Windsor vs PCM

Hello guys,

I have been pondering and wondering about the difference between Windsor motors and PCM's. I have a couple questions I guess I know you guys can answer. After seeing some of posts of people's boat's and having different motors, of either a PCM or a Windsor Ford engine. Did Nautique choose to spread the options out with different motors between these two or is that a peoples choice. I see different rigs, maybe be the same style boat and have different motors. And which one is better in power, and is the better motor. Is it just preference or is one better than the other?

oK, i gotcha.. Stupid question but had to ask. Can you find 390 Ford's anymore? Or they extinct for marine...

Wow! I wonderd if you could find one anymore.

Lee,
Gary's correct!!
Alan's find is a great example. Not many 331 Hemi's around!
Phil just picked up a 390 Interceptor for his 1st generation SN.
I found the 1927 Universal Flexifour for my 1918.
Are you looking for a 390? What for? If so, keep a lookout on this site. Ebay isn't a bad spot ether.

Theres may be some mixed opinions about the performance differences. This is off the subject but that makes me think I remember seeing a bfn with a 460 in it, was this an option or am I imagining it? anyone?

skicat2001 wrote: Pete, Yea I would like to do an upgrade from that 351 in a yr or so. I would think a 390 would fit in 85 2001.. Them old style ford motors are animals, and they last a long time. When I made the comment earlier about my dad's best friend, he had a 390 Ford Police Interceptor in his 1967 Century Resorter, and refer back then about them. Would I see a huge difference from the 351 I have know? Mine is healthy..

You've got to really look at the HP/torque curves of different engines and compare them. You just can't say that a 390 is going to outperform a 351 especially when you need to factor in engine weight.

Back in "the good old days", it was a common bragging right to claim someone had a "police interceptor" engine. Many would even claim that the Interceptor engine was marinized by the same company that did the engines for the police cars. Not true and goes along with the bragging rights of peoples claims to how fast their boat would go. Of course this was before the days of GPS!!! I'd have to say your dads friend was stretching the truth!

Yes the Century's were fast compaired to other boats. They were a light weight hull (single plank) and they were notorious for putting big engines in.

A engine built up for a police car is a poor choice for a marine application. Ideally, different torque/HP curves were used back then.

I have the 390 Interceptor marine HP/torque curve at home and can post some specs later.

Pete and Bruce,
Yea the ol 390 was a great motor, and I would like to see the specs on it. He had the 21ft Resorter which where heavy, fiberglass bottom with Mahogony wood on the sides.. Beautiful Boats, his took for every to jump out of the hole but once it plained, oooo wweee.. Bruce, if that is right on the 351 ford and 390 ford, I love the sound of a direct drive crusing, but If the 390 does not add more than I just assume stay with the 351 then..

Lee, It will be interesting to see what Pete's charts indicate. A 351 is definately more practical. Until about a year ago, I didn't understand why anyone would want to fool around with these old obsolete engines. I really thought why not just drop a new crate Vortec or rebuilt 351 in and be done with it? But, I am learning that this old obsolete stuff is really cool. But, maybe not for you as your boat is probably your regular ride.

Lee,
Looking at the 390 HP/torque curve, as it was marinized by Interceptor, it shows a max HP of 260 at 4400 RPM. Torque max's out at 190 at about 2750 RPM. Sorry I don't have the specs on the 351 but I'm sure someone like Alan can chime in. Now, it would also be interesting to get some input from Reid who had the H/M boys do the job on his 390!!!

Stock Interceptor 390s had from 260 hp to 300 hp, depending on the year and model.

Tim,
The low torque surprised me as well! I too would have thought it would have been higher. I double checked the graph I have and the 190 is it???

I doubt anyone's a bigger fan of the 390 or BBF than I am. Like Bruce stated though, I don't feel it's the best or most practical option for an engine upgrade in a later model boat, but more suited as a vintage-correct upgrade in an older boat. However, practicalilty hasn't always been the basis for many of the engine upgrades seen on this site. In your case Lee, I feel the more-increasing common family of 351 Windsor stroker engines in the 393 or 408 variety would prove to be a less expensive and more powerful option. We just ordered a 408 destined for a 1992 Excel in place of a 351, which will be installed in the next 8 weeks.    

I believe Bruce likes the sound of our 390 mainly because it's a little louder from the higher 10.3 compression. But even with a cam upgrade, Edelbrock intake, and the higher compression, the Desktop Dyno only showed +/-330hp, up from the original 300 factory rated hp. A 351 stroker will surpass that with ease. But if you really like the classic looks of that FE Ford big block, they actually now sell valve cover adaptors for the 351 allowing the installation of the BBF wide/tall style covers. They're popular with the Cobra kit car guys searching for that original 427BBF look. They increase the width of the engine by about 2" but I doubt they'll fit with the standard center-rise exhausts. Food for thought.   

i will though, the 460 engine was converted from a steam engine somewhere back in the old days, actually you do see alot of the BBF in jet boats.
Reid, im more of a ford fan now than i was 2 or 3 years ago

6.0's will go down in history, BTW when they shot that 460 into space they shouldve left it there lol, nice to hear from you

i still would put a bbc in an ole model A,lol i wouldnt touch a ford before this site, always Bowtie....now only if they would marinize one of those new 5.7 Hemis