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starting the jel coat job!

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sams 85 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2012 at 6:01pm
taping it out today,prepping and painting in the morning. anyone have any surface prep secrets or tips to share??
i plan on using a silicone wax and grease remover prior to spraying, there have been sketchy reports whether acetone will leave pinholes?? don't know if thats true. i KNOW the wax and grease remover works as i've used it on all car related things i have shot... including several fiberglass boxes. anyway, after that hit it with a tack cloth- then shoot it.
i am still unclear on how to get the correct mil thickness- any help there?
other than that I should be good. feel free to throw any ideas my way --thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2012 at 7:13pm
The place you bought the gel coat shoul've gave you a mil thickness gauge, but sounds like they didn't. How many gallons of gel are you going to shoot? What additives are you using?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-19-2012 at 7:38pm
I just want to add,check with your gel providor on what to use. I have tried acetone and styreen and have still had pinholes.Since I sprayed mutiple coats over a couple of days,and on small parts it was not a problem. If you have time for reading go here and read Mr Carter's post and links on post #2
The Duratec clear seemed to cut down the pinholes but I halfed the amount they recommended to use,50/50 to 75gel/25clear.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2012 at 9:52pm
so i am done with the bottom of the hull. It most certainly isn't as thick as it was from the factory, i have my doubts if it will be thick enough. it looks ok, a little orange peel here and there where i paused from time to time. i do have a few pinholes, but its just stuff i didn't/could see(bad suface prep on my part) and as soon as i sprayed over it i was like dang...
I used one gallon and one quart of us composites gelcoat, (thats before mixing in styrene, pigment, mekp) to cover the entire hull bottom (to the bottom of the stripe) with 4 generous coats. maybe it wasn't generous enough??   
question, what grit should i sand with if i intend on spraying more, and what grit to use before i start buffing it? thanks for the help
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2012 at 10:26pm
I used 220 between coats. When I was done applying the gel,I went the whole route 400,600,800,1000,2000 but remember my parts were small compaired to your hull. I put it on thick so I could sand it smooth.I wanted it to polish up like it came from a mold,and leave enough to sand and polish in the future if needed. Post up some pictures if you can
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 8:56pm
masked off ready to spray




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 9:04pm
there are some spots i will have to touch up. the back picture shows one. if the thickness needs to be about the same as it came from the factory, then i am going to be blocking and respraying. i am about half as thick as it was originally...



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 9:17pm
Originally posted by sams 85 sams 85 wrote:

there are some spots i will have to touch up. the back picture shows one.


Looking good! Black is the hardest to work with it shows every imperfection.There is a reason why the first Corvettes were white!
Are you talking this picture behind the rudder port Steve? If your going to sand it anyway you could just clean it off and put some on with a brush,just basically let it puddle on and sand it down again,using a block.It will sand down easily. Then you could give the whole thing another coat. The great thing about gel is you can just add more as long as you have the color from the same batch. If you go and buy more and then spray it on,there can be color differences and when you sand and buff you could go deeper in some areas and you will see the color differences stick out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 9:18pm
thanks gary, yea i know what you mean about looking like it came from a mold. mine is very rough right now. i thought i sprayed it thick, i used a 2.2 tip in the hvlp gun and had to put the pressure up to about 70-80 at the gun(i need a gauge ON the gun, so i know what it was actually at) it was at 90 on the regulator on the compressor. i started with around 50-55 at the gun and it was spattery, like it was too thick or not flowing good. after i bumped the pressure a couple times it went away, also i added a little more styrene the second batch, about 15% and that helped too.   
any ideas on how i can check the actual mil thickness ? i have no clue and having went to college for autobody i'm kinda ashamed of that fact.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 9:24pm
ok see the things i don't know, thats helpful... because i have a lot of spots like that... but i was talking about the picture from the rear where the platform mounts, you can see a big gouge that i missed !! but thats cool, great tip.
i don't think i'll have a problem matching the black... :) the upper color will be a pure white so that won't be hard either.
i'm starting to like gel-- it seems easier to work with than car paint!
but yes black is the hardest to work with, this will be my third project that is black. 2 cars and now this. we'll see how i do.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 9:24pm
I have no idea how to check thickness Steve, Nautique frk will know I'm sure.I know there is a gauge but do not how it works.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 9:25pm
Hi Sam - Not sure if your shooting for a good enough here or if this is going to be a show piece? From my experience with body work, it looks like you have a good deal of fairing and blocking left to do.   I would highly recommend an inline air sander/panel sander to help get some of the highs and lows out.   I have used a cheap rattle can "guide coat" in the past to help you see where the high spots and low spots are.   if you shoot a light color on the area (dark is ok in this case) and then shoot a contrasting light or dark color in a "splotchy mist" over the top, you'll see pretty quick where the high spots are.   they are the areas where the splotchy coat comes off quickly.   as you continue to sand, you'll see when you're close to smooth as the low spot guide coat comes off. Body work is very time consuming, but if you take your time, you can come out with at VERY nice finished project.   Another hint is that if you can feel a bump or ridge with your hand, you'll see it in the final product.   Keep at it the final product will be something to be really proud of!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 9:27pm
Originally posted by sams 85 sams 85 wrote:

   
i'm starting to like gel-- it seems easier to work with than car paint!


My experence too,I like sanding and being able to add a little more.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 9:32pm
i have an inline sander, i can't seem to find 180-220 sheets for it just stuff below 80... at least no where in savannah has any. i would use that in a heart beat, but i am going old school, a block. i know it'll take longer but this WILL be good looking when i am done- the sides especially since i did the carbon fiber!! thanks for the input!
ok gary- maybe he'll chime in or i may pm him... thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gR@HaM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 10:13pm
Good effort, takes me back to a couple of months ago strange how soon you forget what a cr@ppy job spraying gel is! Black aswell, cool! I used an air DA sander on mine before painting the stripe and graphics but still need to finish off with a wetsand.
Looks like youre doing a good job imho
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 10:18pm
Originally posted by sams 85 sams 85 wrote:

i can't seem to find 180-220 sheets for it just stuff below 80...


Check online for some,   I know Amazon has it, and I would guess other outlets as well
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 10:20pm
Can't you just buy regular wet and dry paper and cut it down? I thought all sanders were a standard size. I bought one of these to do my work after I blocked it down.On sale you can pick them up for about 40 bucks. I started buying my disc's at McMaster Carr because I'm so close,I get them next day.No one local carries any good selections anymore,and I spent too much time running around trying to find them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 10:25pm
Originally posted by Gary S Gary S wrote:

Can't you just buy regular wet and dry paper and cut it down? I thought all sanders were a standard size. I bought one of these to do my work after I blocked it down.On sale you can pick them up for about 40 bucks. I started buying my disc's at McMaster Carr because I'm so close,I get them next day.No one local carries any good selections anymore,and I spent too much time running around trying to find them.


the long board paper is special, it is longer than the 12" sheets you get in home depot packets.   Usually LB paper comes in precut packs or in a roll that is pre cut to width.   those little wet sanders look pretty cool !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 10:38pm
Kris,
You ned to get out of the "home center" frame of mind!! No, HD will not have the proper paper you need. Do some searching and you will find plenty of abrasive supplies that will help.

I NEVER buy abrasives from a home center!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 10:39pm
yes quite cool indeed. i have a system that i plan on using if they still make the correct paper- they did 7 years ago... haha it has probably changed twice! it was a system 3m made for cars- i like it, so if its still around i'll do it that way.
and yea i'll have to look around and get it from the internet, my only prob with it is the foam that is on there isnt' as true as a board and little humps can still stick around. plus you have to hold it just right or else you just sanding with the front or back. we'll see how it goes- i may try the inline.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-21-2012 at 11:29pm
I have also found IMO that for flat sheets 3m is the best,tried Norton just don't like it. Mirka foam backed 1000&2000 is real nice as well as their Royal line. McMaster Carr's brand ,whoever they use is nice too
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tbeard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-22-2012 at 4:52pm
Steve....impressive job. Very encouraging seeing your project moving along. Its motivating me to start on mine...(I have to decide whether to stop skiing for the season and restore the boat or keep footing)

Can you tell us exactly how you flipped your boat and do you have it resting on barrels or something so it does not move when working? Thanks
Thanks.......Tom
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-24-2012 at 3:00am
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Kris,
You ned to get out of the "home center" frame of mind!! No, HD will not have the proper paper you need. Do some searching and you will find plenty of abrasive supplies that will help.

I NEVER buy abrasives from a home center!!
    

I don't buy mine from hd , I was just trying to think of how to describe the sheet size    I have been guilty of buying it from the auto body supply store though. I'll have to do some budget pricing when I do my stringers... You guys have proven that a little time spent in research helps on the budget side of things.   With two little kids, and on a single income, I have to squeeze nickels pretty hard to make the numbers work out!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dreaming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-01-2012 at 10:38pm
Sam - How's the gel coming along?   I am excited to see how you finish this out!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sams 85 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-29-2012 at 9:06pm
It's been slow but I just blocked it down last night with 3 friends and it took us all about 5-6 hrs. That was with 100 grit 180 was loading up entirely too fast. We were wet sanding btw. So today it's been cold and wet and windy so tomm I will be spraying after the heater gets it warm in there. Ill try to get a pic up tommorow or the next day. Other than that it's just been sitting there. :(
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