Forums
NautiqueParts.comNautiqueSkins.com - Correct Craft Upholstery and Part
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - R U thinking of a new tundra
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

R U thinking of a new tundra

 Post Reply Post Reply Page   123 4>
Author
87BFN owner View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: August-25-2006
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
Status: Offline
Points: 2194
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 87BFN owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: R U thinking of a new tundra
    Posted: April-02-2007 at 8:17pm
This is from an email received from a GM dealer:

Thought you might want to know this. Pass it along to your sales staff. It might help them to sell more vehicles.

BTW.....attended the Minneapolis Auto Show kick off breakfast on March 8. Two of our Sandy trainers did a nice job explaining the Tundra ads. I would guess all of you have seen the stupid ad where the Tundra pulls a trailer up a steep grade (a 'see-saw'), and then barrels down hill and locks the brakes up just before the end of the ramp. Seen it? Yeah you have.

Couple things to keep in mind. The V.O. at the beginning of the spot says...."It's tough pushing 10,000 lbs up a steep grade". Myth: Toyota would like the audience to believe the trailer is 10,000 lbs. Fact: It's a 5,000 lb truck pulling a 5,000 lb trailer. A little slight of hand? You bet.

Then, on the way down the grade, the camera zooms in on the brakes as the vehicles comes to a screeching halt just prior to the end of ramp. Next time you see the ad....look for the 'mice type'. It indicates the trailer is equipped with electric brake s. Fact....the electric brakes stop the trailer -- not the truck. A little slight of hand? You bet.

And why does Toyota have bigger brake pads? They need them....their truck is heavier. Stopping distance between our truck and theirs is virtually identical. And why does Toyota have a 6 speed transmission? To improve their fuel economy....which is still 2 mpg less than ours.

And don't forget....their big V8 has one axle ratio -- a 4.3. Suck fuel much? Our trucks offer several axle options to optimize towing and fuel economy. Bottom line: OUR TRUCK IS BETTER! Spread the word.......we can all make a difference.

I would think again. Make sure when buying a new truck you compare apples to apples and not apples to oranges. Check all specs.
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-02-2007 at 8:21pm
im with ya 110% on the american trucks..would never ever buy a foreign truck...
Back to Top
87BFN owner View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: August-25-2006
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
Status: Offline
Points: 2194
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 87BFN owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-02-2007 at 10:15pm
It wasn't so much about the US import deal Ryan, just wanted to make sure anyone here that shops for their trucks and is not brand loyal doesn't get hosed.

AS much as I and many others here would like to see people buy fords and gms. I was just passing on info that I was suspect of when I saw there commercials. Thought others might like to know. Resepect others rights to buy cars and trucks of their choice.
Back to Top
Randy_in_Ohio View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: September-13-2006
Location: N. Canton, OH.
Status: Offline
Points: 1891
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 8:32am
Jim, it's an advertisement. It is not unusual for a company to exaggerate their product in an advertisement. Look at the new Chevy Edge commercial. Do you think that car can drive on the side of a building???
Honestly, when I saw the Tundra commercial I did not think the truck was pulling 10,000 pounds, the load didn't look big enough to be 10,000 lbs.

I have owned a '98 Tacoma for 6 years. got it with 60,000 miles on it and now has 117,000. the only thing I have done to the truck besides regular maintenance is put in a starter. I tend to be hard on vehicles and this truck has taken everything I've thrown at it. I do my own maintenance and it is easy to work on, everything seems well thought out.

I have been thinking of upgrading to a bigger truck. Will the Toyota Tundra be on my list of trucks to consider? You bet. Probably right at the top.

And these truck are built right here in the USA with probably more parts from the USA than a Dodge truck.
Back to Top
79nautique View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: January-27-2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7872
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 11:14am
rough on a truck, try 96,000 in less than two years, Tires replaced @84k, oil, filters, wipers that's all

a lot of haulling loads over that time as well and still on the orginal brakes too. Cheap Chevy I guess gas and go where ever you want.
Back to Top
eric lavine View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah


Joined: August-13-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 13413
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 2:10pm
Randy,Randy,randy,
if people didnt buy them they wouldnt be here in the first place, watch how fast they'd pull out of US if they wernt being sold, it is a supply and demand world. them frickin nips aint no dummies and for sure are not looking out for the american worker.
If your company made fireworks where would you want your business? right in the area where the raw materials are being produced and you would avoid shipping the products back oversea's. its a justification to make you believe its an american product because americans work on them and its not.
if enough people bought the big 3, and those honda employees had a choice you know where they would be.
the qaulity is back and with 100,000 mile warranties its a no brainer. at one point i thought the nips produced a better car and they did and they still might. but when i thougt that i always had a 1000.00 in my pocket.   
"the things you own will start to own you"
Back to Top
Mark Mel View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: September-16-2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 583
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Mel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 3:20pm
I buy american brands for my trucks. However, the Tundra is made in Texas.
1978 Nautique

FBook - www.facebook.com/charliedontsurfct
Back to Top
87BFN owner View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: August-25-2006
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
Status: Offline
Points: 2194
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 87BFN owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 5:05pm
The Ford Super Duties are mad in Kentucky so.

Randy Ford makes the edge, by the way the commercial with it riding on rails. Yes no one believes the car can do that. But Ford and Chevy both put the disclaimer at the bottom of the screen during the commercial stating what the truck can do. Tundra commercial does not do this, that I have noticed. I could be wrong about the last part but not thinking so.

Like I said before not trying to turn this post into an import bash. AS much as I think we should have a legal hunting season of unoccupied imports, but just wanted to make sure everyone knew the facts and were aware if they were in the market for a new truck.
Back to Top
Tim D View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah


Joined: August-23-2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2637
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tim D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 5:49pm
Toyota is expected to outsell GM this year. I don't like the back door window on the new Tundra, it kills the look of the truck to me.
Tim D
Back to Top
eric lavine View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah


Joined: August-13-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 13413
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 7:55pm
BFN, I watch that commercial and see the dis-claimer but I've told my wife that there are people who probably call to see if the car can really do that, Ive always bought new american cars and always will in the future, it gives me a better feeling inside. they snuck in the back door once and i feel in some strange way they are sneaking in again....but in a different way. thats a strong statement and apoligize if your offended
"the things you own will start to own you"
Back to Top
79nautique View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: January-27-2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7872
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 8:09pm
did you notice on the one ford commercial where they are loading it with crap to compare payload and one of the bags doesn't make it into the bed? is it over loaded with it?
Back to Top
redneck7 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: September-27-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 118
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redneck7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 8:21pm
I could care less about brand, I buy based on a) what I can afford and b) track record

As for jobs for Americans...Ford just closed it's plant in my home town (Norfolk, VA) and we have more than a few family friends who are 45+ years old with no where to go but the shipyard where they'll be starting over at the bottom of the pay grade. Thanks to good ole American Blue Oval. Toyota employs Americans and opens plants because they are doing well; Ford ain't doing well, so they close plants...

For the Tundra, if you buy a truck based on that ad, you're a complete idiot. If you buy a Chevy based on the ad where their 1 ton is pulling a train down the tracks loaded with Chevy's, you're an idiot. If you buy any vehicle based on the advertisement and not a test drive and some research, you're an idiot.

If you're trying to "inform" me with your post, I feel I'm being talked down to, patronized and perhaps even insulted a bit. I'm not an idiot.

My $.02 on which truck: My dad has an f-150, I have a Suburban, My mom has her second Isuzu, my sister has a Honda and my Granddad has nothing but GMs (new old and in between). I also owned a Toyota Tacoma for 2 years.

Going off of our experiences with the cars listed, I'd buy a fullsize Honda truck if they'd make it over any other truck. Second on my list is Toyota. (This is 1/2 ton only). Just the way it is...Japanese vehicles are quality design, and usually quality built.

Again, my opinion only, take it for what it's worth.
Back to Top
Riley View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: January-19-2004
Location: Portland, ME
Status: Offline
Points: 7952
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 8:24pm
I liked the Ford commercial when the new style came out, with Jack Palance pulling the Grand Canyon together.
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 9:25pm
randy- u taking shots at my dodge!..my decision on a truck is that the us trucks are hands down the best..never seen a honda or a toyota pulling any machinery have you?..i never see them hauling anything to be quit honest!..chevys fords and dodges...btw im givin ya a hard time randy!
Back to Top
redneck7 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: September-27-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 118
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redneck7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 9:34pm
Notice my disclaimer that I was referring to 1/2 ton trucks only (Tundra, Dodge/Chevy 1500's, Ford F-150). I've never seen a 1/2 ton hauling anything of any consequence and looking happy about it, no matter what brand it is.

3/4 and full ton trucks are meant for hauling machinery, 1/2 tons haul mulch, lawn mowers and kids to baseball practice. Put a 19' ski boat behind it sure, put a 33ft Center Console with triple outboards and I don't care the brand, if it's a 1/2 ton, it ain't gonna be happy if it can move/stop the load at all.
Back to Top
79nautique View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: January-27-2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7872
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 11:01pm
pulled a trailer carrying an astro van loaded to the gills with tools and crap, enough sh*t to over load the vans springs and tires, 1400 miles to Sarasota, FLA with the Colorado's 5 cyl throught the TN hills and mountians doing 75 plus the whole way, do that in a toyota or honda, might be able to do 55 if your lucky.

Oh FYI they limit the speed to about 95 before the fuel is shut down to slow it down.
Back to Top
Randy_in_Ohio View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: September-13-2006
Location: N. Canton, OH.
Status: Offline
Points: 1891
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 11:08pm
I really thought that the Edge was a Chevy. I guess ford isn't doing a good job getting the brand name across.

Sorry Ryan... I didn't mean to take a shot at your vehicle. I like Dodge, I think they have some great styling in there vehicles, but DaimlerChrysler does build a lot of their cars in Mexico with foreign parts.

When I buy a vehicle I do a lot of research and look for the best quality, price, reliability, and re-sale value I can get within my budget. That being said I have owned a lot more Fords and GM's than Toyota or Honda and would definetly consider buying a truck from Ford, GM or Dodge. I just wouldn't decide not to buy a vehicle because it's not "American" anymore than I would decide not to buy a toaster because it's not made in the USA. When it comes down to it I will buy the best product I can afford and I don't care if it gives me a warm patriotic feeling. I feel patriotic in other ways such as taking part in the political process and blowing up fireworks (Made in China)...


Back to Top
redneck7 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: September-27-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 118
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redneck7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2007 at 11:41pm
Originally posted by 79nautique 79nautique wrote:

pulled a trailer carrying an astro van loaded to the gills with tools and crap, enough sh*t to over load the vans springs and tires, 1400 miles to Sarasota, FLA with the Colorado's 5 cyl throught the TN hills and mountians doing 75 plus the whole way, do that in a toyota or honda, might be able to do 55 if your lucky.

Oh FYI they limit the speed to about 95 before the fuel is shut down to slow it down.


I towed a Ford F-150 (that was broken down, imagine that) on tandem axle car trailer with my Tacoma. Doesn't mean the truck was comfortable doing it. Honda doesn't make a 1/2 ton truck, so that would explain why you don't see them pulling things and you must not look out the window much or maybe your area of the country is a bit different. I live in farm country and I see Tundra's pulling hay trailers and cotton modules a lot more than you would think, but I reckon they're really straining and usually blow up when they're just out of my sight...

It makes 381hp, 401lb-ft of torque, and is rated at 10,800lbs towing capacity. Those numbers aren't arbitrary, they have to prove them...if you wouldn't haul with one or didn't feel like it could haul, that's your opinion, but jeez, cut the numbers in half and it's still hauling around my Suburban with 1,000lbs of crap in the back. That's nothing to laugh at.

I still maintain that if you're going to beat your chest about how much a given truck can haul, at least do it about trucks that are comfortable doing it. Sure Ford, Chevy, Toyota, Dodge and whoever else can all claim a 10,000lb tow capacity in their 1/2 tons, but put 10,000lbs of grain or cattle behind any one of those trucks and it will not be a happy camper. Big loads are meant to be towed by big trucks. Toyota doesn't make one of those (yet) and neither Ford, Chevy nor Dodge makes the engines for their big boys, so it ain't worth arguing between the big three for those either.

Back to Top
eric lavine View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah


Joined: August-13-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 13413
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 7:50am
Look at it from this angle,I look at things long term, its not about what is a better truck, Toyota will probably surpass GM, and someday my children will be answering to well.....not an American.
As the middle east controls oil prices, if gas shot up to $10.00 a gallon, youd be right there in line fillin her up...pissed off
Now...someday you have no choice other than to buy a car made in Japan because we are no longer capable of producing reasonabally priced cars, at this point we are completely relying on Japan to supply cars to the US. When you have the upper hand in any situation you will eventually take advantage of the situation and that word is called control. I refuse to buy anything but an American car because if i make it to 90 years old and my grand kid asks me, What happened? I can say it wasnt me
"the things you own will start to own you"
Back to Top
Riley View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: January-19-2004
Location: Portland, ME
Status: Offline
Points: 7952
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 8:38am
I only buy American, but 3 out of 5 of the new trucks that I have owened, (Ford & Chevy), have been made in Canada.
Back to Top
eric lavine View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah


Joined: August-13-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 13413
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 9:02am
you guys might think im a whack job, but it wasnt long ago that we dropped a couple of firecrackers there way, i really dont think they got over that yet..lol eric
"the things you own will start to own you"
Back to Top
redneck7 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: September-27-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 118
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redneck7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 1:17pm
I'm all for American classics which were built here by us, (and look positively bad ass). But to say you'll only buy an American vehicle today isn't quite as cut and dry.

As was already mentioned, Diamler Chrysler is now making many cars in Mexico with foreign parts. That's 0% American. We used to get a kick out my buddy's new "American" Dodge had a "Made in Mexico" sticker when parked next to one of my roommate's 1990 Toyota Camry which was "Made in Kentucky." Which one would you buy Eric? One that produces cars here and employs Americans but is run by folks overseas or one who doesn't do a thing to employ Americans and outsources everything in the name of the bottom dollar, but might have a guy named Smith or Jones at head of the table?

I truthfully don't care what you all buy as long as no one stops me from buying what I chose to buy. I just like a healthy debate every now and again and get tired of people assuming that since I drive a lifted Suburban and wear Wrangler jeans that I must big a dyed in the wool Chevy guy...not the case, I just got a good deal on a truck that has high miles and cheap parts availible for it. If it had been up to me, I would have gotten chassis cab 450 or 4500 and called it a day, but the money wasn't there.
Back to Top
Waterdog View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: April-27-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2020
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waterdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 1:53pm
The toyota add that get's to me is the Daddy working 4 weekends to finnish the play house and the two boy's playing go fish in the mini van. You know the one.BLATENT DISRESPECT! That would never happen in the house I grew up in.
- waterdog -

78 Ski Tique

Back to Top
JoeinNY View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: October-19-2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 5697
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JoeinNY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 3:36pm
Its all global now, to me who owns the company that makes a product is about the least important factor in my decision making process. Where the plant is located is a factor, where it was designed and engineered also a factor, but who owns it well screw them.. old money do nothings own most of the big businesses in this country and I could care less whether thier great grand kids end up billionaires or only mearly millionaires without ever doing an honest days work in thier lives.

I work leading new product development projects for an HVAC manufacturer in upstate NY. We were recently bought by a Japanese company, they are investing and hiring heavily here in upstate NY where we design and produce products for all over the world. Our number one competitor is a "US" company who has moved 8000 jobs out of our area in the last 5 years to mexico and overseas, you can tell you which I would rather support (and work for). Thats not to say anything specific about Toyota, honda, ford, gm, etc but in my opinion where the office is located should be the last thing you worry about in todays day and age.
1983 Ski Nautique 2001
1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy"
Holeshot Video
Back to Top
JoeinNY View Drop Down
Grand Poobah
Grand Poobah
Avatar

Joined: October-19-2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 5697
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JoeinNY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 3:36pm
Ever notice we have the same conversations over and over around here
1983 Ski Nautique 2001
1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy"
Holeshot Video
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 4:45pm
hmmmmmmmm..firecrackers, i wont even put my thoughts on here about the "firecrackers and foreign(ers)". with out a doubt id be kicked off here and have many many enemies..lol...

joe0 being a union sheet metal worker whats the big new projects?..whats the companys name?..thank your local scab shop for the jobs lost in this industry. we can also thank ronald reagan(sp) for much of what is happening today(air traffic controllers)
Back to Top
Poster112 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May-28-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 206
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Poster112 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 6:03pm
Those darn rich people.

I'd rather have a bottle-in-front-of-me than a frontal-lobotomy.

1985 Ski


1984 SW
Back to Top
todicus View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July-10-2006
Location: Napa, Ca
Status: Offline
Points: 493
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote todicus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 6:03pm
I bought a 2007 Chevy Tahoe........ really liked the new styling and the 320 hp motor, 4-wheel drive and tow package.

At 4000 miles the truck electrical system shut down- stranding my wife; had to take work off to meet the flat bed driver to load it and take it to the dealer. Freaked out wife with 4 year old bending my ear about why I talked her into such a piece of crap.

After 4 days, they said it was a faulty battery and replaced it.

At 9000 miles, wife pulls out of day care and hears a big clunk, then truck will not move.

It would go in reverse, so she backed up and called me. Had to take off work to go rescue her again, meet the flat bed driver to take it to the dealer. 3 weeks later, it has a brand new transmission, because ours was "faulty".

My wife really wanted a Toyota Sequoia, but I convinced her that the Chevy was a better vehicle..........

I wish the extended warranty covered all the stress I get to endure from my wife reading me the riot act and loss of pay.

Living outside the wake
95GT-40SNOB
Back to Top
redneck7 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: September-27-2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 118
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redneck7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 6:25pm
My dad broke down and bought AAA for my sister and mom for that very reason...didn't want to hear about "he" didn't tell her that if you leave your lights on the battery will die, etc ANYmore.
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-04-2007 at 7:14pm
poster-explain yourself a little better
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page   123 4>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Copyright 2024 | Bagley Productions, LLC