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95' Nautique Project ... expanded

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 1:02am
Nice work on the wiring. Love it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 3:58am
It's looking great. Nice work.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 9:08am
Hi Joe

Not knowing just what you did on the harness, here's a question for you.

Did you happen to find the diode in the purple wire between the EEC relay and your 8 pin connector?

It came up in this thread from DW SD last year and he never found it. He quit looking after he found his problem at the connector.

this thread


It might be good for you or others with a GT 40 at some point to know where it is

You can find the drawing in the GT40 service manual in the reference section.

It's section 3F-11 and 12. on page 220 of 301

I don't know if you untaped and retaped stuff, replaced wiring etc but this seems like the ideal time to find it, instead of when everything is installed and sometime in the future you're having a problem and are looking for it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 4:16pm
Good question Ken - didn't know there was such a monster. I had done very little untaping because much of the main stem was still in its original braided loom. What little I encountered didn't include that section of harness. I'll have to give it another look to see if I can track it down. Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if it were missing .... if the boat would even run, that is.

Most of my issues were from the excessive amount of bare (exposed) wires where the PO had bypassed various areas with his own wire - a TON of which were really too short and had to be stretched, so to speak, to reach their destination and a few that had been spliced in with a mile too much wire and simply raveled up and stuffed in a corner. As such there was a fair amount of splicing to lengthen many of those and of course others that were cut down to the appropriate length. Then as you can see I covered all the exposed wires that I could with poly braid and finished with the glued shrink tubes. Naturally I installed all new breakers, relays and hardware after cleaning and painting the ECM bracket.   Sooo much cleaner looking than the jumbled maze that I inherited.

I did end up finding a couple of cropped pics of the old mess, not that you can really see enough to do it justice.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 4:42pm
Joe can you post a couple of pictures of the injector harness,especially the plug where it plugs into the main harness. Do you think it is a proprietary plug? I know you can get the injector side plugs .That harness is 150 thru PCM if it even is available,if I can get thet plug I'll just make my own.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 5:18pm
No problem Gary



Injector side @ main



ECM side @ main


Let me know if you need some of the injector plugs

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 5:27pm
And thanks for the question Gary ... because while I had it back on the bench I noticed something I hadn't seen before - a couple of wires that appear to be cut broken from fatigue.   I'm not sure what this thing is and would appreciate a little input here. I'm guessing this is a necessary item but not sure if the cut wires were intentionally cut??





I've reviewed a few wiring diagrams and can't seem to track this thing down.

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 9:42pm
I guess I need to repost now that I've finally located a diagram that shows that mysterious part - the knock sensor control module.   So my question now I suppose is if those two wires are critical to it's function or were they snipped by a tech as part of an update or "fix".   They look as though they've been cut for a while with all the corrosion and dirt, so I'm pretty sure it was like that when I bought the boat, ran her many times and although there were some hick-ups, I didn't feel there was a strong fault anywhere.

Ideas? Thoughts? Comical anecdotes?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-24-2018 at 10:07pm
I figure that if your engine starts to knock, the computer won't retard the timing.

The engine would run fine with it disconnected like it was, it just wouldn't have the knock detection protection.

Then again I could be totally out to lunch

And my guess is corrosion is what broke those wires.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 8:58am
One of those little voices in my head says that maybe the timing will get retarded 8 degrees by the computer as if it was knocking.

I don't suppose you know what your base timing was set at last year.

It seems that the boat ran 44 or so mph so wherever the timing was set, it ran OK

Yet another voice says that "Joe won't leave this disconnected" he's been plenty anal so far and it won't change now
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 3:13pm
Yeah, it's already in the process. I'm eliminating the connector and wiring it direct. A bit confusing though since only one of the wires is the same color and of course I didn't realize it till I had the connectors cut off. But the retarded timing might explain at least in part why the boat always seemed a bit sluggish to me considering how light it is. Can't say for the fuel economy since I don't have a baseline, but I do recall the plugs were just a bit dark and the exhaust manifolds/ hoses were a bit warmer than I thought they should be. Couldn't have been too far of though because it didn't have much hesitation and never backfired but still... just didn't feel right.

And yes, you're correct - more often than not I'm very meticulous (they call me anal also    ).   My family isn't sure if that's a good thing or bad. Good when I fix things.... bad when I instruct them to do things     
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 3:25pm
Originally posted by gt40KS gt40KS wrote:


But then I found this and the ol' teen hot rodder in me came out and I just had to snatch it up.




For a 351w? Got a part number?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 3:48pm
No, it appears all the external markings were ground/ sanded off during the polishing process. I just checked to see if there were any internal or under side casting #'s and there are none, sorry. But it is for a 351w and that is what it came off of - it's virtually identical to the original cast iron ones.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 4:19pm
So since the time is rapidly approaching that my engine should be shipping out, I figured I'd better motivate myself to reinstall the previously poorly installed strut and get the rudder back in. Don't remember if I had ever posted pics of the previous, terrible alignment that the MC dealer had done so that will come first. But all is good and perfectly aligned now



It was actually worse than it appears in the photo because the shaft was pressing against the shaft log.   When I was pulling it out, as soon as it cleared the log under the boat it sprung another half inch or so to the side! Honestly .... wouldn't you think there was a problem when you have to bend the shaft to the side just to insert it in the log???        Did I forget to mention they installed the strut with a thimble full of clear silicone as well??







SO CLOSE NOW ....   just need and engine to drop in

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 4:49pm
Originally posted by TRBenj TRBenj wrote:

For a 351w? Got a part number?[/QUOTE]

Whats it worth I can get you a part number.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 4:52pm
For the factory aluminum 351w lower that came only on the Lightnings?

That’s a rare intake...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 10:31pm
Originally posted by TRBenj TRBenj wrote:

For the factory aluminum 351w lower that came only on the Lightnings?

That’s a rare intake...


Yep, exactly!!   I may be new to CC and the ProBoss GT40's, but I did happen to know what a rare find this was. I did a quick check of the ports, bolt size and count and bought it a few minutes later.   Unbelievably, It had only been up for auction for an hour or so when I happened on it. Unbelievably because a guy doesn't bump into this sort of deal very often - at least not THIS guy    

You can find the standard plenums like we all have fairly easily. But another rare find is the full individual tube models. I'm not really sure there is any marked performance differences or advantages to them, but they sure look cooler. Well, to old hot rodders such as myself
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 11:11pm
How about a good clear picture of the bottom of this Lightning manifold ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-25-2018 at 11:39pm
How is this?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-26-2018 at 12:36am
Well Gary (and Ken), the bottom of mine are just a bit different from the one you posted, though the top side and runners are likely identical:



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-26-2018 at 12:56am
Is it possible mine is a Ford Motorsports? I'll have to find that '91 Motorsports catalog that Ken posted at one time. Here is the part number cast into it -

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-26-2018 at 1:13am
Possibly aftermarket? I don't know, but does that circled logo say M&A?
Lets see the whole top side ... maybe more clues
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-26-2018 at 9:07am
Gary

Here's a link to the catalog. It's from 2006, you probably saw the cover to a 1991 catalog while surfing around trying to figure out what you have cause I saw the same cover picture.

Ford Racing Performance Parts Catalog

I don't think you'll find it in there.

Google tells me you have a 92 manifold with that small oil baffle sold by Ford Racing and the production one for the Lightning had the big baffle like Joe's.otherwise they were the same.other than markings like part numbers.

The Lightning was F3TE built in 93 instead of the F2TE that you have.from what I found.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gun-driver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-27-2018 at 11:05pm
I'm starting to think Joe has some kind of a Frankenstein GT-40. Between the different heads and the later year intake plenum it look's like the PO mixed and matched things.
I thought the intake plenum on the 95's were the individual tube style.

To benefit from the lower manifold pictured above you should track down the individual tube upper like below
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gun-driver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-28-2018 at 10:25am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-28-2018 at 10:48am
Yeah for $600! Not exactly a bargain for half an intake manifold.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-28-2018 at 11:51am
You can get the whole enchilada for a mere 1900 bucks or Best Offer

Just bend over and pay

the whole enchilada

I'd put that in the same "not exactly a bargain " category
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-28-2018 at 12:42pm
Yeah like I said, illusive - at least at any reasonably attainable price    

Anyway, the version I have is one that actually came on many production model PCM's and while I never found out for sure when the change occurred, it appears it was mid-year in 95'. The later PCM bobtails you could buy seam to only have come with the new 'solid cast runner' style as well as later production Nautiques:






As far as the performance goes, I have done a fair amount of research on the subject and while there is a slight performance difference, the key word is slight. Nearly all the articles I combed through agree that the solid cast version performs very close to the full tube and suggest the only time you would really see any real measurable difference is if you were putting a lot more fuel and air into your engine than that of the standard GT build.

Also, the solid cast model is actually an individual tube, not just an open flow. It's just cast together as one presumably to save money on production. The performance difference, they claim, seems to come from what the one article referred to as a 'squish tube' which does limit air flow just a bit over the full round tube style.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-28-2018 at 12:52pm
Someone has to pay for the signage Ken, and advertising don't come cheap😉. My boat was built in April of 95, it has the tubular intake. But who knows how long the engines sit at the factory before they get installed. I like the looks of the tube ones,they look like the bundle of snakes exhaust used on the gt40's namesake,the original GT40
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gun-driver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-28-2018 at 3:10pm
Originally posted by TRBenj TRBenj wrote:

Yeah for $600! Not exactly a bargain for half an intake manifold.


I didn’t say they were cheap just available

I put one of these on to see if it would help with all the heat under the cover
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/tfs-51520020
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