Kids Sports question |
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harddock
Platinum Member Joined: June-04-2008 Location: Toontown, MA Status: Offline Points: 1763 |
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Posted: March-07-2011 at 10:12am |
As a parent of children that play school or town sports, Would you rather a coach play the best players and go for the win or let everyone take part even if it means your team may not win?
I had multiple games yesterday. All were loses but the soccer teams let everyone play, and even moved around the positions, but lost. The basketball game had just the older kids play. Even the "special" kids only went in for a minute and we lost. I statrted thinking about the parents that drove an hour, paid to get in, take time out of their day to sit and not watch their kid play. Was it fair? Was it just to boost the coaches ego? Should they have been told upfront they weren't going to play? |
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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you let them join a sport where everyone participates, ie, swimming, track. Nothing worse than a pissed off parent out in the bleachers, funny though how the coaches kid is always the pitcher
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Chris4x4gill2
Senior Member Joined: August-25-2008 Location: Smith Lake, AL Status: Offline Points: 358 |
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depends on the level of competition. If your playing anything under middle / high school level then the purpose of sports is to teach the kids, winning is secondary. As you progress to higher levels winning becomes more important.
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tullfooter
Grand Poobah Joined: March-02-2007 Location: White Lake, MI Status: Offline Points: 2225 |
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Totally agree with this statement. IMO, early middle school is the last time when participation is the key. At the high school level, winning is important for the team, and the school. My two sons were/are involved in individual sports, swimming and cross country, where every athlete is able to compete. They were/are also on the lacrosse team, where winning is very important. Many kids on the lacrosse team are involved in extra clinics, off season leagues, and other extra training efforts in an attempt to better their skills. Some kids practice much harder and put in more time than their teammates. If the kid has better skills, he should get more playing time in an effort to win the game. Also, if the coach sees that a kid may not have the skills, but busts his butt at practice, he may give that kid a little extra playing time over the kid who just puts in his time. But as Eric stated, there is always politics, especially in the team sports, but that's another subject. |
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Morfoot
Grand Poobah Joined: February-06-2004 Location: South Lanier Status: Offline Points: 5322 |
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Well as a former little league umpire and former step-dad to a daughter who played MS volleyball the sport should be about the kids. Parents pay good money for their child to play and time is something that you cannot get back and parents take time to take their kids to practice (to and fro) and go to SEE their kids play.
When my former step daughter played volleyball at the middle school I had parents from the OTHER team come up and tell me to be sure and tell the coach thanks for making sure all his players got the chance to play for their school. It was mid season and their daughters had yet to play in a game cause the coach played his best 6 and that was it. I felt so bad for those parents that I called the principal of the opposing team what happened at the match and that he as a administrator should be ashamed of his coach and how upset parents were. Ran into the same parents at the county Championship and nothing had changed. Daughters hadn't played all year and you could see that on the bench. My step daughters team ended up county champs and I feel that it was because ALL the girls made it happen not just the top 6 players. I also agree with Tull in that those players who give their best in practice and in the game should be rewarded with playing time. Bottom line is...."If I'm paying, my kid better be playing!" |
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"Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman"
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quinner
Grand Poobah Joined: October-12-2005 Location: Unknown Status: Offline Points: 5828 |
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Do think that's a tough question to answer without being more specific.
Coached Alex in Hockey until High School, am coaching Maddies Hockey and Soccer teams and additionally have been a sideline parent for Football, Baseball, Soccer & Hockey among other things in both house, travel and high school programs. Here in the Midwest there are several different team formats, most common are House League (play against other teams from the same organization) and Travel (play other organizations with teams at specific skill levels). In the house league its all about equal play however in travel it is more about winning and that escalates even further at the higher skill levels. That's where it is up to the parents, if you sign your child up for a competitive travel program be prepared to watch them sit until they are skilled enough to contribute or else put them in a house league if all you want is equal play. As an example Maddies first year playing travel soccer the coach had her ride the bench alot, so I was the parent driving an hour each way to see my child play for 5 mins. Of course the cost escalates as the teams become more competitive and in most cases the level of coaching, time commitment, etc. escalates as well. I could go on and on on this subject particularly from a coaches perspective, first thing that comes to mind is how much of a PITA parents can be, LOL, however they can also be your greatest asset. Either way hopefully in the end the kids come away from any team with new friends, new skills and great memories. |
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harddock
Platinum Member Joined: June-04-2008 Location: Toontown, MA Status: Offline Points: 1763 |
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In my observation of this particular team I see kids that look like a deer in the headlights when they get the ball, another who really doesn't understand the concept of passing, and a couple that play because their parents/coach relationship, while kids that goes to every practice, and clinics and play on other leagues get no time because of age. This to me takes away from the teamwork concept and is partly to blame for loosing.
The same school girls team playss everyone and some of those younger kids that if on the boys team would be benched are scoring and all the parents are proud of all the kids. I am not one to armchair coach and don't want to jeapordize my sons playing time by talking to the coach but at JV grammer school level (where everyone makes the team) I feel teamwork is more important that playing favorites or just trying to win. I would think putting a younger one in during a game and letting him play with and be guided by the olders would be more beneficial than waiting for a 15 point lead and throwing them all out on the court for a few minutes and when the score gets a little closer yank them and put in your favorites. My son goes to a premier soccer academy and they have a winter league where they actually play kids that are a little older. It is meant for them to use the skills they learn in practice in an actual game. They are encouraged to pass a certain # of times before even attempting a goal. They usually out footwork the bigger town teams and have a fair share of wins because of their teamwork. |
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Chris4x4gill2
Senior Member Joined: August-25-2008 Location: Smith Lake, AL Status: Offline Points: 358 |
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I have been on the players side of the equation, but not the parents side yet. That's coming soon though.
My brother and I played multiple sports from little league and up. Me through Senior year of High School, my brother through College. In the youth leagues (we played Baseball Basketball and Soccer) I think is it very important to make usre every shild get s there fair share of playing time. A win is nice, but it really isnt important at that level. I was on teams that were .500 at the end of the season that I loved playing for just as mich as the teams where we went 19-1. What's important is getting that work ethic installed so that they can see the results and improvements that the time spent practicing accomplishes. I'd say that this applies for any level of sports that tryouts arent required to make the team (cuts). Around here that level is typically 7/8th grade for basketball and high school for everything else. |
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Chris4x4gill2
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I agree that this is counter productive. It's only going to frustrate the players and confuse them. In basketball for instance, when I coached we would leave in an experienced guard to help bring the ball in and call plays, while subbing in younger guys to the other positions, or put the #2 Point guard in with the #1 wing and forward to get them experience together. |
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C-Bass
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From a non parent point of view, I agree with Chris4x4gill, it depends on the level of competition. I definitely agree that in the younger leagues coaches need to make an effort to play everyone, not necessarily equal playing time, but everyone should be getting in the game. Reaching high school levels, and maybe even as early as middle school as well, kids and parents need to realize not everyone is gifted at everything. It's the parents job to help/encourage their kid to discover and develop what they're good at, not pretend like they can be good at everything.
As a general observation, parents have stopped being parents, and have started becoming friends with their children. It's great to be friends with your child, but it should never come before being a parent. For some reason we feel the need to protect kids from anything and everything that may be difficult for them to deal with. Call it the "pussification" of America. It's not a coincidence that with most accomplishments people speak of, there is always a story of adversity that they had to push through to achieve it. ...got off track a little. But it's all related. |
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Keeganino
Grand Poobah Joined: October-27-2009 Location: North Carolina Status: Offline Points: 2063 |
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I have coached 3 seasons of soccer at the YMCA for Co-ed 6-9 year olds. Their philosophy is that every kids plays. Excellent concept but when applied to the real world becomes tricky. Here's why- The one coach who has done this for 10 years gets all the good players. All 3 years I coached this one team won all the games. At the Y you are able to request your team. SO when the new season comes around all the good players know that coach H's team always wins. So who's team do they request to be on next year, and who gets all the new 6 year olds that dont know better and are playing for the first time?
Second thing that made me crazy was that you had to play all the kids whether they showed up for practice or tried at all once they were there. Sports teach a lot of different lessons. Some of the most important are dedication, discipline, and teamwork. I had some kids that I would not have played if it had been a competitive league because they never listened, showed up for practice sometimes and refused to work as a team. How can you teach them anything if they behave that way and they get to play anyway. I know when I was playing as early as 1st grade it was understood that if you did not earn it you did not play. Different times these days. It also made my stepson crazy who worked hard and did his best to be a leader. Needless to say he is moving on to a more serious league this year. When it comes to the coaches kid being the star if they earn it they earn it. If not that is messed up. My stepson scored more points than all his teammates combined and he played every position on the field through the season(as did all the kids). The fact that I was the coach did not accomplish that. He earned it out there on the field while all the other kids were picking their noses looking at the clouds. You get back what you put in. Man its easy to rant about your kids isnt it! |
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Keeganino
Grand Poobah Joined: October-27-2009 Location: North Carolina Status: Offline Points: 2063 |
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Well put! I see this all the time. Adversity is what makes victory sweet. If everything is easy and you always win, winning loses all meaning. |
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"working on these old boats may not be cost effective but as it shows its what it brings into your life that matters" -Roger
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Hawktique
Senior Member Joined: June-27-2009 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 456 |
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I see a certain level of the same in wrestling too. Some coaches/parents are teaching their kids how to win at the k-4 level, developing very bad habits along the way. I may not teach my kids/students to win right now, but I'm setting a great technical foundation for future success. My 3 rules for my kids 1. Try your best 2. Have fun. 3. Learn from your mistakes. No where do I say go out and win, and I tell them that all the time. My son (6) went to state this year, won his first two, lost his last two. Ending up 12-4 for his first year. Me and the other coaches/teammates cheer on even in defeat and are glad our kids show class. I saw other parents chewing out their kids for the mistakes they made on the mat.
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Hollywood
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Sweep the leg Johnny
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C-Bass
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tnplicky
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tnplicky
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Okie Boarder
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As some have said, it depends. If it is a competitive league, older kids, or tournament of some sort, I would say the idea is to win. Recreational related it should be about the kids learning and growing. Our oldest son was on a recreational baseball team last year that was pretty good. They played all the kids in and out through normal games, but the coaching staff made it clear that tournaments were about winning and we didn't want to pay good money to be in the tournament only to be outed the first day. In those cases it was a mutual agreement with the coaching staff and some consultation with the parents. The coaches also gave the parents the choice to opt out of the tournaments and only play the rec games for the kids that wouldn't get much play time in the tournaments. It worked fairly well. The bottom line to me is that the ground rules of how the team is going to be managed should be discussed with all involved very early in the process.
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harddock
Platinum Member Joined: June-04-2008 Location: Toontown, MA Status: Offline Points: 1763 |
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Okie, That at least is fair, explained and upfront. This was 4,5,6 grade grammer school kids that drove an hour, parents paid to get it etc. The coach was asked the night before if everyone was gonna play. He said he wasn't sure. These kids are still in the learning the game stage. 7&8 grade and high school the teams should be weeded out by then and yes a more competitive team with less subs. Even then the subs should see some court time.
The same level girls team plays everyone, they play better as a team and win. Better coaching? They have tryouts but every one makes the team. No one gets cut. That should be a sign that it is instructional and everyone should get play time. This doesn't necessarily mean a full quarter or whole game but at least off the bench and in the mix. I guess it's all part of the politics of school sports. |
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