learning to barefoot |
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13520 |
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It is really hard to be in good form hanging directly on to the boom. The higher it is the harder it is to be in correct form IMO (while holding directly on to the boom).
Mark, your hips are coming forward but it still looks like your azz is still behind you. Really try to push your hips forward while keeping your feet in the same spot. This will also flatten your foot and establish a smoother glide. Heel riding is great and all to reduce the faceplants but catching a toe isn't so bad. You need to know where your "upper limit" is then find that sweet spot to GLIDE. |
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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I'm not talking about moving them ahead a foot...just a couple inches...small adjustments can make big differences...
also just sit down when done...lie back and slide to a stop...no need to trash a shoulder/arm and when getting up don't rush your feet in...get fully forward nice and square before you put feet in the water...putting them in before you are straight to the boat path is an easy way to blow out a knee. I love this video of Lakeboy's...talk about catchin a toe...yikes haven't seen him do this in quite a while http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YSnKrBsuWQ&feature=channel_page |
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LakeBoy
Gold Member Joined: July-19-2006 Location: Roseville, CA Status: Offline Points: 709 |
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I took a run out to the ski club over the weekend for a 3 day footfest. Sooooo sore today. Many many sets. My 12 year old video'd for me Friday, but Sat/Sun I did not capture any video. I worked a lot on the back deep water start, alternating between the shoe skis and barefeet. I have a small segment of barefoot backerds skiing in this video at 1:30 into it. I wish I had more, but you know how kids are these days. GlassSeeker has been my coach on the back deep since October so I am finally hitting some paydirt:
Hot Summer Footin' |
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LakeBoy
Gold Member Joined: July-19-2006 Location: Roseville, CA Status: Offline Points: 709 |
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I did take a header like that Sunday AM. Water was so glassy it was like ice. Something came up and grabbed my toe?!!...LOL. It rang my bell. |
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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I saw stars until the boat got back to me on Saturday...
Willie told me to do something he'd never seen and he'd help me back in the boat...I obliged |
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behindpropeller
Platinum Member Joined: July-31-2006 Status: Offline Points: 1810 |
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I had some stars on friday night too. I was working on learning how to get up backwards on the slalom ski. Well I told them to count to 5 after I put my head in the water. 5 seconds is a long time. |
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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ever see this video?...there are no bindings on the ski...its a walk around http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ND1uMYbE1Kw
tell them to go just after you put your head under. I learned how to go backwards by getting up deepwater on a flipturn ski backwards and stepping off...keep the handle behind your very bent knees to start. before we got on the 5ft line we would slide out on a low boom and then plop face first in the water...that meant go...Jeff Milbrath taught us. |
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behindpropeller
Platinum Member Joined: July-31-2006 Status: Offline Points: 1810 |
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I can walk around all day long...I have a neoprene covered ski just for it. I learned back deeps and then how to step off. The problem with walking around is it makes it very tough to learn how to flip it. When you walk around you turn your front foot around....so you ski backwards and forwards on your right foot. When you do a flip turn you flip your feet around...... |
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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to me the walk around is just a completely different animal than the flipturn. and the backwards ski start is a whole nuther animal again...all three are tricks in themselves.
we used the flipturn ski with its little toe only bindings to do deepwater ski starts backwards...then stepped off them I have tried to flipturn and ate it...never got it...I think it looks cool and know its used in the skishows...once you have a backdeep down its time to just leave the skis on the dock. |
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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here is some real old school stuff Gary Barton...I especially like the one foot wakes going the "wrong way"...he is freakin incredible
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORXP2aLFZHg&feature=related |
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LakeBoy
Gold Member Joined: July-19-2006 Location: Roseville, CA Status: Offline Points: 709 |
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The 3 amigos went out and did some footing yesterday. The wind was blowing a bit, not the usual glass. I spent the day going backwards (backerds) on the boom and on shoe skis behind the boat. I posted some of the falls I took just to give the good rides a bit of context:
Backerds Footin' |
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75 Tique
Grand Poobah Joined: August-12-2004 Location: Seven Lakes, NC Status: Offline Points: 6130 |
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Roy,
Can you fix the link. It didnt work. I went to Andy's collection but still couldnt find one foro yesterday. As a rookie-just-learning bacerds-guy, I am anxious to check it out to pick up whaterver tips I can see. |
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_____________
“So, how was your weekend?” “Well, let me see…sun burn, stiff neck, screwed up back, assorted aches and pains….yup, my weekend was great, thanks for asking.” |
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Hollywood
Moderator Group Joined: February-04-2004 Location: Twin Lakes, WI Status: Offline Points: 13520 |
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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those videos are all Roys....he's sacfooter...I'm just a lucky beneficiary...
probably the biggest thing to help you get a backdeep is shoe skis. and at first bigger is better so if you can spare the cash get some of the big scarpa shoes...and then also some of either the new KSO's or the BFC's...or the scarpa cutdowns....they will pay off and you can use them for alot of other stuff like wakes(one foots, or two) turns-back to front and front to backs...and then 360's and 540's and 720's on up...just be very serious on them they can hurt you if you get careless |
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LakeBoy
Gold Member Joined: July-19-2006 Location: Roseville, CA Status: Offline Points: 709 |
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Good point on the bacerds ski, foot skis rule. I was not open to them at first because I never saw any instructional material pushing them. My bro' Dave learned to get up in a weekend with Davis Small, seeing that opened the door for me.
All that time face down on the water at 30+ MPH going nowhere really paid off when I jumped off the shoes onto barefeet. For record purposes I attempted at LEAST 200 starts on the barefeet, and at least 20-30 on the shoes before I ever rode one away. I would say I have at least 150 of those on video. One of the harder things I have worked on. I got discouraged, but never gave up. Andy could say the same cause he was there every step of the way. The ONE thing that changed it all was when Andy said arch the small of your back (in a sex similar pull-out move for a guy) and that was enough to start folding in the middle. For me, pressing down hard with the chest and chin on the water never created much bend. Guys: I am really stoked, I never took a forwards run yesterday, and even started some backwards one-foots on the shoe skis. |
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behindpropeller
Platinum Member Joined: July-31-2006 Status: Offline Points: 1810 |
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If you are having trouble getting from the power washer in your face to face out of the water.... Take that handle behind your back and try to break it in half. Try it out of the water first. Tim |
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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for Roy it was two things that lead to his breakthru...arch the back and scarpa big shoes...he had been up on his barefeet a few times but just did not "get it" yet...too much happening too much spray too much thinking...the big shoes got him up and skiing everytime once he tried them, then I had him go on his new KSO's a couple times then on his feet and viola he was up and skiing bacerds barefoot....one other thing was his never give up attitude.
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21192 |
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Tim, can you explain this? Ive struggled with longline backdeeps... cant seem to get my chin off the water- Ive injured my groin the last 2 seasons by doing an endo from the split position. Plants are fine, just cant stand it up. Starts on the boom havent been a problem. I have recently tried "bringing my legs underneath me" to pop out of the water- seems to require much less effort than the whole chest down/ass up deal. |
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7957 |
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Tim B. is that BFN LH rotation?
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behindpropeller
Platinum Member Joined: July-31-2006 Status: Offline Points: 1810 |
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Let me get a picture tonight and post it on the breaking the handle.
Tim- Another common problem people have when doing long line back deeps are: 1. Keeping their ankles too tight....which makes you plough through the water instead of ride on it. 2. Letting their feet get spread too far apart, some of this is from not turning their feet into the water. I'm a back step off guy....but pull lots of people backwards. I have the same problem on the long line back deeps. I can't stand back deeps....so I just step off. Watch this video...see how his feet are when he plants... http://www.eaglewetsuits.com/videos/ShowSkiChallenge/HoltzyTumble.wmv |
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behindpropeller
Platinum Member Joined: July-31-2006 Status: Offline Points: 1810 |
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Sorry wrong video....
Still a good video. |
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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TRB-
I can guess already that you have done too many boom starts without going longline...after 4 successful boom backdeeps you should go longline...it takes longer to get up longline and you are probably trying to get up too soon...you need to use these three words...patience patience patience...your pull should be a slow/medium no more/faster than that and should only get you going about 30-35 at first...if you come up too soon you will catch heels because the boat will just pull you over...you have to resist the urge to get up and stay down so your chin is the last thing that leaves the water and keep it down there close to the water...1-2 feet off...bent in half...wait for the speed to come up...do not stand up...resist the pull...arms straight out relaxed...your butt should be the highest thing til the speed is reached then you can rise up your head/back a little more...also do it on shoe skis first to get the hang of it. go back and forth from shoe skis to barefeet and back again...do it exactly the same with shoes or without |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21192 |
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Bruce, no- the BFN is a righty.
Tim, glad to hear Im not the only one who has struggled with the LL backdeep! Cool video too. Andy, youre right- Ive been going backwards for about 2 years now. Im doing back ones and back to fronts on the shoes, starting to transition those to my feet. Every spring when I get the nerve up to try it LL, I get hurt- and I limp through the rest of the season without trying it again. What has happened in the past is I never get my chin off the water- not one foot, not even one inch. I get a good plant and Im up to full speed (or at least 30) when I realize Im stuck and either let go or bury my heels and do the dreaded reverse spread endo. My biggest mistake is not trying it on the shoes first... and I think I have a better way to think about bringing my legs underneath me. Even on the boom, I stay nice and low for a while before settling in- so I dont feel that rushing is my problem. Ive had a very accomplished footer pull me, and he was a little bit at a loss. Ill see if Paul Macdonald has any good tips when I ski with him in a few weeks. Id really appreciate any tips though! |
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SN206
Grand Poobah Joined: February-25-2009 Location: Fort Worth, TX Status: Offline Points: 2339 |
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Is he still skiing w/ Scarpa. Are you guys having a clinic or going down to Winter Haven? |
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...those who have fallen and those who will.
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21192 |
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Yup, he's still with Scarpa- he's coming up here the week before LG. |
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behindpropeller
Platinum Member Joined: July-31-2006 Status: Offline Points: 1810 |
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Where is here, Tim?
Ill be in New Hampshire the weekend before LG. Tim |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21192 |
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Tim, its in Mass, not far from the NH border. If youve got free time towards the end of the week, there may still be openings. I think it runs Wed-Fri (Im skiing the 11th). I can put you in touch with the guy coordinating it- shoot me an email: TRBenj@gmail.com
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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TRB- arch your lower back to get the butt up in the air...that is the key...Roy was doing exactly what you described as most people do and I usually say "poke your butt up" but with Roy it took saying "arch your lower back" that got him to break at the waist and the rest is video history...he's doing it.
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GlassSeeker
Grand Poobah Joined: November-26-2008 Location: Elk Grove, CA. Status: Offline Points: 2421 |
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also use a neckbrace...every time all the time
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behindpropeller
Platinum Member Joined: July-31-2006 Status: Offline Points: 1810 |
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+1 |
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