Boat dies when i put in gear |
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LisaO
Newbie Joined: August-22-2017 Location: Marietta Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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I sent the pictures over from my email. They are in my "file manager" but that is where they seem to want to stay? Tree either takes forever or is not working.
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Thanks! Lisa
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cbr1000dude
Senior Member Joined: August-23-2011 Status: Offline Points: 330 |
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Try Google Chrome for your home page. My old computer would not upload to the "tree" icon either until I open CCF in Google Chrome..
My 88 Barefoot when I first got it. |
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LisaO
Newbie Joined: August-22-2017 Location: Marietta Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Thanks I will try that
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Thanks! Lisa
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LisaO
Newbie Joined: August-22-2017 Location: Marietta Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Thanks! Lisa
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MourningWood
Gold Member Joined: June-13-2014 Location: NorCal Status: Offline Points: 915 |
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Lisa, the correct firing order (as noted above) is: 18736245.
This assumes original or pre '82 replacement engine. Many "automotive mechanics" aren't aware that the Correct Craft marine motors of that era rotate opposite of a car, thus have a unique firing order. Please also note the direction that the distributor rotor turns. Hope that get you going again. |
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Duane in Indy
Platinum Member Joined: October-26-2015 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 1578 |
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Distributor will turn CCW on Fords looking down on it no matter which way the crankshaft rotates. Reverse Rotation or not. That is what screws up most Auto mechanics |
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Keep it as original as YOU want it
1978 Mustang (modified) |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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The 302 (at least the 4bbl marine version) went to the 351w firing order much earlier than 1982. My 78 Tique used the later FO. My 71 and I think 72 boats used the earlier FO. I would like more info and pictures to see what we're actually dealing with rather than proclaiming to be certain which FO is correct... as her boat is certainly in the proximity of when the change occurred. |
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Duane in Indy
Platinum Member Joined: October-26-2015 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 1578 |
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Another thing that screws up auto mechanics is the FO is cast into the intake manifold. Same manifold is used on RH or LH rotation engines My 302 was that way and really messes with your mind. |
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Keep it as original as YOU want it
1978 Mustang (modified) |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Lisa,
It seems like you are still having issues with posting pictures so, is there a ID plate on the engine or any other markings? What's the "mechanic" saying about the problem? Did he even run the boat after he changed the plugs and wires? Also, I don't think you answered:
And, why did you have the "mechanic" work on the boat? Was there another problem? |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Lisa,
Did you get the FO corrected and have you got the engine running? If not, we would still like to help with the FO but still need the information on the engine marinizer. With your recent site visits,tell us what you have been trying in order to post pictures. We have had other members with problems posting pictures too so don't feel bad. One solution is to email pictures to another member so they can post them for you. Links to members emails including mine are in their profiles. You click on the arrow next to the members screen name and a drop down menu will come up. Have you tried Google Chrome yet? I use it without problems. |
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LisaO
Newbie Joined: August-22-2017 Location: Marietta Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Thanks! Lisa
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11050 |
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Good job with the picture Lisa.
Your tag has a firing order of 1 8 4 5 6 2 7 3 (later 302) but you have the order arranged to be 1 8 7 3 6 2 4 5 (early 302) You'll notice some clown named KenO did a little experiment the other day and took his engine with the late firing order and rearranged the wires to see how it ran. His results were that the engine would idle a little rough and a little slow but sound pretty good actually. But when it was given any gas after shifting into gear it stalled. This probably sounds familiar to you You said it didn't run with the later firing order as shown on the tag. I'm not sure why it didn't , but i'd either try that order again. (thats 1 8 4 5 6 2 7 3} or another option would be to pull the plugs and put a little piece of rag over each plug hole, then rotate the engine by hand in the correct rotation direction and see what order the little pieces get blown out of the plug holes. You have to start with #1 at Top Dead Center on the compression stroke.You can find that with a rag over the plug hole By the time you get to the 3rd plug hole you'll know which firing order you have. First rag to blow out will be #1 when you find TDC on the compression stroke Second will be #8 And then it'll be either #4 if you have the later order like your tag says...... or if #7 is next instead of #4 then you have the early firing order which is the way you have it now. You only really need a rag over the #1 8 4 and 7 holes to figure out the order but if you take all the plugs out, it'll rotate easier by hand. You can rotate it with a 15/16 socket on the front crankshaft bolt that holds the harmonic balancer on.. Cylinder numbering is Front of engine 5 1 6 2 7 3 8 4 and you want to rotate the engine counterclockwise if you're looking from the FRONT, Or in other words rotate it toward the drivers side of the boat You might have to read this a few times to digest it, but it'll tell you your firing order |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11050 |
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By the way, that's a very early Pleasurecraft engine when they were a division of Waukesha Motor Co.
The tag says it's a right hand rotating 302 with 215 HP with a Borg Warner 1 to 1 transmission turning a right hand propeller. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Ken,
Nice trick with the rags in the plug holes. I honestly have never heard of the method. Simple and I like it!! Sure easier that trying to read rocker arm movements! I have always heard that you can learn something every day of your life and still die stupid! Now lets see if Lisa's mechanic can follow it??? |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11050 |
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It's not a KenO original Pete
I probably learned it here on CCF |
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LisaO
Newbie Joined: August-22-2017 Location: Marietta Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Thank you so much! It will be a few days before I can get the boat back to the mechanic but i will definitely let you know how it goes. Again thanks to everyone for all the help!
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Thanks! Lisa
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21169 |
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Kens detailed explanation is spot on. If you're 180 off on the distributor (i.e. the balancer marks were lined up on the exhaust stroke instead of compression), AND you use the incorrect (302 vs 351) firing order, the engine will run on 4cyl. Sounds like that may be the case here.
You can try swapping the 6&1 and 2&8 wires (on the distributor end) if you want to quickly test this theory rather than setting the timing from scratch. |
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LisaO
Newbie Joined: August-22-2017 Location: Marietta Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Hi, me again! It seems my mechanic quit (haven't heard back from him). So my friend Laura and I took it upon ourselves to try your advise. We youtubed Top dead center and went from there. We took your firing advise and she sounds really good. (strong!) We cant do the lake test until tomorrow. So fingers crossed! We will let you know after the lake test.
Thanks again to everyone for their help. Lisa |
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Thanks! Lisa
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Thats great,good luck
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SNobsessed
Grand Poobah Joined: October-21-2007 Location: IA Status: Offline Points: 7102 |
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So cool that you figured it out yourself.
Your mechanic should sell his tools & look for a new occupation. |
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“Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.”
Ben Franklin |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Lisa,
I admire you initiative to undertake the hopeful fix. Keep us informed and we'll be around if needed. I sure wish you would stop calling the person who worked on your engine a "mechanic". I agree with Chris he needs to find another line of work. |
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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I think you being a little hard on the mechanic there Pete,can't make a living working on obsolete equipment. The complaint you should have is that the guy took on the job thinking he knew more about something that is most likely as old as himself
Does not mean he's a bad mechanic. I can still take a finger wheel off a rotary phone but that won't put food on the table- get to the ISP stuff I'd be lost,but at least I'd tell you that. |
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LisaO
Newbie Joined: August-22-2017 Location: Marietta Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Hi! Me again! I just got back from the lake. The good news is that I was able to get the boat off the trailer and run her around in idle speed. As soon as I I gave her gas she hesitated, sputtered, popped, knocked and coughed. Ugg! I think I am fired as a boat mechanic also! Any ideas? Is the top dead center off? The "mechanic" rotated the distributor a little back and forth when he was trying to get the firing order right. Please let me know if I am becoming a pest. Thanks, Lisa
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Thanks! Lisa
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Duane in Indy
Platinum Member Joined: October-26-2015 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 1578 |
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You can rotate the distributor back and forth all day and you only change the timing, not the firing order. You need to get it timed properly. That would be a start.
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Keep it as original as YOU want it
1978 Mustang (modified) |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11050 |
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What firing order are you using right now?
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Lisa,
You're not being a pest at al! You do need to go back to this post Ken made regarding the firing order.
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11050 |
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Lisa
Back in the second post of this thread NautiqueHunter asked what state you live in, probably because Google says he's about an hour away from you on Lake Lanier. I don't know him personally, but he's plenty knowledgeable and I'd bet that he might just be willing to help you out if you were to ask him And he's looking at this thread right now, according to his profile info. |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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I think we should put the call out to anyone close to Marietta who could help Lisa with her timing and firing order. Anyone??? |
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LisaO
Newbie Joined: August-22-2017 Location: Marietta Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Thanks! I found #1 with your method. Then I got lazy and used the order on my tag. She sounded really good and strong....so off i went to the lake! It was a beautiful day and I couldn't resist. I do have problems finding folks that will work on my old boat. Years ago even the Nautique dealership told me that they wont work on a boat as old as mine.
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Thanks! Lisa
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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Well if she or her friend were named Kim..........
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