Removal of coupler from shaft |
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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Posted: July-03-2007 at 6:06pm |
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Dry is what the marina suggested. Use dish soap to get the shaft through the strut, then heating the coupler and cooling the shaft being that I did not have the hammer they use. I was quoted close to double for a double tapered shaft, and it sounds as though I may have a chance to get it in there the rest of the way....with a little persuasion.
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1968 Mustang 318 CM
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GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3357 |
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Did you assemble it dry?
I bet double-taper sounds better now. |
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"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
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79nautique
Grand Poobah Joined: January-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 7872 |
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get a piece of wood and ditch the rubber hammer for a real hammer and place the wood against the coupler and bit the sh*t out of it with the big hammer. If it goes to far just use a puller to slowly postion it where it needs to be.
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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Well figured I would send my results on. I bit the bullet and bought my parts from a local dealer that was reasonable. I did the heated coupler and dry ice method on the shaft. I came within less than a half of an inch from the indents being visible to put the set screws in. I have put the dry ice on the shaft for over an hour and lightly tapped with a rubber mallet with no luck.... any suggestions? Sounds to me like I just wasted a bunch of money and need to have it cut and redone unless I hear otherwise. Thanks for any advice in advance.
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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Got it. I appreciate the advice and help. I will submit my success..... hopefully not failure after the weekend
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Spievy, The key is probably a standard 1/4 x 1/4" key that even a hardware store would have. You may want to look for a stainless steel though. Don't forget to pre fit the key.
The old shaft is garbage. It's not worth goofing with. It would have to be welded up and then turned down to it's original size. The welding may warp it and then you would need to straighten it. Lots of labor! |
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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Thanks for the advice on the dry ice. I agree on the time contstraints. It is indeed single taper 40" x 1". Luckily removing the rutter was a five minute ordeal. I have the original key still unfortunately it is a bit tore up but I was assured by the marina that they have the correct one for the shaft and coupler size when I pick everything up this weekend. If I am remembering the order of procedures it sounds like to me I would get the shaft up through the hull to the coupler area. Get dry ice on the shaft where it meets the coupler. Set the key to slide in on the coupler when it meets the shaft, pull the coupler from the oven with mits , and smack it on there hopefully with ease. Then align with my feeler guages tighten the couplers down and then repack the stuffing box. Another quick question on the old shaft it is not broken just the key slot is worn and the stop nut areas are pitted. Would a machine shop be able to refab this so I have a spare with some luck or is it junk?
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backfoot100
Platinum Member Joined: January-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1897 |
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Ouch, that's gotta hurt!!!!! |
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When people run down to the lake to see what's making that noise, you've succeeded.
Eddie |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Speivy, It sounds like you ended up with the single taper shaft.
You will not have very much time before the shaft warms up and the coupling cools down. I would not put any packing in the stuffing box until you get the coupling on the shaft. Trying to get the shaft through the packing will be too time consuming. You will want to make sure the key fits in the key ways of the shaft and coupling before you assemble. Also the dimples in the shaft for the set screws should be pre drilled. If you can get your hands on some dry ice I feel it will work better plus getting a 40" shaft in the freezer may be hard. |
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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I appreciate the advice makes sense on the bushings too. I ended up finding what I needed with a little help from some friends that own nautiques so it looks like I got the shaft,coupler,Gortex,impellers and the bushings for the strut for about $325, not too bad I didn't think. Thanks very much for everyone's advice. One last question though on installation of the coupler to the shaft. I was told by Boat Dr to put the shaft in the freezer overnight and coupler in the oven for 45 @ 450 degrees, it makes sense that it would shrink the shaft and expand the coupler just want to double check and see the timeframe on getting the new shaft in. Should there be anything to look out for on re-installation? I am repacking the box at the shaft prior. It should just slide on in I am hoping?
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backfoot100
Platinum Member Joined: January-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1897 |
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While your at it, you might as well replace the shaft bushings in the strut. Seeing as the shaft needs to come out, it would only make sense to do the bushings too.
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When people run down to the lake to see what's making that noise, you've succeeded.
Eddie |
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Darrel
Senior Member Joined: June-16-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 340 |
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Call SKidim, (but order online for the CCF discount) they will set you up with a double taper w/ coupler and the gortex packing.
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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It doesn't appear that I can save any parts from the shaft and the coupler standpoint, what would I need to obtain to change over to the double tapered if you could help. The marina's I have near me are unwilling to provide any help on answering questions/giving me any options on parts so I have to rely on what I can do if at all possible. They're hourly is $90/hour so anything I can do on my own is a major plus.
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GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3357 |
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If you can't save any parts, Just go with the double taper, its great.
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"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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I just did a search and came up with several sources. I also now that the Boat Doc here on the site has a source. Maybe he'll chime in.
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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I have not found a place yet for the shaft or coupling yet. I certainly think that it would be a good time to get the rudder stuffing box redone as well if I have to go to these measures to remove the rudder itself. I looked on Skidim for my shaft and all they have is the double tapered which I believe is not what I need. Any advice on a good place would be excellent. I also in the meantime will get some pics up and get the old shaft out and measure it to be sure on the size.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Speivy, You should be able to get the coupling from the same source as the shaft. Have you found a place yet? Yes you will need to pull the rudder to get the shaft out. If you can't get to the rudder stuffing box easily then the gas tank may need to removed too. The packing you have heard about is a teflon that is made by Gortex. It's great stuff. Get the shaft out for a good overall length and get it, the coupling and the packing and keep us posted. This also would be the ideal time to repack the rudder stuffing box. Pictures can help.
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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Second question is on the packing box? I do not know much about it but from what I have read it is a nylon type rope that is kept wet by the water and stuffed in a metal casing, I am wondering if I should replace that while doing the rest of the work. The guy I purchased this from, did things back yard style and I have a feeling some things have rotted ( rope, impellers which I will be replacing, wiring is disconnected up front, etc. ) I have my work cut out for me but that is fine with me, just looking for some guidance.
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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Well, I appreciate all the advice on the removal but I have taken it off and the key inside was toast. I now have the shaft coming in and it seems to me that the whole set-up needs to be redone it looks original anyways, so I would like to get it right the first time. I was wondering on two seperate questions. Number one: I need to remove the shaft from the rear. My rutter appears to be attached from the top under the rear seat. If I pull the prop is there anyway to avoid having to take the rutter off? It looks as though I might have some issues with the re-installation of it due to it's age,so, could someone direct me on a good place and price to get a new coupler half, key, and shaft, and anything else I may need to get this done? I seem to be having some difficulty getting measurements since it is in the boat currently, but I believe it is 40" long and 1" in diameter. Sorry for the long thread just want to get this done and do it correctly.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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79, Here's a prop shaft coupling puller. It does use the flange for pulling. |
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79nautique
Grand Poobah Joined: January-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 7872 |
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well a puller is only going to warp the flange if you don't use the puller right and pull the coupling off by the flange instead of the main body of the coupleer like it's suppose to be done.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Riley, There is a flange puller available but it to may warp the flange too. This is the chance you take but at least you can reface it. You however do need to be careful to dial indicate it to the bore when you turn it in the lathe. In extreme cases when you don't want to cut the shaft, the engine needs to be pulled so the shaft can come out forward. |
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gigem75
Senior Member Joined: November-12-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 239 |
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I got my old one off by putting the flange with the cut off piece in a lathe and machining the shaft out of the flange until it just fell out. It didn't get beat up that way but still refaced the flange just to be sure.
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7953 |
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Maybe that was part of the problem. That boat used to break shafts all on its own. So to answer the OP question, how is it done? |
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GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3357 |
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you got lucky, its very easy to warp the flanges that way, then good luck trying to every align the engine again. |
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"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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Thank you all very very much I appreciate all the detail it helps more than you know. To try to have this done at any marina near me will take weeks hopefully this will get me back out sooner.
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gigem75
Senior Member Joined: November-12-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 239 |
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If it's spun, it may just fall off. If that's the case it is definitly toast. I was able to reuse my old one but did true up the face of the coupling in a lathe so when aliging I would get good feeler guage readings.
Getting it off the old shaft was a bugger. When you order your shaft, measure the length of the old one. They'll probably ask you how long the old one was. If the old one slides off and IF the holes for the set screws are in the same place in relation to the keyway slot you can use the old coupling to center punch marks on the shaft to drill the detents for the set screws. This may not be kosher but since the coupling is such a tight fit we put the coupling on after the shaft was installed with a slide hammer we borrowed from the dealer. Once it was on I made a sleeve to have the center punch centered exactly in the set screw holes and VERY carefully drilled the detents in the shaft. If the coupling is still on the shaft tightly and hasn't moved mark the distance the shaft is from the end of the coupling and install back to that. Mine was about an eighth of an inch below the end of the coupling. Hope this helps. |
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7953 |
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I've done it this way, if it's a non tapered shaft, seperate the flange, put a sprk plug socket between the flanges, one end centered on the shaft. Get some long bolts, the same diameter that connect the 2 halfs together. Tighten them up, and gradualy they will push the shaft out.
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Spievy, Forget about the coupling half. When the shaft spun in it, it most likely ruined the bore. It is a tight fit (press) to the shaft. The Doc has mentioned that to get the new shaft and new coupling half together you will need to chill (shrink) the shaft and heat (expand) the coupling.
So, to get it off, I would get the sawsall out (or hack saw) and cut the shaft. |
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Spievy
Senior Member Joined: June-09-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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If anyone could advise on the removal of the coupler from the bad shaft I have in the boat currently, would be most helpful. I do not want to ruin anything anymore than I have to as the coupler could still be good??? The advice on putting on I remember... just never got the removal answer
1968 Mustang 318 CM |
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