getting off foreing oil
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Category: General Correct Craft Discussion
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Forum Discription: Anything non-Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10185
Printed Date: December-27-2024 at 3:05pm
Topic: getting off foreing oil
Posted By: gigem75
Subject: getting off foreing oil
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 12:36pm
| As I was driving to work today I was thinking.... the vast majority of driving is done comuting to work and back, not that far really. Most households have more than one car. Why not have the government guarenttee a loan to have one car conveted to an electric car? It would be the easiest loan in the world to pay back because you wouldn't be spending a hundred bucks a week to fill up your car. It only costs about a buck fifty to charge the batteries at night. Plugging it in is a pretty small price to pay to get off our dependence of foreign oil. You say that will bring the price of gas down. Well keep it high, they do it with cigraettes, why the hell not with gas. We could fix our roads and bridges, educate our children, and provide afforable health care. We would also be able to afford/require coal generation to add the scrubbers necessary run clean. The only thing we could dictate not to spend the money on would be useless wars. This would also lessen the use of corn for ethanol which will bring food prices back down. Put people to work starting businesses to do the conversions, and bring down the cost of diesel so we can get what we make where we want it without squeezing truckers out of business. What do ya'all think? |
Replies:
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 12:45pm
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the guy's that the President answers too wont let that happen..... ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: 62 wood
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 1:04pm
Electric vehicles wont pull my enclosed trailer , needed for my job...
The ceo of Shell said on the news a few weeks ago, we just need to change our driving habits... I bet he's even had downsized to a 4 passenger Lear....poor guy... ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 1:05pm
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If you haven't seen http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_Killed_the_Electric_Car%3F - Who Killed The Electric Car? then put it in your Netflix queue or rent it somewhere. Great movie that answers all of your questions, unfortunately.
See also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_EV1 - GM EV-1 ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: gigem75
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 1:27pm
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You can keep your truck to tow whatever, 80 percent of the driving in this country is done by people in a car going to and from work. That is where this would be most beneficial. I appreciate the comments but so far I still don't see why it wouldn't work. I guess when gas gets to 10 bucks a gallon the will to do this will be strong enough. I'm saying why wait?
There was a 60 sometning Camero SS restored to electric, and it would do burn outs. I'd drive that to work everyday. |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 2:02pm
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I seen a new Nano the other day, I think its made in China and its around $2500.00 new,
BTW, I still wouldnt buy it Gigem, this is one of those subjects that gets everybody in trouble, the consumer dictates fuel prices, the price of fuel is directly related to the demand for oil, as with the price of a new Correct Craft, the demand drives up the price. we at one time were not competeing for oil, China is in the middle of an industrial revolution as once we were because of the auto industry and the likes of things that drive the economy. If this country banded together and decided not to buy a Foriegn car for one year just think what would happen.....post your thoughts ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: 62 wood
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 2:18pm
Think about this, What if we ever went to war against China? Who would make any of our "everyday" products? How many U.S. steel mills have shut down in the last decade? Where/who would be able to ramp-up to help wartime production?
 ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: azeus17
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 2:20pm
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I agree that we could probably come up with better solutions to out oil dependency, but is electricity the way to go...I think not. We all would just start bitching when the price of electricity jumps to double the price and our cars start dieing on the highway because they did not get a full charge the night before or the battery is starting to go bad. Which brings up a whole other issue. What do you do with millions of huge toxic batterys after they die?
Sure, they even have sports cars that are electric now (Tesla), but with a range of 220 miles per charge, it would take me like 5 days to road trip to visit my parents in MI. That being said...I really have no better ideas at this point. Hydrogen? ------------- Boats: Current: 02 SANTE Sold: 89 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 2:37pm
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No reason why there couldnt be standard batteries or fuel cells that you could exchange at a "gas" station anywhere in the country. There would of course need to be incentives to make it happen before it became an immediate need. There are a million better ways, none of them perfect, my issue is we arent even thinking of exploring any of them at this point. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 2:56pm
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you guys have a lot of miss informed views about EV's, the only reason it's not producted is because of battery life and the range associated with it. But there are other forms of EV's like true Hybrids that are much better and have the range and power you'll ever need. What is marketed today as a hybrid are not really hybrids but a ICE with electric drive motors for low speed driving or take off only. Basicly the electric motors are only used when starting then the ICE (Internal Combustion Engine) runs everything else. A true hybrid uses a ICE that runs a generator constanly to charge the pack and provide power to the drive units or electric motors so as long as there's gas for the ICE which will be 4-5 times more efficent less polituting than the traditional car/truck and equates to a range in 100 mpg for the gas used and a total range well above current applications doubling or tripling it so instead of 350 miles on atank you might get 600-1000 miles from it.
oh and if we can design a unit to power a class 6 bus in NYC then I'm sure we can design one that will tow your boat too After all the Impact AKA EV1 out ran the corvette a country mile, you step on the gas you have full torque from the drive units instantly. Not many people have ever driven one (EV1), I'm just not one of them. So if anyone elese would like to talk about personel experience driving a totally electric car or hybrids join in but golf carts and the likes don't count. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: gigem75
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 5:12pm
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Instantanous torque is a pretty cool thing. No one has the final answer yet, helium3 mined on the moon for fusion will someday be an option. The helium found on earth produces to many neutrons during the fusion and the walls of the reactor wear out to fast whereas helium3 fusion produces almost no neturons so the reactor life is much longer making it cheaper. A pound of helium 3 would power the city of London for a year or some absurb number like that.
My idea is you take the car you have now and take that to a shop someone like Eric opens and have it converted to batteries. There is so much coal that I don't see the price of electricty going up that much especially when it only costs a couple of bucks worth of electricy to charge the car overnight. Granted this is not for everyone but with a gurarentted loan that would be easy as hell to pay back look at it as a new deal for the times we're in. If we can build Hoover Dams and the TVA why not allow people to convert their minvans to take the kids to soccer practice. As far as the A/C issue goes it will take some hp for that but as far as I'm concerned we're in the mess we're in now because of A/C. Before there was a/c people sat on their porches and knew their neighbors, kids played outside and built forts, and we slept with the windows open with a fan on. Now everyone stays locked up in their homes to keep the cold air in and in the process the very fabric of our society has been destroyed. |
Posted By: Tim D
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 5:40pm
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A Ford Escape hybrid has $8,000 worth batteries in the back. If someone hits you, that's a lot of money. When the car gets some age on it, thats a lot for insurance to cover, you know they total out older cars now just because of the cost on air bags when there's really not very much body damage. ------------- Tim D |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 5:49pm
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well they are throwing around the hybrid word out very generously now a days because it should be labeled electric assist and not hybrid because a true hybrid doesn't have to have batteries to power it as it has IC engine that drives a generator to create the power and batteries are only need as a back-up to high current demands.
Also the drive motors are A/C induction motors that's why there is an inverter in the systems. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 6:13pm
Why are the batteries $8000? If we made 100 million of them a year because they fit in 80 percent of the vehicles on the road I think we might be able to do a little better on price. That market might push development along a little faster as well. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Tim D wrote:Posted By: 62 wood
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 6:43pm
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hmmmm,...... maybe I should "deep-6" the idea of putting that evil gas-hog 300 horse Crusader engine of mine in the 'cuda and go for 3000lbs of batteries..
Or... Kristof...you got any spare BBQ cylinders laying around?  ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: The Lake
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 8:23pm
Joe, I agree with you; I'd really like to see someone take a stab at a comprehensive energy policy. There was a report here in Kansas City last night about a local guy who had converted his car to run on deep fat fryer left-overs. I think he paid about 800 bucks to convert his car (I didn't see the whole report). He uses diesel until the car warms up and begins heating up the "alternative" fuel. And the deal is, he gets the "fuel" for free since most fast food joints pay to get rid of the stuff. Chuck ------------- Walk on Water www.coldwater.me http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=775&sort=&pagenum=3&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970 - 69 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-18-2008 at 8:23pm
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hey Joe, when calculaters first came out they were 800 bucks, now you get them in a box of cereal
plasma tv's 5 or so years ago were 15k ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: 87BFN owner
Date Posted: April-19-2008 at 12:19pm
I live les then ten miles from Willow Run Airport and the Hydro matic plant. With in a 24 hour period it can be ready to start building bomber planes and tanks once again. All railraod tracks leading in and out are fully functional and maintained to insure this. These tracks are not even used anymore, but they could be used at a moments notice. The mills that do produce steel would only be allowed to produce steel for military use, no other. I am lucky enough to know and work with quite a few guys that built the bombers back in the day. There stories are really cool to hear. ------------- |
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: April-19-2008 at 12:37pm
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My job requires me to drive about 25k a year. Gas is killing me, but everytime I look at cars that get 30 mpg or better, they seem so small that I don't want to risk riding in a little POS, so I have a full size short bed 2 wd that gets 19 mpg. I think we need to start drilling our own oil and get away from OPEC. ------------- |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-19-2008 at 12:48pm
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the only problem i have with electric cars is i would forget to plug the damn thing in and it would be dead in the morning,
Riley, gas is killing me too, im looking for a puddle jumper as we speak, i dont care what it looks like as long as it gets 30 or so mpg, to me its not a luxury anymore its a necessity ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: 1969cc
Date Posted: April-19-2008 at 10:55pm
I would worry about batteries shorting out from the impact. If you ever saw one short out you know what I mean. ------------- If you see light at the end of the tunnel you might be looking the wrong way http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=3674 - 69 Mustang |
Posted By: 79Tique
Date Posted: April-20-2008 at 12:58am
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[1969cc wrote]
I would worry about batteries shorting out from the impact. If you ever saw one short out you know what I mean. [/QUOTE] Ever see a barrel of gas explode? It's pretty impressive as well. ------------- Work to live, not live to work. |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-20-2008 at 12:01pm
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I kept telling my nephew who at his age knows everything that i kept smelling his battery overcharge, 10 minutes later it let loose and scared the *************** out of him, he didnt get hurt but i bet he learned a lesson..the gases from overcharging are whats flammable, if i smell the gas i'll turn off the charger and walk away for a while ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-20-2008 at 12:09pm
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tique, i always got a story, in the 80's where i worked some idiot was mig welding on top of a empty thinner barrel and me and another guy were walking into the building this barrel took a spark, it shattered the front windows, blew all of the drop ceiling tiles out in the office and the barrel ended up oval, it threw him about 20 feet and he went right to the hospital. i remeber it like it was yesterday it was loud and he's lucky it didnt kill him ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: 79Tique
Date Posted: April-20-2008 at 7:20pm
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Eric, I worked for the fire department for a while and saw a few gasoline explosions. One was a fuel tank on a old pick up in a wreck, it makes quite an impact.
I was making the point that we comfortable with the gasoline danger in vehicles. I think we would be fine with the batteries as well. However I think the ultimate solution to lower consumption vehicles will need to not use batteries for reasons other than safety. ------------- Work to live, not live to work. |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-20-2008 at 8:37pm
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a 4 cylinder diesel car easily could get 50 mpg, plus diesel is very safe and does not put out carbon monoxides, why dont we do it??? ask Kristof, probably 90%of the cars in Europe are Diesel powered.....this is technology that is right now and could cut fuel consumption in this country by 2/3 's, tell me why, its cause the manufactures of cars in this country are only required to hit 24mpg unlike Europe which is 36mpg ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: April-20-2008 at 8:50pm
I too have see this! I was working at a metal fab shop and one of the helpers decided he wanted to get a promotion to be a welder but felt he needed to practice. It was coffee break so he went and got some scrap metal to weld. That scrap just happened to be a empty 55 gal drum of MEK. As soon as he struck a arc, it burnt through the barrel. It then split the bottom of the drum open and the drum took off like a rocket rattling around in the bar joists for maybe 2 seconds. He too was lucky that he didn't get hurt. The only damage was to the MIG gun that the handle broke off of. He didn't get the promotion to welder!! ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: gigem75
Date Posted: April-21-2008 at 2:05am
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VW has come out with a diesel in Europe that gets 69 mpg,,,
We've got more info -- and pictures! -- about the diesel hybrid Golf we've already told you Volkswagen is rolling out at the Geneva Motor Show, and it looks impressive. According to a Google translation of Germany's Auto Bild, the potential Prius killer sports a 74-horsepower three-cylinder TDI engine -- Autoblog speculates it's the 1.4-liter used in the Polo BlueMotion -- mated to a 27-horsepower electric motor and a seven-speed double-clutch DSG transmission. There's a nickel-metal hydride battery in the trunk; a regenerative braking system helps keep it charged. The car has stop/start capability and a full-electric mode at low speed. An "energy monitor" display on the dashboard keeps tabs on what the powertrain is doing. According to Auto Bild, the hybrid Golf will get 69.9 mpg and emit 90 g/km of carbon dioxide. An earlier report by Britain's Auto Express said 89 g/km, but either way that's less than the 104 g/km emitted by the Prius and 116 emitted by the Honda Civic Hybrid. So -- is Volkswagen going to build it? VW says it's just a concept at this point, but Auto Bild says it is "more than a concept car" and Auto Express flat-out says "the first hybrid Golfs are expected here (meaning Britain) late next year." |
Posted By: 79Tique
Date Posted: April-21-2008 at 4:09am
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You guys could really get me up on a soap box with bringing up the VW Diesels. My wife and I have been driving them for years, we both have had a couple. The only one we have right now is a 2002 Golf TDI. It consistently gets around 46-48 MPG. None of our VW cars have gotten the 50+ MPG that folks talk about, but we do live at altitude in the mountains so that may play a part.
We have loved the efficiency and good power the turbo charged diesels give us in the mountains as well. We run 20% biodiesel in them, and have had no problems with it. The VW diesels run for about 250,000 miles pretty well, but the car tends to fall apart all along the way. The thing I get up on a soap box about is the price of diesel. Why the hell is it so expensive these days. From what I understand it's cheaper to make than gasoline. It makes me think someone is trying to discourage it's use in the states. When we traveled to Australia we found new diesels made by Mazda, Toyota, Subaru, and Ford. Not trucks, nice practical cars that all got the mileage of our VW. Why don't they sell those cars here? I think diesel is the best "bridge the gap" technology currently available. Even my diesel Dodge 3/4 ton, 4X4, Long bed,crew cab truck gets 19-20 MPG empty and 16-17 MPG pulling the Nautique. That's better than many of the mid sized SUVs that have less than half the towing capacity. Why don't we have more diesels in this country? I have never heard a good reason. ------------- Work to live, not live to work. |
Posted By: Kristof
Date Posted: April-21-2008 at 6:33am
This is very true, most cars here are on diesel (BTW, all commercial traffic runs on diesel over here, like trucks, diesel trains, buses...). Diesel technology has made a huge leap forward the last 15 or so years, with the development of the TDI's, the common rail,... Diesel engines today have the same (if not better) performances as engines running on gas. They are also less polluting than gas engines nowadays, due to inventions like special filters on the exhaust, better combustion,... The flip side is, now that there are more people running on diesel than on gas, the diesel price went up. It used to be about 60% of the gas price, but nuw it's about 15% (laws of offer and demand , I guess?). But still, diesel engines get a much better MPG.
We have the same story here. A Belgian and a Dutchman did the same thing to teir cars... And there are more developments going on. Thake a look at the next link: http://www.bmw.com/com/en/insights/technology/cleanenergy/phase_2/cleanenergy.html - BMW Clean Energy Why don't these technologies get off the ground...? My humble guess is: lobbying... Kristof ------------- - Gun control means: using BOTH hands! - Money doesn't make one happy, but when it rains cats and dogs, it's still better to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle... |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-21-2008 at 10:05am
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I know its not poisenous either cause a guy stopped by and told me his son in law shut the garage door and fired up the old diesel, it made him sick but it didnt kill him....btw he finally did it right the next time.
lobbying?? Ive been asking those same questions for years, as why dont we produce more diesel cars, the technology has been around for years, As americans we keep our eyes glued to a box that tells you what someone wants you to hear and you have a tendency to believe it. I still have a very hard time with the Twin Towers, you see how those people live over there, how in the hell can those people put something like that together, hit those buildings in the exact right spot and they know there were going to collapse, and to this day they cant catch a very sickly man on the run, we caught noriega, we caught all responsible death camp people, *************** we even caught Sadaam and his sons but we cant catch a guy who needs dialysis every 2 days. This is the way it is and alot of it is Greed and secret hand shakes and deals that our president cant even control....dammit its a conspiracy lol, just giving you something to think about today ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: Kristof
Date Posted: April-21-2008 at 10:56am
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Wow, this topic is getting very intresting...
At this rate, it will again become a topic where we, CCFers are gonna change the world, make history if you will... LOL Oops, I used the word "change"... Someone here said he would like to ram that particular word down Barack's throat, if he would say it one more time... ROFLOL But on a serious note, Eric, sometimes I wonder too how it is possible for a country that has the best intelligence services in the world, cannot catch that very sick man... On the other hand, it is not only one man, but a whole bunch of fanatics we have to deal with. And that's a whole other story... Greed is indeed a very powerful drive. As they say, money makes the world go round... ------------- - Gun control means: using BOTH hands! - Money doesn't make one happy, but when it rains cats and dogs, it's still better to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle... |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-21-2008 at 12:42pm
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these guys can tell me what color my underwear are right now, i really think it was a tactic to draw us into the beehive were in and im talking trillion and billion dollar contracts, all this other crap about nerve gas this and that, propaganda
I'll second that Kris, money makes the world go around ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: 79Tique
Date Posted: April-21-2008 at 2:38pm
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The burning of used deep fryer grease in diesels is old new in these parts. I have several friends that have been running there Dodge and Ford diesels on S.V.O. (Straight Vegetable Oil) for years.
The problem around here is that so many people are doing this that now you cant get the oil from the restaurants. It's all already spoken for. If you are interested in doing this there are many manufactures of conversion kits on the net. ------------- Work to live, not live to work. |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-22-2008 at 12:24am
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i asked this before and wonder why they cant take coal and turn it into a fuel to power a car, has anyone ever heard this, grind it up throw in some water and your ready to go... ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: Tim D
Date Posted: April-22-2008 at 12:54am
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Hey Eric, watch this video about the Pentagon strike. It makes me think a missle hit it, not a plane. Wait for it to load up.
http://www.pentagonstrike.co.uk/flash.htm#Main - http://www.pentagonstrike.co.uk/flash.htm#Main ------------- Tim D |
Posted By: 79Tique
Date Posted: April-22-2008 at 2:22am
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I don't know about the coal and water blend, but it seems a lot of other fuel sources are suppressed in the U.S.
Even the ethanol is being made the stupid way so big business establishment can profit. ADM makes most of the ethanol in the states from corn. In Brazil (the nation to most successfully use ethanol as a fuel) they make it from sugar cane. You get three times the ethanol from an acre of sugar cane than you do from an acre of corn. ------------- Work to live, not live to work. |
Posted By: Kristof
Date Posted: April-22-2008 at 5:41am
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Tim D,
I saw that film too... When I read about 9/11 and watch several documentaries (pro and contra), they always makes me think back about one of my all time favorite movies: JFK... The mist is so big in each camp, that us normal Jacks will never know the truth about how it really happenend (Divide and conquer... That darn Julius Cesar, he started this whole mess  ).
Like in the film JFK, there are many things so called proven by the ofiicial investigators that just don't add up to me. One thing I know is that 9/11 revived the multi billion dollar business that is the weapons industry (and not only in the US). And that we gave up a lot of our freedom and privacy without even fully realizing it... But, back to alternative fuels...
Kristof ------------- - Gun control means: using BOTH hands! - Money doesn't make one happy, but when it rains cats and dogs, it's still better to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle... |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-22-2008 at 12:28pm
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Tim, now you really got me thinking ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: 88skisupreme
Date Posted: May-12-2008 at 7:57pm
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There are a lot of problems in the US that are chatching up with us now.
Weak dollar, the fed keeps printing money and it takes more dollars to buy oil which is sold internationally. Refining Capacity, in North America a major oil refinery hasnt been built in NA for 30 years. Demand, we aren't seeing peak oil yet, we are at the point where supply is MEETING demand. Whith China and India growing the way they are its only gonna get worse. Complete lack of planning for any of this, all they can come up with is mandatory corn etahanol requirements. If they were serious they'd use hemp and switchgrass. |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: May-12-2008 at 8:41pm
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we shouldve been worrying about this *************** 20 years ago, and we wouldnt be in the predicament were in....mark my words its only going to get worse, methanol is not the answer, I look at my cars now as a total expense just like i look at the gas bill at home and at home i dont turn up the heat in the winter to 80 degrees and i dont leave the windows open because you dont want the gas bill to skyrocket, this is the mindset Americans need and needed the mindset 20 years ago. everything we touch, everything we eat in some way has to do with oil and if oil prices go up so do our everyday things we touch go up. most Americans live paycheck to paycheck and with this in the equation what do you think will happen? take a stab at answering this or sitback and wait....it really is going to be a problem if the price keeps rising
------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |