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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Brian,
Have you had the opportunity to read my diary on the Atom? Jack's comment regarding "probably" having to remove the skins is false!! You WILL need to remove the skins for the frame repair!!! |
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I have not but will tonight. I spoke with Jack today actually, He sent me some very helpful pics of his rebuild and I think I'm starting to pick up what your putting down. So I'm wondering...after I pull the engine, is the next step to flip over, remove old plywood and then pick away at the frame? Pete, I'm curious to know your through of using epoxies in wood boats for minor repairs? Or at all. Thanks
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Brian,
I feel epoxy does have a place with wood boats but not in all types of hulls. A traditional planked boat has too much movement between all the parts so no with epoxy. 5200 is the way to go. It's different with a ply hull since with the stability of plywood movement is almost zero so I feel epoxy is a good choice. CPES should be used on all wood before assembly and then after partial assembly. |
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skutsch ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: June-19-2008 Location: Racine, WI Status: Offline Points: 2874 |
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So looking at a couple of threads, it appears the frame (stringers, ribs, etc) are all more of a natural wood color rather then the gray - green painted. Do you sand off all the paint before you CPES?
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what type of wood is being used here?
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Steve,
Yes, you what to get down to pretty bare wood. The knee and keel gussets need to be new since CC used scrap and the ply delams real easy CC used any left over paint for a bilge coating back then. Not much protection! Also, under all the gussets will be bare wood. Great for CPES and epoxy bonding the new ply gussets. As I have mentioned, mine and I feel yours and Brian's will literally unscrew. |
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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CC used Mahogany for frames which is light and strong. Fir ply is fine for the gussets but do look for center veneer voids. You don't need to go with marine grade ply. |
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Guests ![]() Guest ![]() |
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sounds good. I just read your diary, which I have actually read before. Cool story, lots of hard work involved there!
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Brian,
Do you have plans to restore the Jr? If so, certainly keep us informed on the progress and the pictures coming. I highly recommend keeping it as original as possible. There are a few non original things a PO did like the white deck stripping but we can advise when you get to that point. The first thing I'd do is pull the engine and the tank so you can flip the hull. Then start unscrewing the ply skins so you can go after the frame. Jack mentioned you may be able to save the hull sides and bottom but a closer inspection is needed. If the bright (varnished) hull sides can't be saved, then the problem comes up with the length. The hull side ply is scarfed for the length. Scarfing ply that is bright isn't easy with todays ply where the face veneer may only be about 1/16" or less. There is no room for sanding!! Deck ply is simply butt joined with butt blocks under the deck. Still with a bright finish care is needed. Transom ply is two 1/4" layers bonded together to get the curvature. As mentioned, keep us informed. |
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juniorwoody ![]() Gold Member ![]() Joined: August-09-2011 Location: Oak Hill, Fl Status: Offline Points: 937 |
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I believe I read that CC used African mahogany but I prefer the Honduran. It has less grain changes but is a bit more expensive. You will find whatever you need at Berkshire Products which isn't to far from you and you can buy as needed. I am in the process of scarfing my plywood sheets now. Agree that clear finished areas will be difficult to get a good bond without glue squeeze out affecting stained finish. Have made almost all the scarf joints with well sharpened hand planes. You are welcome to stop by my place in Granby to see the frame if you like. I plan to glue up scarf joints very soon and all the prefit skins will be off to bond. If I remember right Pete was able to salvage his stem. Alan and I were not so lucky. |
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The value of money spent on new adventure far exceeds the value of money saved for the future
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uk1979 ![]() Platinum Member ![]() Joined: June-13-2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1426 |
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Nice find and still with the original engine.
From what I found on my 50”s CC… frames and planking are Lauan (Philippine Mahogany) loose name as it’s not a true mahogany you guys may now it as Light Red Meranti, my guess CC used it as its cheaper and would match the Philippine ply made of the same wood back then, easy way to spot it … look at the grain for a small fleck on some of it. Good luck with the rebuild. |
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Lets have a go
56 Starflite 77 SN 78 SN 80 BFN |
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Roger,
I agree on the "Luan" CC used and it being cheap. Some of the frame members I found looked like they had been made from old pallets left over from shipments from the Philippines!! Brian, Don't be surprised when you open up the skins at the stem. Plenty of "dumb dumb" filling in the gaps. It's the linseed oil based bedding compound they used to fill in the gaps!! Speaking of gaps, I believe it was Alan who coined the term "finishing hatchets" CC used for the builds when he restored his Hurricane! Plenty on my Atom too as well as every wood CC of the era I've worked on. ![]() |
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Looking to start next week....Just truing to reconfigure the wife's garage so I can work in the heat....on that note, is it important to keep the wood at one constant temp in where winter?
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Brian,
The wood doesn't care about the temperature but it does car about humidity that affects the moisture content. Luckily, with a ply boat you don't need to worry too much about it. Just don't subject it to extremes. |
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dochockey ![]() Gold Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-16-2009 Location: Colorado Status: Offline Points: 638 |
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Wow what a great find
Ive been searching for a cc wood boat any updates ? |
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1989 Teal Ski Nautique
1967 Mustang Harris Float Sunfish |
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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I wish there were. It seems Brian was last on site back in August. I hate when this happens! ![]() |
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No progress has been made on that boat, however is it dry and safely stored indoors. The wife advised me I had to finish my other home projects before diving into another boat. Merry Christmas!
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Brian,
Thanks for the update. Get those other projects done and make her happy so you can start on that boat!! ![]() |
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Guests ![]() Guest ![]() |
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Finally took the boat out of storage after letting her dry out for about a year. Lots of rot from years of being left out in the elements. I have two sheets left on the bottom of the boat. If I could figure out how to upload the images from my phone I would have more. but here is where we are at so far. On the engine mounts I located this " 55C02" can anyone confirm if this is a HIN or serial number.
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81nautique ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-03-2005 Location: Big Rock, Il Status: Offline Points: 5811 |
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Brian, the HID number is usually stamped on the deck cross member.
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juniorwoody ![]() Gold Member ![]() Joined: August-09-2011 Location: Oak Hill, Fl Status: Offline Points: 937 |
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Is that the only place they usually stamped the ser# Pete? I never found any stamped number on our utility. Seller said it was a 1950 and the serial number on the grey engine supported that so I guess that's what I'll go with.
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The value of money spent on new adventure far exceeds the value of money saved for the future
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Jack,
I too never found any stamped serial number on any part of the hull. My Atom did however have the serial number plate and it was on a forward port side hull frame. It's just another inconsistency of CC back then!! Brian, That number on the mount is the part number of the mount. Yes, you have some work ahead of you. Looks very familiar! |
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81nautique ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-03-2005 Location: Big Rock, Il Status: Offline Points: 5811 |
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both my Hurricane and Todd's Commuter had the numbers stamped on that frame cross member it will be something like 55 H 568 meaning 1955, H for Hurricane and 568 is the hull number. |
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My guess is that someone worked on this boat before me, Im really not sure what's original on it. But did not see any stamps. Ill keep looking....Ill go take a peak at the engine serial number quick and post it
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![]() Anyone ever see a dog house like this before? |
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A few pics of the engine maybe this can help narrow down the year
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Brian,
See if there's a casting date on the block or head. Then add a year for seasoning the raw casting before machining and it should be pretty close to the year of the boat. I'm going to take a guess at 49 or 50 for the boat. |
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juniorwoody ![]() Gold Member ![]() Joined: August-09-2011 Location: Oak Hill, Fl Status: Offline Points: 937 |
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Grey Marine Casting Dates
That's an oldie. |
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The value of money spent on new adventure far exceeds the value of money saved for the future
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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The "D" puts the year range at 46-47-48-49 then add the year + for seasoning the casting and the 49-50 is possible. |
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juniorwoody ![]() Gold Member ![]() Joined: August-09-2011 Location: Oak Hill, Fl Status: Offline Points: 937 |
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Yes Pete. 47,48,49 and 50 are all possibles
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The value of money spent on new adventure far exceeds the value of money saved for the future
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