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Gas shooting out of carburator

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Randy_in_Ohio View Drop Down
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    Posted: September-17-2006 at 11:20am
I just bought a '93 Sport Nautique. I got it to fire up once, but now when I start it with the air filter off, gas shoots out of the carburetor about 5 feet in the air. I am thinking I need a new carburetor.
Also, I am concerned about the gas. had about 5-7 gal. of gas in it which had sat in it since two summers ago, I added 5 gal. of fresh gas with Stabil and some dry gas. Now I am thinking I should just drain it and add new.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 12:07pm
I don't know about that, sounds pretty wierd shooting that high unless there's a high pressure electric pump instead of a low pressure pump. Might have a firing order issue blowing the compression back thru the intake.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 12:26pm
Uhm, anybody change the starter recently? Rotation incorrect?

The j-tubes should prevent the gas guiser if the float stuck open.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 1:36pm
Yes, The starter was just replaced. How can I tell if the rotation is correct.

How do I determine the firing order, spark plugs were changed at the same time as starter, he could have mixed up the spark plug wires.

What do you think about the gas? should I be on the safe side and drain it or do you think it would be a waste of time and gas?

Thanks 79 and gottaski, I appreciate the help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 2:28pm
[QUOTE=Randy_in_Ohio] How can I tell if the rotation is correct.[QUOTE]

For one, the gazinta acts like the gazouta, and the gazouta acts like a gazinta. Your there.

If you have the 1.23 ratio trans the front pully should turn CW (std). If you have the 1:1 trans the front pully should turn CCW (rev).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 2:38pm
OK Gottaski that makes sense I'm going to go look right now.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 5:28pm
I may have a starter off of a low hour 351 ho boss, let us know what trans you have and rotation, the starter i have plugs in from the trans side, i can meet you in macedonia any day this week, call me tommorow 330-273-8291 or call me at home tonight 330-995-4037
        eric
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 5:38pm
let us know what side the starter comes in from, trans side or engine side, sounds like you have a normal rotation starter and it plugs into trans side and reverses rotation,
are you trying a automotive starter???? did they match you one up at napa???   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tim D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 5:52pm
Rotation.
Tim D
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 6:44pm
I think it is the starter, I have the 1.000\1 transmission and he bought the RH starter. after reading some other threads here I am almost sure this is the problem.
The starter comes in from the engine side. It is a marine starter.

Thanks for the offer Eric, I really appreciate it .

My buddy who sold it to me just bought the
starter last week, so he is going to take it back to the marina he bought it at tomorrow. The guy there asked him which one it was RH or LH and he thought it was RH could't really tell since it wasn't turning at all.

I'm going to pick it up from my buddy's house on the way home from work tomorrow.Probably be Tuesday before I can put it on. I'll let you know how it comes out.

Thanks to everyone for the help, you really helped me figure it out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 6:58pm
see how it runs with the gas you have in it, it doesnt take long to burn thru it, if you do drain it then your stuck with the bad gas, personally,i would run it thru,
run a good tank thru then tune it up, making sure to also change the trans fluid
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 8:01pm
Although its possible, Id be very surprised if you have a RH motor and 1:1 tranny. Most CC's starting in '89 have the 1.23:1 tranny with a LH motor. I believe most 89-94 1:1 boats were base model Ski Nautiques.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 8:52pm
TRBenj - It is definatly a 1:1 tranny, says so right on it. This boat has never been modified, all original parts. I bought it off of the original owner. your post here:
Engine rotation
helped me confirm this

Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-17-2006 at 11:28pm
Now I'm confused...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 12:10am
can you take picture of the tranny, seems odd that it's a 1:1 Borg warner tranny for that year boat and would make sence using a RH starter and bumping gas thru the carb when it should be a LH motor, PCM 1.23:1 tranny.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 7:47am
the model of these trans would let you know which way it turns also, 10-17-004 normal rotation 10-17-003 right hand rotation, 10-17-002 normal 10-17-001 right , same trans except that the pump is flipped 180 for opposite rotation, so i guess we need a model number too   eric
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 8:06am
Originally posted by Randy_in_Ohio Randy_in_Ohio wrote:

TRBenj - It is definatly a 1:1 tranny, says so right on it. This boat has never been modified, all original parts. I bought it off of the original owner. your post here:
Engine rotation
helped me confirm this

Thanks!


Very interesting! I know they still used the 1:1 on the base models at least through '94, but you dont see too many of them. This is the first time Ive heard of one in a Sport Nautique.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 10:44am
79nautique- I'll take a pic when I get home (at work now).
The tag on the tranny says it is a 1:1, PCM40.
I will post pick tonight probably be about 8 -9 PM EST.
Thanks for your help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 10:55am
borg warners are 1:1 PCM's I believe are only 1.23:1 so if you bought a reverse rotaton starter that might be wrong we'll what for the picture.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 11:19am
I believe PCM also made a 1:1.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 12:37pm
I personally never have seen a pcm with the pump indexed for reverse rotation, 1:1 or the 123:1 which means they always rotate normal rotation......
I also think they came up with the 1.23:1 because of the down angle and couldnt achieve the 1:1 ratio with the gearring, but it does turn opposite rotation when in forward
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 12:46pm
PCM puts its name on the transmissions, they really are a hurth, in which zf bought hurth out, they do have a 1:1 straght and a 1.23:1 in which it is a 10 degree down angle.
they are the bayliners of transmissions if taken care of though you could see 1000 hours out of them. they dont compare to a good old borg, they tried re-inventing the wheel.
I worked at Paragon power in the 80's and we also developed a trans for the ski boat market, we had many problems with it, and the owner of the company didnt want to invest anymore time and $$$$$$$ and dropped the project
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 4:44pm
So... I have about 775hrs on this tranny, are you saying I am going to need a new one pretty soon. What happens when they Start to go, how will I know the time is near? when it does go should I look for a Borg Warner?

BTW - Eric, Do you know anyone local who can rebuild props? my prop isn't bad but has a couple dings...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 4:54pm
cleveland prop 216-961-5858 65th and dennison
hydromotive props 330-425-4242 twinsburg
we need to know what trans you have, make sure you change the oil, you'll know when you need a trans, but a good indication is heavy drag in nuetral, the trans is probably fine. I cant tell what trans you have from your pics, snap a picture or pull the info off the tag. take care of all the things on the boat and water test, then will figure out from there if the boat has issues. dont forget to put the plug in lol eric     
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 5:07pm
Which place would be best?
Twinsburgh is probably most convenient. Do you think it would be a good idea to get a new one and get this one refurbished to have as a spare?

I will take a picture of the transmission tonight when i get home. hopefully not dark by then... I have to stop and pick up the starter on my way home.

Thanks



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jbear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 6:44pm
Randy: Don't know the guys in Twinsburg but I have used Cleve Prop for many years and always happy. Never a problem. LOL

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 7:36pm
Thanks jbear, I'll give them a call.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 7:42pm
its a father and son business(hydramotive props) and they manufacture stainless cleaver props,I spoke to them a couple of weeks ago and did not realize that they repaired props but they do, they seem like straight shooters, I would call for pricing and compare, I know cleve prop just purchased a new balancing machine,ask her if she has a good used prop in the size you need, (vicki) for a spare.
you make the call on the new prop and spare. a used prop is as good as new. depending on your budget i would wait on a spare till you get her going in case you run into other problems
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Randy_in_Ohio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 7:53pm
I had to take this in the rain... holding a flashlight...



It is definetley PCM 40 - 1.000\1

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2006 at 8:35pm
these are a transmissions that you'll want to change the oil on at least once a season or more. make it a point that everytime you change engine oil change the trans oil, once you get here going you may also want to check the alignment, the zf hurth pcm 1:1 cannot handle mis-alignment.if its been sitting for 2 years make sure you change the oil before you run the boat then change it again after you run it
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