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Water Pump issues

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SemperFIsh View Drop Down
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    Posted: December-24-2008 at 10:46pm
This week I launched my 78 FN and have a water pump issue. Here is what I found so far. I rebuilt the water pump (The big one that draws raw water) and replaced a blown seal, replaced the impellar). The water pump does't leak now and so I went out and ran the boat. At first I forgot to open the valve and the engine began to overheat when I got on the throttle. I then remembered to open the valve after seeing a little smoke from the overheated wet exhaust hose. The boat would not draw water when on a plane at all. It seemed to do fine when at a idle. We putted back the few hundred feet to the ramp and took another look at it. We took off the main water pump and found out it was shot so we replaced it (the one mounted on top of the engine) (the 78 engine had a 68 water pump on it?) As a result of the first overheating, when we went to start it the starter seemed to get stuck sometimes and the engine would try to bump the shaft even though it was in Neutral. We ran it again today and when we idled it ran ok, but again when we went to get on a plane it would not draw water through the hull to the engine. The hoses are hooked up correctly to the first water pump which is clearly marked In and Out. The hoses are clear of obstructions because when I hook up the hose to the back and open the valve water shoots through the bottom, when I have it closed it shoots thgrough the engine and out the exhaust. Everything in my mind says I put the impellar in backwards but someone told me that doesn't matter because it would snap the fins into the right way. It doesn't seem like it would to me. Which way would you put the impellar (fins pointed to the starboard or port. The engine is a right hand rotation, with the main crank shaft rotating towards the starboard side.) Anybody have a clue as to whats going on?
                                    Capt Duane
Capt Duane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waterdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-25-2008 at 5:48pm
If you have a std. rotation engine water pump on a reverse rotation engine the raw w/pump may force some water past it at idle -but not at higher RPM. (MAYBE???)
- waterdog -

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SemperFIsh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-27-2008 at 1:10am
I have had a number of people tell me that the impellar would snap the fins in the right direction, so I have to push the "I believe" button on that one. My Grandpa had an old 1" gate valve,(spigot like for a hose)on there for the freshwater washdown to close off the raw water, so I thought that may be the problem(besides the fact they are illegal), but when I took it out it worked perfectly... but anyways I replaced it with a SS Ball valve. Now everything points to a $3.99 part (the thermostat).. It seems that it is stuck shut when we ran it on the lake, as there was no water coming through the exhaust, either that or the water turned to steam before it could exit the exhaust pipes. I know because the old wet exhust hose melted away from the exhaust manifolds and there was no water exiting the pipes when at idle. Whenever we run the cold hose water through it, it makes it out of the exhaust just fine. I took off the water pump that circulates the water inside the engine and found out that was shot, so I replaced that. Tomorrow I am going to pull the thermostat out tomorrow and test it with a lighter to see if it will open. I will replace it with a new one anyways while I have it out. If I replace that and it still doesn't work, I am out of answers.
Capt Duane
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Gary S View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-27-2008 at 3:01am
I think you have a raw water pump issue. I think your raw water pump for one reason or another is not pulling water.If you had the pump all apart, I'm thinking you put the "cam" back in the pump wrong. The cam and the rotation determine which way the water flows. Have you checked the impeller since you overheated it,they won't last long when run dry. You can't test a thermostat with a lighter,and if your going thru all that work to remove it just replace it, and don't use a automobile one either. Let us know if you are using a sherwood pump and what rotation your engine is and someone will be able to help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SemperFIsh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-29-2008 at 12:48am
Here is what I found:
Apparently the impellar was backwards because that was the first problem, it was broke into a couple pieces and jammed with the fins against each other inside. Everyone who says you can install the impellar backwards and have the fins snap the other way can prove it on their own boat. And I was going to replace the thermostat, but there wasn't one to begin with. My grandpa says he hasn't run one for as long as he can remember. Told me to check the book and if it says anything about a thermostat, then install one. Otherwise, it is not necessary. Thoughts on this? Keep in mind I know they install one for a reason, but I am not going to go putting one in just because someone says to do it. I listen to valid reasons and do my own research, then make my own determination. What would running the boat without a thermostat do? Gary S, not sure about the type of pump, can't find one like it, and its a starboard rotation engine, '78 chevy 350 OMC.    
Capt Duane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-29-2008 at 1:29am
Capt,

Is this your water pump, I am guessing it might be as this is off a 76 omc 305.





I had a heck of a time with it. I did about a hundred different tests on it and couldnt come up with anything that definitively said it was not good. It didnt appear to have any leaks. I sent it to Depco and they said too bad, cant rebuild. I finally convinced myself it was bad when I held the "in" hose high up over it and poured it full of water. When I started up the motor, even then it wouldnt pull the water down the column. I finally bit the bullet and bought a new Johnson crank mount. It was a cheap quick easy upgrade as I don't think you will find any replacement pump if its the one I am showing.

Oh and about the thermostat...I'm no expert, but I asked the same question when I was going through my cooling problems. The answer is apparently that these motors are designed to run at a certain temp like 140-170. If you run without the T-stat and it runs much cooler, the space tolerances within the motor are apparently off - leading to wear and failure. At least that's the understanding I got from the responses.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-29-2008 at 10:09am
was the shaft seal replaced? they will pull air through that area and cause an overheat. air is thinner than water and will be pulled first if you have a suction leak...it may not leak statically while sitting.
The shaft seal is one of the most overlooked problem creators
you do need a t-stat as Larry is indicating
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SemperFIsh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-30-2008 at 9:39am
messed up, go to next post
Capt Duane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SemperFIsh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-30-2008 at 9:44am

75 Tique,
Thanks for the info. I learn so much from this site and other Nautique owners like yourself. Yes, that's my pump, (except mine is a lemon yellow, not the traditional Chevy Orange). That sucks (or not) about your pump not working even when you were gravity feeding it. So, I dropped off the pump last night to a guy named Jack, a friend of mine from the trailer park. He is supposed to be one of the best free lance boat mechanics near Tampa. I'll let you know. He said "We have the technology, we can rebuild it faster, stronger." Hopefully it wont be the $6 mill pump. More like $60 for parts and labor. The liner, impellar, and gaskets are being replace. It should be good to go now. Once I install it, I am sure that will be it with the pump issues. Now, for the next problem, but I will start a new thread if I encounter it.

Originally posted by SemperFIsh SemperFIsh wrote:

As a result of the first overheating, when we went to start it the starter seemed to get stuck sometimes and the engine would try to bump the shaft even though it was in Neutral.
                                    Capt Duane


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waterdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-31-2008 at 11:13am
The only reason to leave a t-stat out is to hide a cooling problem( cracked block,head blown head gasket ect..)The water is just flowing thou, the t-stat stops it and build water pressure.(7-15 psi)and a water problem wiil show up. Without it,the engine WILL run to cold. S/B chevys like 180*-200*F
Run it too cold and it won't make power. The pistons are still warming up and expanding but the block is NOT. The aluminum pistons expand 4x the rate of the cast iron block. If the engine is worn out you may get away with it. I bet your scuffing the cylinder walls.   
- waterdog -

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