Engine build opinions?

TRBenj wrote: You really need to know what youre doing to get anything meaningful out of the desktop dyno software. Alan (81nautique) had a pretty good set up for the Ford 351w that was getting pretty consistent, reliable numbers. Modeling the exhaust manifold flow was a tricky part. I bought a copy and tried starting from scratch on our BFN's 454 and could not get the software to give me anywhere near believable numbers. Theres a learning curve for sure. Im not convinced the Air Gap will yield any measurable performance gain over the standard RPM, but I doubt it will hurt either. Marine engines run pretty cool in general, and dont have a ton of air flow through the motorbox, unlike a car. Tonali_III wrote: I agree with Tim. I have been told by a professional engine builder that roller lifters are better for their reduced wear capability. Also, you can more aggressive with cam grinds. But wiht rollers, you can be a little less concerned about ZDDP content in your lubricating oil. While those are all true in regards to the benefits of going to a roller cam / lifters, I dont think that $1500 upgrade is on the table. I was talking about roller lifters. Apples and oranges.

Nope, I already have my cam and flat lifters. We have been discussing rockers, which are already in the mail heading my way.

TRBenj wrote: You really need to know what youre doing to get anything meaningful out of the desktop dyno software. Alan (81nautique) had a pretty good set up for the Ford 351w that was getting pretty consistent, reliable numbers. Modeling the exhaust manifold flow was a tricky part. I bought a copy and tried starting from scratch on our BFN's 454 and could not get the software to give me anywhere near believable numbers. Theres a learning curve for sure. Im not convinced the Air Gap will yield any measurable performance gain over the standard RPM, but I doubt it will hurt either. Marine engines run pretty cool in general, and dont have a ton of air flow through the motorbox, unlike a car. Tonali_III wrote: I agree with Tim. I have been told by a professional engine builder that roller lifters are better for their reduced wear capability. Also, you can more aggressive with cam grinds. But wiht rollers, you can be a little less concerned about ZDDP content in your lubricating oil. While those are all true in regards to the benefits of going to a roller cam / lifters, I dont think that $1500 upgrade is on the table. I was talking about roller lifters. Apples and oranges.

I don't think you can use Roller Lifters on a non-roller lifter cam. I could be mistaken, but I have never heard of that combination before.

Roller rockers are a good friction reducing mod.

I am still of the opinion that the Air Gap is the best choice. Chrysler RB manifolds were all air gap style from the factory. I am a Ford man at heart, but I have to admit the guys at the Chrysler Engine division provided some really cool stuff for the street and marine use. All of it was basically de-tuned racing parts. A little less timing here, a mild cam there and you have a reliable family car engine that make loads of torque.

I admit Desktop Dyno is a guess, but it is an educated one. And it is better than investing a ton of money and time exchanging parts. And you're right, it does have a learning curve to it. It is only as good as the data that is fed into it.

I picked mine up for a slightly less than retail (gotta love torrent files).

Stay with it, Jeff. You will have a safe, reliable Ford Windsor engine before you know it. (I hate it when people call them motors! Motors are electric.)

Almost forgot! These guys:

http://www.performanceracingengine.com/

CAn make anything and they have a CNC block dimensioning, boring, and line boring machine. Gordon can turn out 20 completely dimension and prepped blocks where the old methods turn out one. The site shows the sytem in process. And Gordon with work with you on building, too. If you want them to do the machining and you do the building, he will do it. And he can then dyno your completed assembly and dial in the jets or fuel flow and ignition. The bottom line: when you're done, you have very predictable performance from an engine that you built and has been broken in with a controlled environment system.

Gordon is in Bethalto, IL. He tells me that he is the only shop within 300 miles that can do what they do. I would check around your area and see if a shop has anything similar.

Peace.

Tonali_III wrote: Almost forgot! These guys: http://www.performanceracingengine.com/ Peace.

Tony,
You link is bad!

Let's try this again.

Performance Automotive

Okay that's got it.

You will just need to go to the home page after you get there to see how impressive the shop is.

PerFormance Automotive

To answer your question about anyone putting a performer under a late 70's engine cover, I have a 77 nautique with the performer and a holley wedge plate,marine demon carb with a K&N flame arrestor. It all fits fine under the cover. Putting on your hiteks will be a chore as you have to modify the width of the cover to clear them. Joe in NY has a great step by step on how to do it in his orignal stroker build from a few years back.

Hopefully Joe will chime in... I cant remember which flange angle he chose. I dont *think* the standard angle will require box modification, as they should basically have the same external dimensions as the PCM pyramids. Of course, I havent tried to fit mine under the 2001 curvy box, or the flat top box used '70-82. No issues fitting under the stock box on my '90 though.

Take a look at Joe's thread to see what he did. He blew out the sides of the motorbox to clear the Hiteks and was able to reuse the vinyl.

Mine didn't fit on the 78 but they were in stock in California and could have been ment for an io, won't know til you try

I don't know how to link you to Joe's thread but his hitek cover mods start on page 7 of his thread " A 351W (stroker) from scratch ".

The link to Joe' Stroking thread!

That dark blue is the original PCM color from that vintage. The old Ford blue is a lot lighter... ask Chris how he feels about the color selection! ReidP could point you in the right direction on both the blue and green (manifolds) if you wanted to keep it original.

Got it painted last weekend. I love the color.

Started looking at the Holly rebuild and turns out the secondaries were frozen shut. They won't even open. I got the boat last July and have been running a Holly 300 since then.

I can't wait to see how this boat runs with all of the new parts AND a complete 600 cfm!

Have you no pictures of the process?