75 separator rebuild |
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Mike, I have to agree that the Fein is a great tool. I've had one for years and yes, paid dearly for it before all the cheap copies came out. One thing though, I believe Eric was talking about a power hand planer for skimming the gel off a transom. |
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WOFTAM
Groupie Joined: July-14-2010 Location: SW Michigan Status: Offline Points: 97 |
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I was thinking of going at the transom core from the inside. Use a circular saw to cit through one layer of the glass, use a grinder to bevel both sides of the cut before removing the skin, then gently remove the inside skin. Use the Fein to get under the existing wet ply, but not damage the outer skin. Replace new CPES treated ply a la vacuum bag and epoxy with the filler of your choice. More epoxy on the inside skin after being prepared, pull another vacuum to re-apply the skin. Build up with 1", 2" and 4" tape around the cut referenced at beginning of the post. This was a way I would replaced rotten core under nonskid sections on sailboats. Those patterns were always a challenge to match.
Anyhow, maybe worth a try here? |
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Just because you can does not mean you should.
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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on I/O's they bond 2, 3/4" pieces of ply for drive stability, its 1.50 thick. its a beeoch to get off.... thats what i use the portable hand planer for.....you'll know when your close to the gel, when you get to that point you lower the blade....from the inside, once i skin the ply, then i'll come in with a mud hog with 80 grit to finish the gel for now bonding, dont be afraid of the planer the glass is real thick back there.
Conn, maybe you can post a pic of the inside of the transom for reference? |
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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normally, the first piece of ply goes from corner to corner, the second piece covers the drive hole with extra. i cardboard template the first piece and fit, coat both sides and edges, let dry, scuff with 80, coat ply and use bolts thru gimble holes and tie off holes to clamp along with extended vice grips, at times i will put kickers in from the stringers to the ply to help in clamping
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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to clarify, i do see the stress cracks on the outside transom, and i dont use the planer on the outside of the boat, address those cracks once all is done and stable on the inside
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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Here is a pic of transom prior to planing! Eric, how am i going to attach the wood to transom. can you give me a step by step and the best products to use , thanks again. and yes this is the best tool for cutting parts out
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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See the build up of resin on bottom would ya cut it out or leave it.
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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I vote to leave it.Could it be there for a reason like drain plug support? That is a drain plug there right?
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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Gary ! you are correct [drain plug]
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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first, how thick is the mounting area? and are there 2 pieces of ply bonded together? normally you'll have a layer of gel, then glass and finally 2, 3/4 pieces of ply back to back
you'll notice the mounting studs on the gimble are 2.5 or so long. rmember the forces that are pushing a 3500 lb boat are all transfered thru the transom unlike an inboard. good qaulity ply...not marine, cpes highly recommended in this area. As I said, I make my pattern, pre fit the ply, drill my mount holes, coat liberally to waterproof, mix it on the cool side, lay the piece up in there and go to town with clamps, inluding any thru holes i will use pre determined bolt and nuts to clamp, including tie down holes....anything that has a hole...I have long arm vice grips that i will use thru the gimble hole to reach other ares and at the corners I will tie in kickers screwed to the stringers or anything solid |
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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obviously once the first piece is in you cloth and glass the corners with heavy woven
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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btw, a portable hand planer would whack that down in under a minute
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Eric, I thought this was CQ's line!! |
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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at what age do we become dirty old men?
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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Good morning Eric! would ya have a second some time so i could give ya a call about the transom. thanks jeff
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21194 |
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If the resin in question is simply pooled resin (no glass) then I would say remove it. It will be fairly brittle, as resin doesnt have much strength without the glass fibers. Its most likely a result of a sloppy build process.
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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What,s the trick to putting the 2 pieces of ply together. does the 1st piece of ply get glassed on all sides. and what typ of ply do i get, if i read it rite i dont use marine ply . BTW the pooled resin is not brittle should i leave it in?
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Keeganino
Grand Poobah Joined: October-27-2009 Location: North Carolina Status: Offline Points: 2063 |
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Just use standard 3/4" ply. All of the home dpot and lowes plywoods are made with external wood glue. Make sure it is untreated though. Thats what the cpes is for. When I laminated my lift mount and my stringers I used plain resin and a ton of clamps. Use thickened resin for bedding as mentioned by Tim.
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"working on these old boats may not be cost effective but as it shows its what it brings into your life that matters" -Roger
1973 Skier |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21194 |
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If its pooled resin, then it IS brittle. Take a hammer and chisel to it.
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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the plain resin with hardner will hold them together, thats what your saying, then glass back and sides that goes to boat, then with thickened epoxy attach to hull. all treated with cpes of course then glass over top. how much glass over top, size, and layers? thanks for putting up with my ignorance.
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21194 |
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I believe that is the process that Keegan used, yes. |
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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Makes sence what your saying Benj, you just got your post in before i finished typing mine what typ of mat in between boards
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21194 |
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Keegan's method is probably more applicable than what we did with the coosa in the BFN.
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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it appears that when they built your boat, time wasnt spent on the transom, to me it looks as if they mereley put 2 pieces of ply together in the gimble area only, and thats why i feel you have stress cracks.....spread the load accross the entire transom with the ply on the first piece corner to corner, and then the second piece as big as you can without obstructing any other component that may be back there. You probably have a deck hanging off the back also,
the one pic you have does not show so much in strength, just a mount pad for the gimble, cheesy, normally most wood back on the transoms are never coated, just painted....cost effective when building at the manufacturer....you have the opportunity to build it stronger and add the personal touch and be worry free when running the boat. post more pics of the transom if you can |
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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eric lavine
Grand Poobah Joined: August-13-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 13413 |
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I backed up a bit and noticed the stress cracks originated in the area where the wood ends on the inside. thats what you are trying to eliminate with ply corner to corner...spread the forces of the outdrive. under power the outdrive has a tendency to pull at the top and push at the bottem of the transom.
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"the things you own will start to own you"
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4947 |
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On a sterdrive, where does the load of thrust apply on the boat? Is it directly to the transom like an outboard, or is ultimately pushing forward on the motor mounts? I've heard the term "stringer drive" used in reference to OMC sterndrives, just curious how the Mercruisers are set up. |
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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Im following ya now Eric! hay i have a question now that the hull is stripped a friend told me to look for a hook in the hull, he said it will slow the hull about 5 mph what do you guys think? ilooked into it on the internet and its quite detailed. some boat are built that way for quicker planeing , and some are not. the sep i dont think was, so now after alot of straight edging to get hull straight and reinstalling stringers bulkheads ect, i can remove the hook and hopefully get some more mph any thaughts. hope this dont open a can of worms
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21194 |
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Jeff, hook in the hull has been discussed here at length- try a search.
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connorssons
Platinum Member Joined: January-17-2009 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 1414 |
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Tim after looking at mine it is only about an 1/8 strong, just by pushing the floor down in places it will take it out. well placed weights during stringer reinstall will easilly take hook out. does any body know if the sep was built with on in it?
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21194 |
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Edit: nevermind.
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