spring tune up
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Boat Maintenance
Forum Discription: Discuss maintenance of your Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10026
Printed Date: September-26-2024 at 8:12pm
Topic: spring tune up
Posted By: phospher
Subject: spring tune up
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:59am
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got my parts from skidim today.
new plugs, wires, cap, rotor, rw impeller, and new hour meter. now i just need to try and figure out how to change out the cap and rotor without changing the timing. i've never replaced a distributor before. should be good for the boat since it hasn't been done since 2004. the old wires were looking pretty crappy. going to pickup the boat out of storage on the 12th. just can't wait to get back out on the lake.. still have a bit of time though being in Wisconsin. |
Replies:
Posted By: 81nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 10:08am
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Don't pull that distributor out, there's no need to with just a cap and rotor change. Don't make extra work for yourself. It should fire right up after you put the new pieces on but you'll still need to check the timing, should be pretty close though. ------------- You can’t change the wind but you can adjust your sails |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 10:14am
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well if the clamp for the base isn't tight then you can change the timing so check and make sure it's tight just incase. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 12:44pm
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81nautique, i'm confused. what do you mean don't pull the distributor out? are you telling me not to replace the distributor cap? i meant that i would just replace the cap and rotor etc...
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Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 12:50pm
If thats all you meant, then no worries When you said you had "never replaced a distributor before" that implied you planned to remove the entire distributor from the engine, which is not necessary. ------------- |
phospher wrote:Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 12:53pm
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ahh, my bad. that is my lack of knowledge speaking.
thanks. ------------- |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:02pm
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Personally I label all of the wires with masking tape and numbers before I take them off the cap. Then I put the new cap/rotor on and put the wires back onto the cap according to my numbered labels. That's the most idiot-proof way of doing it- no need to break out the firing order diagram just to change a cap and rotor. For the wires, I replace them one at a time to preserve the firing order. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:11pm
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Joel I wouldn't go to all of that trouble all you have to do is locate the indexing boss on the base of the old cap, pull the wire directly above it then install it in the same position on the new cap and then go one at a time in a clockwise or counter clock wise direction one wire at a time. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:20pm
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how about this?
-pull the cap with all the wires still on -then install the new cap and rotor in the same position, -then hold the old cap with all the wires on it (to orientate the new one) and install the wires in the same position? -finally, install one plug wire at a time to make sure i keep the same order. does that make sense? ------------- |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:25pm
That's a good idea too. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: 81nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:25pm
Chris, His next question is going to be "What's the indexing boss". What some can do blindfolded is uncharted waters for others. The labeling is over kill for some and just a good precaution for others. If it's his first time under the hood I would follow Joel's advice. ------------- You can’t change the wind but you can adjust your sails |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:28pm
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so true 81nautique. ------------- |
Posted By: boat dr
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:33pm
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AALLEN, if you do not mark both the plug wires and the NEW CAP how will this help. With this said he will have to find the index mark to properly align the old and new cap,then label both wires and the cap............Boat dr ------------- boat dr /diaries/details.asp?ID=4631 - 1949 Dart /diaries/details.asp?ID=1533 - 1964 American Skier |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:43pm
that's basicly the same thing but if you don't locate the indexing feature of the cap you can get the wires shifted over one or two towers which isn't a big deal but you will have to go back and retime it and it's going to be a little harder to start the first time. Also the rotor can not be installed backwards as it is indexed as well and for you to install it wrong then you are forcing it on and will break the rotor in the process. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: 81nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:54pm
I think you're just being arguementative BBillly, I merely agreed that labeling his wires was going to be easier than the way a real mechanic like you would do it. I just tried to stop him from pulling his distributor out and making a big mess of it. I'll let you take over now. ALAN ------------- You can’t change the wind but you can adjust your sails |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 1:57pm
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i'm starting to get a better picture in my head of this....
what is the index mark and how do i make sure i keep the old and new cap aligned? from my understanding keeping these marks lined up will keep my timing the same. ------------- |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:01pm
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it's molded feature on the base of the cap, a square block most of the time that is raised, Should be real easy to see when you are looking into the inside of the cap. And then on the base of the dist there is a pocket it sits in, again pretty easy to see. Sometimes you can actually see the two with the cap installed. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:04pm
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I label them clockwise, just 1-8, then take them off. I try to keep in mind that the #1 labeled wire was in a certain spot, like 1 o'clock or noon or whatever. Then I get the new cap/rotor on, start at that same position (1 o'clock/noon/whatever) and put the wires back on in order. It's no-fail and a piece of cake. I do the same on the plug-side of the wires if I'm taking more than one plug out at once- dead simple and fail-safe. Just to clarify- I don't use any index mark on the cap. I just swap the caps and put the wires back on in order, starting at the same point as the #1 wire was before I took it off. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:14pm
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will the fast way is pull one wire, remember it's location, 1-2-3 o'clock what ever, remove the old cap put on the new one, install that one wire that is loose, then either go CCW or CW one wire at a time done in about two minutes, just be sure to push on the wire and not the boot as it may not seat all of the way by pushing on the boot. It's actually a good idea to slip the boots back a little before install it in the cap. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: boat dr
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:24pm
I am not a real mechanic, but i try real hard to do things correctly. As far as the cap and wires , I MARK THEM BOTH, that way I do not rely on memory.Takes a little time but it solves a lot of problems later..........Billy ------------- boat dr /diaries/details.asp?ID=4631 - 1949 Dart /diaries/details.asp?ID=1533 - 1964 American Skier |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:31pm
that makes good sense to me. i think i will try that. tell me, you have to be a moron to mess this up right? ------------- |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:32pm
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Lot of talk about a distributor cap. If your wires are back in in the correct firing order, and starting on the correct cylinder, it's "correct" no matter how they got there. ------------- |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:36pm
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let me ask another question, when i got my new raw water pump it came with a rubber O ring. when i removed my raw water pump for the winter last year i don't remember such an O ring. i do remember another type seal that was more of a gasket type. i compared the two impellers and they are in fact the same exact ones. what do you make of that? ------------- |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:54pm
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Phil, if you unlock the dist cap without taking any wires off, you'll see that it will only go back on 1 way. This will highlite where and what the index point is. Once you've done it once, you'll be a pro.
FWIW-you guys wouldn't believe the crazy stuff I've labeled...helps with brain cramps?!!? LOL ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 2:57pm
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You'll need the o-ring. There is a small groove it fits in. Someone else can explain it better, but you'll get air leaks and overheat w/o it. ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 3:04pm
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well for years when we would do engine work we would just throw the nuts and bolts in a coffee can then sort them later and never did we not get the bolts back where they belonged, so if you need to take pictures, labels or what ever method you want work within your abilities, but when you need to get teh job done and out the door you don't have time to label and take pictures, but not everyone can retain a picture in their mind for long periods of time or figure out that bolts too long or too short to go in that spot. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 3:51pm
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i think you guys have all cleared this up pretty good for me. i'll change it out on the 12th and report back with any questions/issues.
thanks guys i really appreciate all the help. ------------- |
Posted By: 81nautique
Date Posted: April-03-2008 at 4:02pm
If you don't make it back in I'm sure there's a Nautique in the area that will tow you back in.  Just kidding. Have fun, best way to learn is to dig right in.
------------- You can’t change the wind but you can adjust your sails |
Posted By: jbear
Date Posted: April-04-2008 at 1:24am
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To confusing for me....think I'll just buy some beer and pull the boat over to Eddie's or MM's bro Keith.
john ------------- "Loud pipes save lives" AdamT sez "I'm Canadian and a beaver lover myself"... |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-05-2008 at 11:01pm
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ok,
i installed plugs, cap, and rotor. took her to the lake and tried to start it up. nothing wouldn't even pop. needless to say i was dissapointed. so when i got home i took out a spark plug and turned it over for a few seconds and i'm not seeing any spark on the plug. now how in the hell did i mess that up. it seemed pretty straight forward when i replaced the cap and i know i put all the plugs back on in the right order. what should my next step be? ------------- |
Posted By: Behl
Date Posted: April-05-2008 at 11:29pm
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Are you sure the rotor is seated correctly. Must be in slot all the way on shaft
Also check coil wire. Could have pulled out of the coil a little. ------------- Steve in Indy http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1702&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1976&yrend=1980" rel="nofollow - Redone 1977 Ski Tique |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-05-2008 at 11:43pm
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I'm assuming it ran before the tune-up? And the engine is turning over, just no fire?
It's gotta be something simple. My humble advice would be to double check everything you just did then check for spark again at the plugs. If no spark at plugs... check for spark at coil wire and go from there. Just my 2 cents and I'm no expert. HTH. Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-05-2008 at 11:47pm
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i just took the cap off again, i could hear the spring loaded part that touches the rotor become compressed so i know it's touching the rotor. i'm pretty sure the rotor is on right. it's all the way down.
just checked the coil wire again too and it is metal to metal. ------------- |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-05-2008 at 11:49pm
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yes, it ran before... last summer.
so just hook a plug up to the coil wire hookup on the distributor to see if i have spark? ------------- |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-05-2008 at 11:53pm
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Yes hold the plug with the coil wire attached close to an engine ground (1/8" or so), turn it over, and check for spark.
That's how I've done it. But again I'm no expert. 
Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:06am
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i plugged a spark plug into the middle of the distributor cap, no spark. i even turned the lights off in my garage to be sure i would see it. ------------- |
Posted By: boat dr
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:15am
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Remove it from the cap and plug it into the coil, that long round black thing and try it again.............Boat dr ------------- boat dr /diaries/details.asp?ID=4631 - 1949 Dart /diaries/details.asp?ID=1533 - 1964 American Skier |
Posted By: ripsaw
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:15am
| Maybe I'm miss reading this, but if you put your plug in the middle of the distributer cap, you just unhooked the coil. Probably just not understanding your terminology |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:17am
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sorry, bout that. okay, going to go hook a spark plug into the coil. i'll report back in 3 minutes.
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Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:19am
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ok this is weird as hell to me. during cranking the engine i see no spark, but just as the engine stops cranking i see it spark once or twice. ------------- |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:29am
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Maybe this will help...
Ignition Coil Test 1. Disconnect the ignition coil output wire at the distributor cap. 2. Connect a spark plug to the end of the ignition coil output wire which you just disconnected. 3. Connect a ground wire to the threaded portion of the spark plug. 4. Disconnect the ignition coil ground wire from the negative terminal on the coil . 5. Connect one end of a ground wire to the ignition coil negative terminal. 6. Turn the ignition switch to the ON position. 7. Tap the other end of the ignition coil ground wire jumper on an good grounding point and look for sparks at the spark plug that correspond to the frequency of your tapping of the ground wire. 8. If you have a good spark at the spark plug, the ignition coil is good. 9. If you don't get a good spark, check for approximately 12 VDC from the coil positive terminal to ground with the ignition switch in the ON position. You should also get approximately 12 VDC from the coil negative terminal to ground ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:33am
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ok, i think my battery is getting weak..... ------------- |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:36am
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Well that's the first thing... make sure your battery is good and charged. ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: boat dr
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:54am
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phospher , wish you were closer......
Are you sure the points are "BREAKING" You should have a .020 break when the points arm is on top of the cam...... ------------- boat dr /diaries/details.asp?ID=4631 - 1949 Dart /diaries/details.asp?ID=1533 - 1964 American Skier |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 1:20am
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boat dr, that language is chinese to me. breaking? i did replace both belts today too...
my boat has been converted to electronic ignition too, in case that helps. ------------- |
Posted By: ripsaw
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 3:14am
| Waiting to here if what joed posted works for you. Good Luck!!!!!!! |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 3:27am
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i had to run out and buy a battery charger but when i got home and checked out the manual it says "not recommended for delco voyager" and i have a AC delco voyager 720mca. my battery has a little eye on it and it's still green, and cranking.. i can't believe it's still cranking. at any rate i'll try tomorrow. i've been working on the boat pretty much all day and night and am very frustrated.
could the ignition coil just go bad over winter? i don't think it's all that old, it's a petronix flame thrower. ------------- |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 11:40am
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I dont know guys, do these rotors have the metal piece at the bottem for the pick-up? maybe the wrong rotor? ...he converted, I dont know the Fords real well but with the chevy's i had a bad pick-up last week and these guy's (boat owner) replaced EVERYTHING but the pick-up, they even bought 2 coils and still thought it was the coil. it really is hard to diagnose this stuff without being there usually it is always something very simple or overlooked ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:02pm
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Phil,
Which distributor do you have? If you have the prestolite with clip-down cap... the rotor may be the issue. I have that distributor and when I upgraded to Pertronix, the kit included a rotor as well. I don't have the documentation handy but something about the "stock" rotor might not work for some reason. If this is the case try putting your old rotor back in and see if it solves the no-fire problem. Let us know. I know how frustrating this can be, but bear with this group. You'll get it figured out. Good luck! Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 12:30pm
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thats the first thing that popped in my head was the rotor, ive been there and did that, not seating the rotor all the way,wrong parts, bad tachs shorting the coil, forgeting to re-connect wires, *************** happens to all of us...many countless and payless hours trying to figure this crap out. i d*cked with a boat for 3 days on an issue like this, got the boat in the water go to fire it and the same GD thing happened, the crew was ready to fish the cooler was full and they looked at me like i was an idiot. went to the parts store for my third coil and the old timer behind the counter knew the engine and said try removing your tach wire from the coil, sure as *************** we were fishing within the hour. thank god for old timers ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 1:52pm
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hey,
the rotor did look a little bit different then the one i took out..... i'll try and re-swap the old one back in. i'll report back again.. thanks gents. ------------- |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 2:05pm
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BINGO! you called it wrong rotor. put the old one back in turned the key, saw spark and wanted to fire up on 7 cylinders.
question is, where do i get a new rotor? thanks so much. just made my day. ------------- |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 2:21pm
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simple and overlooked, good to hear you got it going, good call Joed
------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 3:02pm
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Phil,
Great!!!
Where to get the new rotor? Good question. I need to find one too, cause I'm planning a tune up also. I got my EI conversion kit from http://www.vintageperformance.com/ - Vintage Performance I'm going to contact them tomorrow and I'll keep you posted. Let me know if you find out anything on your end please. Also... you stated firing on "all 7 cylinders". Uhh... what happened to the 8th?
Glad you got it started. Have fun. Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 3:41pm
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7 just because i had one plug out so i could see the spark....
i just brought her to the lake and let it run for a few minutes, seems to be running good.. started right up and seemed to be very responsive. i did have a little water leak where i put the raw water pump back together after replacing the impeller, maybe i need to make it a little tighter? ------------- |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 3:50pm
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Ok... good, glad to hear it's running well!
I'm not sure what raw water pump you have. I have a Johnson. If it's similar... you have 2 possible places for leaking. 1. The front plate gasket. Just tighten it up if the gasket is seated right and in good condition. 2. The rear seal. If it's leaking "behind" the pump the rear seal may need to be replaced. Is it leaking bad, or just dripping a little bit.? You going skiing today? Where do you live? Cheers. Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 4:09pm
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no skiing yet, only the boat launch area is thawed. the rest of the lake is all slush... but hopefully next weekend we should be good. i live in wisconsin near milwaukee.
ok, water pump... just leaking a little bit doesn't seem to be leaking by the o-ring. it's a sherwood. i replaced the rubber o-ring, but between the plate and the actuall pump there was a paper gasket, it was all jacked up so i didn't put that back. make sense? if i make it any tighter i think i'll strip the bolt head. ------------- |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 4:20pm
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I'm not familiar with the Sherwood Pump, but I'd guess if there was a gasket there to begin with, you'll need a new gasket to stop it from leaking. You didn't get a new gasket with the Impeller? In a pinch you could probably use some RTV Sealant, but a new gasket would be the best route.
HTH Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 4:28pm
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http://skidim.com/prodinfo.asp?number=RM0125 - Sherwood R/W Pump Gasket ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 4:28pm
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nope, when i bought the new impeller it only came with the o-ring gasket. ------------- |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-06-2008 at 4:35pm
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thanks, going to order one now..... sucks i have to take that thing apart again, kind of a pain, but now i know. ------------- |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-07-2008 at 1:18pm
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joed, i called skidim today, they told me that the rotor in the pertronix kits has some sort of magnet in it?? they told me to check napa... i will check napa later this week and see if they carry it. ------------- |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-07-2008 at 7:05pm
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Thanks Phil,
I emailed Vintage... here is the what they said. *** I purchased a Pertronix EI Conversion Kit #1581from you last spring. I'm planning a tune-up this spring and need another rotor. I assume I'll need a similar rotor that came in the kit. Can I buy one from you guys? If so... please provide part#, price and ordering info. Ford 351W Marine with Prestolite Clip Down Distributor. *** Their response... *** Joe, Is there a problem with your existing rotor? I'd be very surprised if there is after just one season. I'd suggest just inspecting it. At worst there might be a little discoloring at the electrode or just a hint of corrosion which could be readily scraped off. Yes, we do offer a replacement rotor, p/n 1581R, $7.50, free shipping, if you really need one. Carl Retro Rockets *** Hope that helps. Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-07-2008 at 7:12pm
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cool, i wonder if that rotor will work in my kit? i bought the boat with this electronic kit so i don't know exactly which kit it has.
what do you think? ------------- |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-07-2008 at 7:20pm
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What distributor do you have. You can use the vintage performance website to find out which pertronix you have and go from there.
If you have the prestolite with clip down cap you have the #1581 kit. Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |
Posted By: phospher
Date Posted: April-07-2008 at 7:27pm
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cool, i do have the prestolite clip down so i will order a new rotor from vintage.
thanks Joe -phil ------------- |
Posted By: joed
Date Posted: April-07-2008 at 11:05pm
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You're welcome Phil,
Glad I could help. These guys have helped me out a ton over the past 2 years, so I'm glad I could give back in my own small way. Have fun. Joe ------------- Joe D. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb202/joedelbecq/BoatAngle.jpg - 1986 Ski Eliminator |