open. It will regulate the engine temp just like it does in a car.

I'm running VR1 20-50 in all my boats. I also use the Napa Golds (Except the 54 - with old marines filters weren't used and only optional on some of the high end engines)

Welcome and have fun with a great boat.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 86BFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 10:45am
Welcome! Bring on the pictures man.

Boat and Fooin' pic that is!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote footer89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 11:00am
The temperature I believe was running higher than normal... 180. It usually runs in the 145 to 160 range. However, I just drained all of the water last night and the strainer was full of crap, so I guess that could have been the temp problem.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote boat dr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 2:18pm
I have been running the Rotella 40 T in my stroker w/ a FL 1-A filter and have no issues with the oil pressure.
My deal there and as always is use what was OEM and I bet it was not a NAPA.Your motor , do what you want. But in my shop its AC on GM and Motorcraft on FoMoCo..........
I hear a mumbling in the backgound, must be Chris and his BS .My guess Chris is you were on the design team that contracted out NAPA/ CRAPPA filters too?????????????????   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 2:26pm
Straight weight will increase the oil pressure. Indmar has a 383 ci stroker engine that is about a $6k upcharge on a Malibu. All their engines are speced to use 15w40. A lot of people were having oil pressure issues with these motors and Indmar's response was to switch to 40w, and then when the problem continued, to 50w. I haven't heard how it ended up, but the people that bought the engines weren't too excited about their cure.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tullfooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 2:58pm
I know you guys have seen this video of our race
Barefoot race start
But next year, the boat to left, looking at the skiers, the ones that Brendan high fives with, will be replaced with a sweet '89 Barefoot Nautique. Footer89 is on that team.
It will also replace one of the boats in this video;
Bridge Flyers
Now they will be looking for rough water at the races.
Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M3Fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 4:28pm
Gang, 20W50 is going to be thicker at operating temp than 30W straight, right? If anything, he went to a lighter oil at operating temps by going with the straight 30.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote footer89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 4:50pm
Contacted PCM. Here was there reply:

"We recommend 30 or 40 weight oil. I would test with a mechanical gauge to verify what you are seeing on the dash. Your engine should hold seven quarts and there is no specific recommend oil filter."

Still at a lost. I hope to get a mechanical gauge on it sometime here in the near future.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 5:05pm
This reminds me of my '79 when I put a new sender on and didn't know any better about the differences between auto and marine. <-- Pre CCFan!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 5:15pm
Originally posted by BuffaloBFN BuffaloBFN wrote:

This reminds me of my '79 when I put a new sender on and didn't know any better about the differences between auto and marine. <-- Pre CCFan!


What's the difference?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 6:38pm
Originally posted by Riley Riley wrote:

Originally posted by BuffaloBFN BuffaloBFN wrote:

This reminds me of my '79 when I put a new sender on and didn't know any better about the differences between auto and marine. <-- Pre CCFan!


What's the difference?


I think it has to do with the resistance of the sender. Others can explain it better, but they send different signals.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 86BFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-25-2008 at 9:49pm
Originally posted by Riley Riley wrote:

What's the difference?


Probably $20 or $30 bucks!

I used Mercruiser 25W40 and a PCM filter with no problems but I'd follow PCMs recomendation and check the gauge before i got to excited.

Good Luck. Let us know what you find out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-28-2008 at 1:14pm
Originally posted by boat dr boat dr wrote:

I have been running the Rotella 40 T in my stroker w/ a FL 1-A filter and have no issues with the oil pressure.
My deal there and as always is use what was OEM and I bet it was not a NAPA.Your motor , do what you want. But in my shop its AC on GM and Motorcraft on FoMoCo..........
I hear a mumbling in the backgound, must be Chris and his BS .My guess Chris is you were on the design team that contracted out NAPA/ CRAPPA filters too?????????????????   


who the hell do you think the OEM's are buying there filters from? the same damn manufactures that will slap anyone's name on the side, and call it a FL 1-A. It just get's painted and labeled on it's one line out on the plant floor before it get's shipped out. Very narrow view of the world of parts manufacturing if you think there are that many different players in the filter buisness.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-28-2008 at 1:16pm
Originally posted by BuffaloBFN BuffaloBFN wrote:

Originally posted by Riley Riley wrote:

Originally posted by BuffaloBFN BuffaloBFN wrote:

This reminds me of my '79 when I put a new sender on and didn't know any better about the differences between auto and marine. <-- Pre CCFan!


What's the difference?


I think it has to do with the resistance of the sender. Others can explain it better, but they send different signals.


yes your correct the resitance that the sending unit and gauge are calibrated to.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Munday Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-28-2008 at 2:35pm
Footer I put a tee on where the oem gauge enters motor and plumbed in a mechanical gauge I can open the box anytime and look at mechanical gauge.So far the electric has always been very close I just don't trust them much.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nuttyskier2002 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-29-2008 at 4:35pm
Doc, what clearances do you run on your main and rod bearing? Please don't read anything into this question,.... I'm just curious.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brktracer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-04-2008 at 12:44am
Originally posted by boat dr boat dr wrote:

   Throw that NAPA stuff in the recycle bin and install the proper filter for this application........Boat dr


You've gotta be kidding. That's one of the best filters on the market.

BTW they're made by Wix.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SASHAY1939 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-09-2008 at 2:34pm
Just a word about oils guys. Most engine this age use straight weight oil because the additive package in multi-vis oil do not perform properly at the low oil temps in marine engines. Also I think you will find "racing oils" are non-detergent. An engine with hydralic lifters needs the detergent package.In a Ford engine 80-100 psi on a cold engine is not really uncommon. Be careful of certain oil filter with thin gauge cans. The most common one are Fram regular filters(super thin metal will bulge @80-100psi. I've seem the ribs in these can smooth from Ford high oil pressure.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-09-2008 at 3:05pm
Originally posted by SASHAY1939 SASHAY1939 wrote:

Just a word about oils guys. Most engine this age use straight weight oil because the additive package in multi-vis oil do not perform properly at the low oil temps in marine engines. Also I think you will find "racing oils" are non-detergent. An engine with hydralic lifters needs the detergent package.

My research has indicated that the technology used in the multivis oils has come a long way in the last 10-20 years. I suspect that is largely the reason why PCM, Indmar and other engine marinizers now recommend a good multivis (15w40, 20w50, etc) instead of straight weight. This recommendation often applies to the older engines as well.

Youre correct about the detergent packages in racing oil- typical racing oils often have very short recommended change intervals because of this. It is worth noting that Valvoline Racing (blue bottle) falls into this category, but Valvoline Racing VR1 (silver bottle) does NOT. The VR1 has the same detergent package as the road-going oils and has the same recommended OCI.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-09-2008 at 3:42pm
Originally posted by TRBenj TRBenj wrote:

Originally posted by SASHAY1939 SASHAY1939 wrote:

Just a word about oils guys. Most engine this age use straight weight oil because the additive package in multi-vis oil do not perform properly at the low oil temps in marine engines. Also I think you will find "racing oils" are non-detergent. An engine with hydralic lifters needs the detergent package.

My research has indicated that the technology used in the multivis oils has come a long way in the last 10-20 years. I suspect that is largely the reason why PCM, Indmar and other engine marinizers now recommend a good multivis (15w40, 20w50, etc) instead of straight weight. This recommendation often applies to the older engines as well.

Youre correct about the detergent packages in racing oil- typical racing oils often have very short recommended change intervals because of this. It is worth noting that Valvoline Racing (blue bottle) falls into this category, but Valvoline Racing VR1 (silver bottle) does NOT. The VR1 has the same detergent package as the road-going oils and has the same recommended OCI.


Chuck,
Quite alot of research has been done here by our members (including myself) regarding oil primarily on the flat tappet/ZDDP issue. One of the results was finding out, as Tim has mentioned that the VR1 silver has everything needed.

You've mentioned the oil temps in marines not being as high as cars? Are you sure? If so, one of the benefits of running a multi vis oil is it's ability of adjusting it's weight according to temperature.

We do concure that the Fram line isn't worth the money spent. Good marketing scam!!

Have you been around for awhile or just finding a great site? Welcome.


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