Pumpkin Update

BuffaloBFN wrote: Jeff, are there any threads on your boat? Starting and running problems with a side of tranny noise...

And a side of slaw.
Applicable threads I started are "Transmission "rattle" in reverse" and "Multitester help please". Think there may be some older ones but i couldn't get it to search past 1 year.

There were some exhaust manifold threads; now non-issue so far so good.

Engine itself sounds fine. Just did new distributor, etc, plug wires, and plugs. Last time out ran like a bat out of hell.

Problem somewhere in charging/starting. Last fall wouldn't start or jump at non-ethanol gas dock down the lake. Inebriated pontoon-boater in next slip jumped in and crossed solenoid and it fired, so replaced the solenoid. Also keyswitch was not turning properly so replaced that.

Last time out forklift kid said dead & they'd put in a shop battery and it started fine. When I got there started fine & went for a blast. Returned. Started once sorta ok, second time real sluggish, then I quit so they'd have enough juice to get it back on the forklift. When I called later, they said it was dead and hadda jump it to get it over to the forklift dock.

As background,marina mechanic great guy seems trained & quite competent at standard stuff but admits not experienced with older stuff & really doesn't need to be. My boats are decades older than the rest of the boats, and at least one decade older than him. I'd rather have a guy who admits he doesn't know how, than a guy who doesnt know how but tries anyway and screws it up worse. So, I'm ok with occasionally paying them for some standard defined task/cost, but not for any fishing expeditions at hourly shop cost...

Tim B, I've had a vac guage on it from the first turn of the key. Right after I went from 4/4 preload to 3/4, the needle was rock steady at idle in the driveway. Then I ran it and it seemed to pump up and was missing on 4 & 7. Went to 2/4 preload and it seems better but not rock steady like I was hoping to see.

Comments welcome...especially if you're busting a gut laughing!

Maybe it is a chevy thing but other than bottoming out one way or the other the whole point of those hyd lifters should be to make your experience painless and basically unadjustable. Certainly not to the point where your idle vacuum would be so adversly effected. (I am usually shooting for 7/8 of a turn myself)

What is your oil pressure running at idle?

Stock flow and pressure pump?

Not opening an intake valve can also leave you short of suction, is it possible you got one or two lifters that have/do collapse under pressure. (That one I have had happen out of the box a time or two but it usually gets pretty loud and rejects a rod or two).

Once that stuff is ruled out... timing and carb tune can certainly have a huge effect on vacuum... including the air that is passing by your butterfly valve at idle. The idle mixture screws not having the desired effect and low vacuum numbers could point to either the primary or secondary throttle stops (or both) being set too far open, bringing in air but not with correctly mixed and metered fuel.

JoeinNY wrote: Maybe it is a chevy thing but other than bottoming out one way or the other the whole point of those hyd lifters should be to make your experience painless and basically unadjustable. Certainly not to the point where your idle vacuum would be so adversly effected. (I am usually shooting for 7/8 of a turn myself)

That's what I thought, but Lunati says 2/4 turn and I'm using their lifters so I gave it a swing.

JoeinNY wrote: What is your oil pressure running at idle?

The gauge reads ~30-35 psi. I haven't put a mechanical gauge on it.

JoeinNY wrote: Stock flow and pressure pump?

Yes

JoeinNY wrote: Not opening an intake valve can also leave you short of suction, is it possible you got one or two lifters that have/do collapse under pressure. (That one I have had happen out of the box a time or two but it usually gets pretty loud and rejects a rod or two).

By rejecting you mean breaking?

JoeinNY wrote: Once that stuff is ruled out... timing and carb tune can certainly have a huge effect on vacuum... including the air that is passing by your butterfly valve at idle. The idle mixture screws not having the desired effect and low vacuum numbers could point to either the primary or secondary throttle stops (or both) being set too far open, bringing in air but not with correctly mixed and metered fuel.

This sounds like a good place to look; makes sense. My timing is currently @ 12 initial. DUI says to put it at 14? Idle vacuum is ~17" with a small bit of fluctuation.

backlash

74Wind wrote: BuffaloBFN wrote: I didn't look those threads up, but here's what I'd look at-alternator output, cable condition, timing and general tune which may be causing your reverse rattle(damper plate). I'd say you're close. I'd thought if it is indeed the damper plate rattling (t.b.d.) thats a mechanical issue within the bell housing, not sure I get the connection..how would timing/tune cause a reverse rattle?

An engine that isn't running smoothly at idle will transfer those vibes to the back. I guess it shows up at the damper because it isn't a solid connection.

Very common with the jets if not idleing smooth it will shake the slack drive line sounds just like knock in back of motor but there is nothing wrong.I think you have junk lifters that are pumping up at higher RPM's and holding valves open. Readjust so that there is minimal preload just enough to keep from ticking and coming apart I know that sounds scary but only way to find out if lifters are problem.I think on tour first post after reassembly(the 4500 one)lifter had not had a chance to pump up and cause issue again.

Looks like I'm back in business. After much deliberating, all I did was loosen #7 to 1/4 turn and looked the rest over. I'll run it tonight and look at the plugs to see what they have to tell. I do have a smooth idle now and the exhaust doesn't smell raw anymore. Woo Hoo!

Assuming things stay about like they are, I may pull it back apart in a week or so and see if I'm getting full and even lift. I'm trying to think of a good mic point on a roller rocker...might've looked before I closed it up.

Or should I be planning a lifter swap?

I would adjust them just like solids only 0 lash and see what happens it is hard enough these days to get a flat tappet to survive breakin. Changing lifters now could wipe out cam

Nice! Lookin' good, looking real good

Hmmmm, you might have to do that with a regular link. Although, it looks like there is a way to embed a flash video. I've never tried it though. It mentions it in the http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/BBcodes.asp

This is very close to the suggested 0 lash. If I had to guess, I'd say they're around 1/8 turn; or in other words, not much. I wish I could see the threads on top of each stud or the tops of the lifters.

I ran it hard and all seems well. The idle is strong and happy at 625 in gear(no more damper rattle). The vacuum reading is around the low side of 17 in the video and jumpy; after running it, it settled into a slight and 'steady' twich at 17.5.

I got lucky with the valve cover hacking. They held all of the oil...until I goosed it. Like the Bill Dance commercial-"Don't do that".

FWIW-my camera mic doesn't miss anything-it sounds looser in the video than it does in person

They played fine for me. Might be your connection speed?

Sounds nice!

Bri892001 wrote: They played fine for me. Might be your connection speed? Sounds nice!

My speed isn't what it could be. On my end, I see valves not moving...they are.