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GT40 has no power

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97supersport View Drop Down
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    Posted: September-08-2009 at 1:24pm
A month ago my '97 Nautique started acting hesitant towards the end of a full day of boating. It was very weak out of the hole and would only reach 3500 rpms (should be 4800). As I continuted using the boat the max rpms dropped to 2500. A friend suggested changing the fuel filter. I replaced the filter which was the original from 1997 (I bought the boat in 2003). Put the boat in the water to test it and it ran great, rpms were actually over 5000. I went to use it this weekend and it was back to the same hesitant, no power, and maximum of 3000 rpms. Can anyone offer me any advise for the next area too troubleshoot?

Thanks
MD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gun-driver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-08-2009 at 1:33pm
How long ago did you change the filter?
And how much did you use the boat with the new filter until it started acting up again?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bradtm16 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-08-2009 at 1:39pm
How long did you run it when you tested? The fuel filter I assume your talking about is the fuel/water seperator (looks like an oil filter)? Sounds like you may have gotten water in your fuel. Take the fuel/water seperator off and empty it, look at what your pouring out and see if it's mostly water (clear). Put it back on and run it again. If it runs fine for a while then starts losing power again, you most likely need to siphon and refill. Before you siphon, let some others chime in. If you do siphon, don't buy a new fuel/water seperator, just empty the one you just bought.

Sometimes this could be a firing issue, but it doesn't sound like it though, due to the fact that it was fixed by replacing the fuel/water seperator.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 97supersport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-08-2009 at 2:22pm
I just replaced the filter two weeks ago and ran the boat that day for about ten minutes to see if that fixed the problem. It ran great so I was sure that was the problem and pulled the boat out of the water and did not use it again until this weekend when it acted up again.

When I pulled the old fuel filter I was expecting to see water in the bowl. I was suprised to find that there was none. As a precation I added two cans of STP fuel injector cleaner and I can of dry gas just incase there was water in the tank. But from all indications I did not find any water in the system.
MD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gun-driver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-08-2009 at 7:31pm
I'm thinking bad fuel.
If the filter fixed the problem then as you ran the same gas it started again seems like a good place to start.
New fuel and filter.
Then see what happens make sure you get all the fuel out and check for sediment.
I would maybe even pull the tank (depending on how the gas looks that's coming out)so you can get a look inside. Sounds like a pain in the ass but pulling the tank may save filters and head aches.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote behindpropeller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-08-2009 at 8:21pm
Do you have one of those portable evinrude tanks?

Just pull and plug the low pressure fuel inlet. Hook up the portable tank and go from there.

Tim

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 97supersport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-09-2009 at 1:21pm
Does anyone know if a '97 Ski Nautique would have a plug for like an OBD code reader so that I could check that?

I am having a hard time believing it is bad gas. The fuel is less than two months old and I have yet to get any water in the seperator bowl or see any other signs of water. I have experience water in my gas with another boat so I am familiar with how it acts and this does not resemble that. I will pull samples again and check though.

At full throttle it runs smooth not sluggish, just no top end. By that I mean the boat only runs 3000 rpms/30 mph, instead of 5000 rpms/50 mph. However, it is very sluggish out of the hole and does occasionally back fire on its way to full speed.
MD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luchog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-09-2009 at 2:50pm
I think it's getting into LIMP mode.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kapla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-09-2009 at 6:31pm
I think you should check the entire fuel system, debris somewhere is restricting the fuel flow thus taking some power. Did you check the fuel pump, those are electric arenĀ“t they? maybe this are the sympthoms before going dead..just my .02
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scottb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-09-2009 at 7:51pm
Originally posted by 97supersport 97supersport wrote:

Does anyone know if a '97 Ski Nautique would have a plug for like an OBD code reader so that I could check that?


Yes. What engine? For GT-40, refer to the GT-40 Service Manual. If you do not have a Star Tester, use this procedure to access the trouble codes. You will need the service manual to interpret the codes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fl Inboards Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-09-2009 at 10:39pm
I think I would be setting up a fuel pressure gauge and checking if the fuel pressure drops before I go anywhere else. These can be purchased at any auto parts store and are not that expensive. also take a look at your knock sensor wire and the conditioner unit behind the ecu bracket. check that all grounds are clean as well as the battery connections.
Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 97supersport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-11-2009 at 10:52am
I pulled the distributor cap last night and it was full of corrosion. I have a new cap and rotor on order so we'll see if this solves all my problems. Have other people experience moisture getting under the cap and what have you done to prevent it?
MD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 97supersport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-11-2009 at 10:58am


Here is a picture of what I found under the cap.
MD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kapla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-11-2009 at 1:23pm
now that is some serious rust!!! WD40 it!!! LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MartyMabe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-13-2009 at 8:34pm
Maintenance,Maintenance,Maintenance,guys. Check your plugs,wires,ignition components ,etc.,every year or at least every other year.These things can't run on gas and oil alone.This is a great place to find answers,but remember to give as much info as possible.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-13-2009 at 9:49pm
Originally posted by MartyMabe MartyMabe wrote:

Maintenance,Maintenance,Maintenance,guys. Check your plugs,wires,ignition components ,etc.


Marty's correct! Yes, I just had to do the tune up involving plugs, cap, rotor, point set and capacitor on my 312. They only lasted 29 years and I'm really disappointed. Haven't done any wires yet and they are the original from 1964. Maybe I'll do them in 5 years or so. I'll see!

Seriously, 29 years is stretching it but it always ran great up until this summer when it developed a WOT miss. I never had any starting problems. The 29 years equates to about 600 hours.

97SS,
Are you covering up your boat wet with a cover that traps moisture?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-13-2009 at 11:04pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

   

Marty's correct! Yes, I just had to do the tune up involving plugs, cap, rotor, point set and capacitor on my 312. They only lasted 29 years and I'm really disappointed.


I'll bet the new ones won't last as long Pete. I have heard the replacements quality is not as good.Since hardley anyone uses points anymore, how are they going to make a profit if Pete only buys them once every 29 years I have heard complaints in the vintage motorcycle community.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-13-2009 at 11:15pm
Gary,
I've heard the same thing. The actual material used on the contacts isn't as good. I still have the box so I'll check to see if it states: "made in China"!!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 65 'cuda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-13-2009 at 11:25pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Gary,
I've heard the same thing. The actual material isn't as good. I still have the box so I'll check to see if it states: "made in China"!!!


You said a mouthful there Pete! Applies to nearly any product manufactured there.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-13-2009 at 11:53pm
Sad thing is even if you wanted to spend the extra money and get the better ones, you can't and this applies to alot more than points as you guy's well know
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-14-2009 at 10:32am
I just checked the box for the tune up kit. States made in Mexico! Well, not as bad as China! But still half way there!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 97supersport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2009 at 5:34pm
Well, that wasn't it either. Just recieved my new cap and rotor Tuesday and threw the boat in yesterday and it runs the exact same (like crap). I have a source for a fuel pressure gauge and a Ford Test code retriever. I'll keep you informed of my progress.

pbrainard - I do not cover the boat, it is garaged and I usually open the engine cover for venting.

Thanks for the advise
MD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fl Inboards Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2009 at 5:57pm
Hi their.
I would not bother with the code reader. Their are only a few sensors that will spit out a code.
First make sure your fuel pressure is correct and holding. If the motor is going into power reduction or limp mode more than likley the oil pressure switch has failed (very Common) then their is a possibility of the water temp switch that is in the same circut failing. check timing make sure that the timing is correct, you will have to pull the little grey spout out of the ignition to stabilize timing also make sure when the motor is reved up that their is at least 30 degrees of advance.
At PCM school we were taught to run diagnostics with multi meter.
Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 97supersport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2009 at 11:51am
FI - When I test the fuel pressure should it be while the boat is running or can it be dry docked with the key on? Also how long should the pressure hold (30 sec - 1 min)? If the boat was going into limp mode would I be able to reach 30 mph? If my oil pressure switch has failed would my dash oil pressure gauge give any adverse indications? When the boat started acting up it was towards the end of a full day of boating. Would the timing "go out" on its own?
Thanks for your help
MD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote C-Bass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2009 at 12:20pm
97Supersport...

Something extremely easy to check would be resistance of your coil wire to the distributor. My parents boat had very similar issues, would run fine but after it had ran a good while, it would start losing power. We checked that coil wire with a multi-meter and found that it was bad internally. As you would barely move/flex the wire, the Ohms would skyrocket. I'm guessing that as this wire heated up throughout the day that it's resistance started increasing to the point of where the spark was missing out and the engine was losing power.

Anyways, one new coil wire later, the boat ran perfectly fine, all day. It's really easy to check, just make sure the Ohm's on that wire are near 0.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 97supersport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-12-2009 at 5:44pm
I was able to aquire a fuel pressure gauge. The manual says I should have 30-40 psi. However I was only getting 20 psi. Ordered a new high pressure fuel pump and installed it. Boat ran just as bad as it had been. Checked fuel pressure and it was still at 20 psi. Started thinking about what powers the fuel pump and desided to check the battery. Put a new battery in the boat and it ran just fine. So after changing my fuel filter, Cap, rotor, coil wire, high pressure fuel pump it my have been that he battery was weak enough that it wasn't allowing the fuel pump to supply enough fuel. That is the latest on my findings.   Thanks for all you suggestions and ideas.

MD
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