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New to me 93 Ski Nautique

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Donald80SN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: New to me 93 Ski Nautique
    Posted: March-09-2024 at 11:11am
With the number of boats you have, is it possible to run any of them out of gas if all start from full at the beginning of the summer? Asking for a friend.  Embarrassed
1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens
2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S.
1968 Ski Nautique, Project.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-09-2024 at 11:11am
I with you Ken, definitely an improvement and I don't mind at all the stepped readings of the reed type.

One of the main issues I had with a faulty gauge ... I generally know what I have on board for fuel.  And, it's easy to lift my back trunk cover and look at the translucent tank if I'm not sure, can easily see the level.  But, over time multiple people in the boat were nervous driving around in a boat where the gauge read empty, and I got tired of explaining we had plenty of fuel.  And, being honest, I was just being lazy by not changing out the sender.  So like with so many things it only took me half a decade to get tired of it and fix it.
'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-08-2024 at 7:39pm
Well Dave, just tell yourself you got a better sender than the swinging arm sender with a heavy gas saturated float Wink

One thing most people don't realize with these reed switch type gauges is that inside the tube there are a number of reed switches and the black float around the tube is a magnet that as it moves, picks up a reed switch as it goes past it.

There are only a certain number of switches depending on the length, but on the typical 10 inch or so sender you'll have one switch for empty, one for full, and for example 7 in between them so your gauge only changes readings about every 1/8 of a tank.(If it was a rectangular symettrically shaped tank)

So as you fill the tank, it may take some gas to start making the float actually start moving, then the level gauge responds in 1/8 tank increments. Same thing on the way down.

You'll never know that you have 7/16 of a tank for example, because the gauge will jump from 3/8 to 1/2

Or if you're getting low and it's on 1/8, the next reading will be empty It won't creep down slowly.

Somebody might say "that's not very accurate" compared to the swing arm type that changes resistance and the gauge reading every time it moves, but it also doesn't bounce around nearly as much as the swing arm type. So the reed switch is less sensitive, less precise or less accurate to small level changes but it's not really a problem, especially if you know how they work.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-08-2024 at 3:40pm
Originally posted by samudj01 samudj01 wrote:

You did clue me in on that due to the shape of the top half of the tank being angled.  I get it but still think the sender was necessary.  My old one was terrible.  That said, if fixed, 1/2 tank will actually be closer to 3/4 and 1/4 of a tank is closer to 1/2 due to the tank shape.  Mine was so bad that I would have 12gal and it would read empty...no fun when filling with a syphon hose.     

My sport gauge didn't read correctly, same as you read empty from about 1/2 tank down.  Finally after maybe 6 years I got tired of it and replaced it.  While not a triangle, my tank is more like an L, much more capacity in the bottom 1/3 than above that.  So of course the gauge isn't an accurate reflection, but once I have the experience of knowing about where I'm at for each gauge level it works fine for me.
'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-08-2024 at 1:37pm
You did clue me in on that due to the shape of the top half of the tank being angled.  I get it but still think the sender was necessary.  My old one was terrible.  That said, if fixed, 1/2 tank will actually be closer to 3/4 and 1/4 of a tank is closer to 1/2 due to the tank shape.  Mine was so bad that I would have 12gal and it would read empty...no fun when filling with a syphon hose.     
78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-08-2024 at 10:16am
Might’ve asked before going through the effort… my experience on those NWZ tanks is that they are always going to read low. Seems unavoidable when using a linear sender on a triangle shaped tank.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-08-2024 at 9:35am
Fuel sender replacement:

Had a fuel gauge on this boat that always read low and bounced a lot.  After replacing the dash wiring and testing the gauge at the dash, I needed to replace the sender.  I got lucky and a guy on Facebook had his slant back taken apart.  I asked for pics of the sender as well as a tank measurement.  I got a reed style sender and you buy it 1" shorter than the height of the tank.  So I got a 10" sender for this 93 Ski Nautique.





Not many tools needed.  New sender ready to go in.



Old sender disconnected and unscrewed...ready to pull out.  Had to bend sender pretty good to get it to curl out.  This was bc I didn't pull the tank.  It is a confined space above the sender.



Bent Sender to get out of tank.  The float was very waterlogged with gas which is what I read to be a common cause of bad readings with these old senders



I tried to bend the sender back straight to give a view of what it would have looked like in the tank.



New Sender installed.  Had to work a bit to get it to fit in due to the confined space but I managed.  The 5 screws on top were not fun to get lined up.  Installed the back ones first a couple of turns.  Then the fronts.  Then tightened them all up.  The old screws were needed as the new ones didn't have matching threads.  I trimmed all wires and used fresh heat shrink butt splices to connect them to the new sender wire.  

I would have liked to have had a pic like below (and I wish I had a pic of the side tabs to share) but note that the seat back slides straight up off of three tabs, one in the back and one on each side.  The next pic you can see a tab on the side of the seat back.  There are two carpeted boards that go in first.  And the seat base bolts to the floor (you can see the starboard female side on the floor in this pic). 



Did all work on the lift and didn't remove anything from the boat.  This pic shows the tab on the side of the seat back.  The lake is very muddy after a big rain...should be back to normal soon I hope.  Please ignore the muskrat poop on the dock...it is due for a cleaning this spring.  And hopefully there will be an orange skier in the little slip soon.





78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-10-2024 at 8:57pm
A worthy project, no doubt.  You'll be happy with the results.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-10-2024 at 6:39pm
Wired to engine and dash reinstalled. Horn is strong! Happy about that. Didn’t have the key with me so more testing to come but seemed that everything worked that runs off ign breaker.
78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 81nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-10-2024 at 9:53am
Holy Moly, and I thought installing 2000 wood plugs in my Collegian was tedious.   Nice work David
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-09-2024 at 12:55pm
Finished the dash pod.  Next is to run the new 10awg wires from the block and reinstall dash pod.  My wires are a bit messy around the breakers but I think it turned out well...hard to clean it up with the daisy chain of indicator lights running everywhere.  I also could have used some yellow heat shrink female spade terminals.  I needed ~4.  Oh well, the regular ones match from factory.  Double sided tape on the back of the bus bars

New pod:

  

Bus Bar close ups







Dash Pod with notes:


78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-08-2024 at 2:47pm
This may not be perfect but I would have liked to have been able to look at a pic like this.  (Red wires are (pos) in the pic…I should have marked). Will post an updated pic once I finish adding bus bars and removing some of the daisy chain.  Boat safe box to be removed.  Will leave original light and aftermarket buzzer.  Will hide or remove aftermarket warning light.

Re: wire size comment above: I am adding additional 10awg positive and negative to run in parallel with original.  Any new wiring I did to remove daisy chain is in 14awg instead of the factory 16awg.
 






78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 63 Skier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-06-2024 at 9:59am
Originally posted by samudj01 samudj01 wrote:

My work area. A little messy but everything is here.



I don't see any way to have a pizza and beer at that table, seems like a significant problem to me.

On wire size, I do think at times there's a tendency to oversize wires to correct the OEM dash deficiencies.  As I see it the problem is all the daisy chaining, which you are of course fixing, not that the wire used was all that undersized.  Better ground is always a good idea and it can never hurt to upsize that wire.
'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-05-2024 at 9:08pm
Larry - no PP on this boat

Ken - that blue wire is daisy chain (pos) for the gauge lights. It comes from the Nav Light breaker/switch. I’m betting the orange is for the curtesy lights.

Prev owner must have removed oem alarm/buzzer. Think I’ll leave the after market.

I’ll have to buy some contact cleaner.
78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-05-2024 at 8:07pm
Originally posted by samudj01 samudj01 wrote:



Questions:
  • Is my plan good (it is already started but could be tweaked)?
  • Anyone identify that orange wire scotch locked onto the blue (pos) wire in the top right of the first dash pic?  The orange wire runs directly to the white 12-wire harness
  • Did the 93s have a warning buzzer.  Mine has an aftermarket buzzer and light in addition to the OEM light.  
  • How can I clean the connectors in the harnesses?  I'm using a brass brush to clean the exposed terminals.

Plan sounds good to me

Where's the other end of the blue wire go to? 

They had a buzzer along with the light

Cleaning the female connectors, I usually use small drill bits or taps that are just a little smaller than the hole so I can do a little scraping of the junk (Along with your favorite electrical parts cleaner)


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-05-2024 at 8:05pm
If you, for some odd reason, decide to do away with your PP or decide to upgrade, let me know.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-05-2024 at 6:55pm
My work area. A little messy but everything is here.

78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-05-2024 at 1:04pm
Thanks for the initial comments...I went back and edited a bit in case someone looked at it in the future.  

I plan to use the existing breakers/switches and will be using wire that is the same size or one gauge larger.
78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-05-2024 at 12:57pm
I would be careful on your nomenclature first of all- purple isn’t just “positive”, it’s keyed power. Anything that runs only when the key is on will be affected by this circuit. I would try not to daisy chain anything that draws a meaningful amount of power- gauges are fine but anything breakered/switched individually probably should be given a clean power source.

The only other bit I’ll mention is that I’d be careful not to bypass any factory breaker/fuse protection, and to make sure you’re adequately protecting your boat with breakers/fuses and wiring size choices.   The methodology you should be using to size wiring and breakers is to make the wire an adequate size to feed the current draw of the component it’s feeding, and then breaker a bit below the current handling capability of the wire.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-05-2024 at 11:37am
Starting this wiring project:

Plan is to get rid of much of the daisy chain: 
  • Running an additional 10awg pos and neg from block to dash.  
  • Removing all Red (pos) daisy chain (they are on the switch breakers, ign, horn, etc).  Using a bus bar for this.  Also using 10awg from Ign breaker to bus bar (I will continue to run through original breakers/switches from the bus bar).  
  • EDIT: Purple (pos (keyed power)) wires to gauges are run from the Key switch so it would need another bus bar I think.  I'm leaning towards leaving the Purple in a daisy chain.  Thoughts?
  • Planning to leave the Blue (pos) daisy for the gauge lights which runs from the Nav Light breaker.
  • Removing the Black (ground) daisy from the gauges and install a bus bar.  
  • I plan to leave the Black (ground) daisy to all dash lights (gauge and indicator)
I removed the Boat Safe box and associated white scotch locks.  The affected cables were 5.  Two were shortened to get rid of the open cut.  And 3 spliced with a heat shrink butt splice connector.

The blue scotch locks are for the depth finder.  Leaving as is.  

Questions:
  • Is my plan good (it is already started but could be tweaked)?
  • Anyone identify that orange wire scotch locked onto the blue (pos) wire in the top right of the first dash pic?  The orange wire runs directly to the white 12-wire harness
  • Did the 93s have a warning buzzer.  Mine has an aftermarket buzzer and light in addition to the OEM light.  
  • How can I clean the connectors in the harnesses?  I'm using a brass brush to clean the exposed terminals.
78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davidaha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-02-2023 at 8:02pm
Thanks for the pics.   ...Today I learn that you are supposed to be able take that whole pod out on a 92.... Mine has 7-12 prior owner wires running through that don't have connectors (PP, radio, other mystery stuff...) need to figure out what each is and how I can make the pod fully removable...then rewire it to get rid of the daisy chain.

Thanks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-02-2023 at 8:07am
Boat safe seems to tie into a lot! Blower and ign breakers. Blower, fuel gauge, tach, and more. What does it do and should it be removed?

Pics from above:



78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-01-2023 at 4:14pm
I figure if you follow the wires from the Boatsafe box you'll probably find about 5 more Scotch Lock connectors and be able to figure out what original wires the thing hooks to.

Maybe somebody put the box there to deal with ignition noise etc just as a guess
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-01-2023 at 10:51am
What is the boat safe box. I see nothing having to do with speed control on this boat. I looked on google and didn’t find much on this box. What could it be there for?

Can someone post a pic of what the buzzer should look like. I have a new nautiques dash plaque and want to go back to one light and original buzzer. I plan to get back to original wiring but would like to see original setup.

My original thought was that the aftermarket light was for something else, but it looks to connect to the same wires.
78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-28-2023 at 12:18pm
As Ken pointed out those Scotch Lock quick connectors are less than ideal.   All trailer light kits come with those and are at best temporary.   I bought some wire connectors recently and wish I had them years ago.  They look like normal crimp wire connectors but have heat shrink already installed.   Insert the wire ends, crimp the connector and hit it with the heat gun and you are done.  Saves a lot of time and seems to be a water tight connector.   They come in a variety of sizes.   Reviews were 100% positive and many shops have adopted using this type connector.   I formerly soldered all connections and either shrunk wrapped or taped the finished connection.   I like these better.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertskier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-28-2023 at 11:57am
Your boat probably does run better.  The ignition circuit voltage was probably low because of the dash wiring.  With the original dash wiring the ignition voltage comes from the 50 amp breaker on the engine through the harness to the ignition breaker on the dash then through the daisy chain to the key switch then from the key switch through the harness to the engine 15 amp breaker and ultimately to your ignition.  With the less than optimum wiring and connections there was a lot of IR loss.  So by the time the ignition saw that potential it was significantly lower than battery voltage.  Easy to check. Measure the voltage at the 15amp breaker on the engine.  If it's low you can install a positive buss bar at the dash or what I did is add a relay at the engine so the output of the 50amp breaker goes directly through the relay to the ignition circuit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 91NaughtyQ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-28-2023 at 7:13am
Just my thoughts on what is at best a daisy chained mess from the factory behind the dash -
Others can confirm but the early 90's (I have a 91) are under wired and is what causes the infamous "Chirp" along with gauges bouncing around including not providing enough juice (or at least constant juice) for Perfect Pass making it have a mind of its own which is less than optimal.
I did the following -

Ran a concurrent positive wire to the dash (heavier gauge than factory)
Ran another ground to a bus block on the dash (heavier gauge than factory)
Rewired the entire pod grounding all of the gauges to the bus. (I used all new wires for this)

This solved every issue I was having related to what seems to be anything electrical.  I don't have any metrics to prove this, but I swear overall the boat just runs better and it is nice not having your temp alarm go off because it falsely bounced up 20 degrees when you engaged the lights or an accessory switch.  I did this several years back and have had zero issues since.  I will see if I can dig up some pics if you want them.  

Gary
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samudj01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-26-2023 at 11:00pm
No pic for a while. I can do it on Saturday    

Ken, all the answers:

Depth finder

Was taking pod out so I had already pulled the Speedo hoses

I accidentally broke the accessory breaker when struggling with some of the wire harnesses. So I get to buy a new 10 amp. Ugh. That is the loose spade connector x 2
78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409
Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davidaha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-26-2023 at 7:15pm
Could you post a pic from farther back showing the full pod when open like that? The 92 SN I picked up a few years ago is a rats nest with many mods.   I can only tip the pod up about four inches and reach under.   Seeing how it was once wired would help.   Mine runs, has PP, separate ground, but sometimes ends up low voltage.   

Any advice on how to rewire would be appreciated.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-26-2023 at 12:09pm
Looks to me like someone added the new warning light and a new buzzer and just tapped into the old warning light wiring with some of those dreaded Scotch Lock connectors 

What's the 2 inch gauge that's where your hour meter was originally installed? Depth finder, maybe speed control/GPS speedometer of one kind or another.

Maybe the mystery Boatsafe box is associated with that.

Why don't the speedometers have any tubing hooked to them?

Your second picture shows a spade connector on an orange wire that's hooked to nothing. 
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