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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: cutlass bearing questions
    Posted: June-15-2011 at 4:03am
So I've got a couple questions before I buy a new cutlass bearing for my 78.

Vesconite or brass and rubber?

And 2 piece or 1 piece?


So, what are your opinions?   

I'm not excited about having to pull the driveshaft out, and probably the rudder, but i'm sure the threads on CCF will get me through that part.
It seems the shaft coupling and log are the only slightly tricky things.

2 piece cutlass bearings look actuaaly more difficult than 1 piece ones, but I may be wrong.
I'll run the gfo/ goretex packing for the ds, and regular packing for the rudder.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luchog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 4:08am
I prefer brass and rubber, 1 piece is easier but is getting harder to get by. 2 pieces are fine too.

You dont need to take off the rudder.

Dont go hitting on the coupler as you will crap the tappers. You need an extractor for it. It's a good idea to have one made for the strut bearing as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 8:42am
Tom,
I feel you'll be fine with the project. There are threads on what you need to do and of course you always have this group to fall back on if you run into a problem. I too prefer the old brass and rubber. This is probably because in my mind there's not much time out there on the newer plastic to prove itself and I've have had very mixed results with some plastic bushings in a industrial application.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrCC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 12:46pm
Best price I've found deepblueyachtsupply

I use the freezer for installation.


Looks like they've gone up. Last one was 34.00.
Of course that's better than 62.00 locally.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 2:40pm
So the 1 piece ones are preferable? I think they would be easier to put in than trying to align the 2 pieces properly.

Deep blue has them for 39.99, 1" ID x 1-1/4" OD x 4" long is what I need right?

I don't see packing at all on the deep blue site. I'd rather not pay for shipping from 2 places if I can.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 3:13pm
Tom,
Deepblue has it but it's the regular wax/flax packing and not the god Gortex.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 3:24pm
Thanks Pete, so 4" long is the right length? I'm trying to order these in the next half hour to get them to me for weekend work if possible. Of course I don't see any length of the cutlass bearing listed on any of the sites.

I definitely want the goretex packing.
78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior
GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kapla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 3:26pm
not sure the 78 strut are the same..but in my 92 the 6" is the one..
didnĀ“t know that when I bought mine, so I was 2" short...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 3:29pm
Yeah, I forgot to look at the strut on my boat and measure it last night. DOH!!!

The ones on DIM sure don't look that long. I'll see what the replacement struts are in length.
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GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kapla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 3:39pm
price is fine go2marine has them listed in 51 for the 4"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kapla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 3:43pm
here you can see the puller to put the bearing in
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 3:50pm
Tom,
The 4" is the one.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 4:25pm
I heard dish soap applied to the brass on the bushing will help intall it too.

I'm definitely going to make a 1/2" threaded rod installer.

I just need to read up on the coupler removal for the driveshaft.

I ended up buying the 4" one from deep blue, and I'm trying to order the goretex packing from DIM, along with another impeller but their site is acting up.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kapla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 4:34pm
I used nothing, just cleaned the bore with fine grit to smoothen the surface, and the installer did the trick!!!

Coupler removal its easy using the longer bolt and socket trick, putting it back toghether is more complicated if you have a single taper shaft, as it needs to be shrink fitted, dual taper is piece of cake!!!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 8:10pm
Seb, is there any way to tell before you take the coupler apart if it is a dual or single taper?

Shrink fitting, do you mean heating the coupler? Like the opposite of throwing the cutlass bearing in the freezer?
78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior
GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-15-2011 at 8:23pm
Originally posted by horkn horkn wrote:

Seb, is there any way to tell before you take the coupler apart if it is a dual or single taper?

Shrink fitting, do you mean heating the coupler? Like the opposite of throwing the cutlass bearing in the freezer?

Tom,
The dual taper ARE shaft system is relatively new so you have the single taper. Be prepared to use the deep socket and threaded rod trick to get it off the prop shaft. Yes, it is heat shrink to fit back on. Do measure the bore and shaft. It should be .000 to about - .0005" interference. If it's not within that, then it has fretted due to a misalignment problem. Instead of having to purchase a new coupling half and having it bored to match the old shaft, the ARE system is the way to go.

Yes, the coupling is heated and then quickly put onto the shaft and it will shrink down.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-21-2011 at 10:26am
The only 6" I found was at CC. I tried SE first for kicks, and wow do they miss Woody. The guy I talked to didn't know what I was asking for.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 3:42pm
ok, got my parts. headed to the store now for threaded rod and washers.

what do you think about these pics...

I think the strut is not aligned....

the port side has a slightly larger gap.





78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior
GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrCC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 4:14pm
I think your pics are very nice.
Especially the one with the beautiful lawn.
And, you are correct about your strut not being inlign.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 4:34pm
Tom,
Your strut is definitely whacked and even look's bent (twisted)! Don't forget about this:
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Yes, it is heat shrink to fit back on. Do measure the bore and shaft. It should be .000 to about - .0005" interference. If it's not within that, then it has fretted due to a misalignment problem.

How's the log look?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrCC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 5:08pm
What happened to the four blade Acme?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 5:15pm
Originally posted by DrCC DrCC wrote:

What happened to the four blade Acme?


I slightly dinged it, and that is why I am running the old federal 3 blade.

I really don't think that hit caused the acme 208 to get dinged up got the strut out of line though. Maybe it did bump the strut out of line, but it couldn't have been enough to bend the strut. Those cnc props are not very durable and ding easily. I think that is more of an optical illusion, as the strut simply looks a little crooked as it mounts to the hull, and not bent out of whack.


The shaft is only off .015 from port to starboard at the coupler. The strut looks to be clearly off more than that.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 5:21pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Tom,
Your strut is definitely whacked and even look's bent (twisted)! Don't forget about this:
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Yes, it is heat shrink to fit back on. Do measure the bore and shaft. It should be .000 to about - .0005" interference. If it's not within that, then it has fretted due to a misalignment problem.

How's the log look?


Yep. I'll have my machinist buddy that is coming over to help me bring his calipers so we can check that out. I just got back with my all thread, washers and nuts.

Log looks fine.

Also disconnected from the output flange on the tranny, the DS does not spin easily, and that's why the prop is on.   You can't spin it by hand, and need the prop as leverage. I'm guessing the strut being out of line is the reason for that.


So, how do you align the strut accurately??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 5:23pm
Also, notice the strut appears to have no set screws for the cutlass bearing? There appears to be 2 raised casting nubs, but no threaded holes with set screws in them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 6:09pm
The output from the tranny when disconnected from the tranny spins freely, and the coupler was on pretty good even after the bolts were taken off.

While the motor may be MA a little, I think the real issue is the strut being not in line with the DS.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 6:29pm
Originally posted by horkn horkn wrote:

Also, notice the strut appears to have no set screws for the cutlass bearing? There appears to be 2 raised casting nubs, but no threaded holes with set screws in them.

Tom,
As long as your pulling the cutlass and even if you find you don't need to pull the strut for straightening (I have a feeling you will from the pictures), drill and tap for some 1/4-28 soc. head SS set screws. I think I have a bunch since I needed to buy 100 of them way back. Tell me, if needed, I'll mail several of them too you. You could probably get by with 1/4-20's but the strut is pretty thin there - on the other hand, you're not talking big time torque needs ether!!

EDIT: The SS set screw I have are 1/4-20's.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horkn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-25-2011 at 11:49pm
We pulled the strut.   It must be tweaked.   There are a few clues that tell me that it was like that when I bought it. Now that the bushing is needing replacement I am first noticing the issue.

In any case, where/who can straighten the strut?   Or where can I get a new/ used one?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 12:39am
Was the strut blue in a former life? I've been wrong about this before, but there are some signs of repair to the strut boss?

Strut first; get it loose and see what's underneath. You may have glass work to do. Then you may want to make a mock up with a dowel to see about the strut. Something's way out though, as you see in the pic with the rudder.

And you need some stainless safety wire.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 12:41am
Get the part # off of it and call around.   

What's that Correct Part place...with the on-site banner...?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrCC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-26-2011 at 1:10am
You should be able to straighten the strut.

remove the prop shaft. (if you haven't already)
remove the rudder.
remove the hose and stuffing box from the shaft log.
re-install the strut.

My favorite tool is an old prop shaft.
You can bend the strut back into position just by pushing or pulling on the tool.
Don't get too carried away. Use just a few quick pulls at a time. Take the tool out and check for alignment with your prop shaft.   Not enough, do it again. Too much, bend back the other way.
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