oil pressure sender
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Boat Maintenance
Forum Discription: Discuss maintenance of your Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12671
Printed Date: November-13-2024 at 9:51pm
Topic: oil pressure sender
Posted By: kapla
Subject: oil pressure sender
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 5:25pm
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Is the oil p sender specific for this particular engines ford pcm 351 w with protech ingnition or they are just universal? I replaced my oil sendar wich was dead, with one from an Y block style engine we have down here. It has the same fittins and one wire electrical hook up as the one i replaced, but it will go to max reading when engine is running. Either the sender is not compatible or y still have to figure out my gremlins on the grounding issues on my electrical instalation.
Any ideas on how to check for bad ground on the entire boat installation...  ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Replies:
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 5:27pm
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Its doubtful that PCM used anything special for that sender, even with the Pro-Tec system. More than likely, you just have an incompatible (or automotive) sender installed. The resistance range of the sender has to match the gauge- it sounds like youve got a mismatch. ------------- |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 5:34pm
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what would be the differnce between an automotive sender and a marine one? The one i got is from auto use. how can i check the resistance range of both parts in order to make sure thats the problem and not a foulty gauge or ground issue.... ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 5:38pm
I would disagree Tim on a computer controled motor the ECM looks for a signal from the oil pressure switch, sometimes there are two other times just one, but if the ECU doesn't see oil pressure it shuts down the fuel and kills the motor. Now I'm not sure on PCM's set up if this is the case or not it is on a GM car. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
TRBenj wrote:Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 5:45pm
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Chris, Im pretty sure that there is a seperate switch (to the ECU) and sender (to the gauge) on the Pro-Tec set up. If he's got a regular automotive sender in there (1-wire hook up) and the Pro-Tec isnt putting the engine into limp mode, then they'd have to be seperate.
Sebastian, Im 99% certain that the automotive and marine senders are different. Do a search on here. Probably no need to verify- just get yourself the correct sender. ------------- |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 5:55pm
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agreed Tim sounds like an auto unit to me, which operates at a different resistance, been over this several times on the forum.
Get a marine unit and all is good ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: jimsport93
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 6:11pm
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Sebastin,
The Pro Tec system uses a unigue oil sender. Try Discount Inboard Marine. Search under the Pro Tec section to find the correct sender. Jimsport93 ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2798 - 93 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 6:25pm
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Jim, are you sure? I know the ProTec uses a unique oil pressure switch... but I think the sender is the standard marine unit. There is no sender listed in the http://skidim.com/products.asp?dept=1126 - ProTec section at SkiDIM. I dont think the switch and sender are the same thing. ------------- |
Posted By: jimsport93
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 6:42pm
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Tim,
I did jump the gun. You are correct. The Protec pressure switch is different from the oil pressure sender. I spoke with Vince at Discount Inboard Marine. He did say that the marine oil sender has different ohm resistance vs the automotive type. Hope this helps. Jimsport93 ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2798 - 93 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: Waterdog
Date Posted: January-13-2009 at 9:11pm
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Sounds like you got a sender for a idiot light ( on / off) you need a sender for a psi gauge. the resistance range from model to model isn't that big of a differance. ------------- - waterdog - http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=3896&sort=&pagenum=2&yrstart=1978&yrend=1978" rel="nofollow - 78 Ski Tique |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: January-14-2009 at 12:57pm
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Well, yesterday while testing the boat i checked the oil pressure thing, guage works fine as when i disconect the cable it will go to zero and if i hit the engine block it will go to max. So bad sender. My logic says I need part 1236 from skidim.
Pd how do i post a link to another page? Stupid question for a senior member ahh ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: January-14-2009 at 1:28pm
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1236 would be the right part. Id be surprised if you couldnt find it locally, though.
To link to another page, use the  button.------------- |
Posted By: Luchog
Date Posted: January-14-2009 at 1:37pm
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Tr, marine parts for American V8 engines are really hard to come by here, I ordered my pressure sending unit from skidim too.
Kapla, Barrera or Folino might have the part, It's the same sending unit for Ford and GM's so you could try a Mercruiser one. Anyway, Skidim is great to deal with, see if there's something else you need to make shipment cheaper. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2095" rel="nofollow - 1980 Ski Nautique Commander 351W |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: January-14-2009 at 1:59pm
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Lucho I just ordered on skidim using the ccfan discount it will go for u$s27 + u$s10 shipping total u$s37 (as is less than 50 sure no customs fees will apply).
I asked Barrera and asked me u$s77 for it!!! 
Skidim=good service!!! ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: February-20-2009 at 1:32pm
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update
yesterday I went to pick up the parcel at the post office customs. After paying 6 dollar tax i have the new OPS from skidim, so total cost was $43 against 80 that I was asked at a local parts here, I think the 1 month wait was worth. I will install it this WE and let you know how it turned out!!! 
Lucho whats that c#%& you`re selling on ML.... very expensive on my opinion.... ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: February-21-2009 at 7:37pm
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update
well I connected the new oil sender but the gauge still peg out... same as the other sender.. is there a proper installtion, or just screw the new one in hook the cable and thats it? i,m king of lost here ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: Fl Inboards
Date Posted: February-21-2009 at 9:20pm
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Ill take a Shot.
If memory serves me their were two units on the oil pressure line that had what some call sending units. One is a sending unit for the oil pressure gauge the other is a oil pressure switch/sensor for protec system the warning light and will cause the motor to go into "limp mode" if it fails. Some times these units get confusing. Their should be a green wire that goes to the pressure switch/sensor. The blue goes to the pressure sending unit. The problem that I run into when talking to people with either sending unit problems or switch is that they can not identify what is what. I will use the term normally, normally the sending unit protrudes directly away from the block it is also "normally" a larger looking component. The switch is off set on the line in a T fashion and is "normally" smaller in size than that of the sending unit. You might want to make sure that these wires are going to the right units. If you need a wiring diagram for that system I can copy and send you one. Hopefully this helps in chasing down your problem. Jody ------------- Hobby Boats can be expensive when the hobbyist is limited on their own skill and expertise. 1993 Shamrock "fat" 20. 2008 Nautique 196 5.0 |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: February-22-2009 at 11:51am
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my problem is with oil pressure that hooks up to the gauge... My boat doesn't have the warning ligth on the dash pod. If I recall it has a light blue wire connected to it.
------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-22-2009 at 12:52pm
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Seb,
The sender is a variable resistor that changes the voltage to the gauge as oil pressure varies and the gauge is a volt meter only marked in PSI. Check the voltage you are getting to the "S" terminal on the gauge. You can also remove the wire from the "S" terminal (it goes to the sender) and check for resistance. It almost sounds like this wire is shorted to ground someplace. If you get close to 0 Ohms, then it's shorted. If not, then it's the gauge. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: February-22-2009 at 1:29pm
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that was my first thought, when you ground a gauge wire or if the sender goes to ground it will peg the gauge. ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: February-23-2009 at 4:06pm
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didnīt get the chance to do that.. but that was also the idea of my mechanic friend, to check resistance at the wire...
Maybe that was the problem and not the sender....
The gauge pegs out in the moment you hook the wire to the sender with the key on contact position, w/o the engine runing.. so I guess the ground issue is a possible culprit. ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-23-2009 at 6:07pm
As soon as you connect the wire to the sender? It shouldn't peg the gauge unless you do have the wrong sender. Without the engine running (0 oil pressure) ohm out the sender to ground. You should get resistance. If close to 0 ohms, then ether the new sender is bad or you do have the wrong one. Most senders will have 240 ohms at 0 psi and 33.5 at max psi. You can even go to the electronics supply and get some 1/4 watt resistors within this range and put them in place of the sender to check your gauge. Edit: If you use a 100ohm resistor and the gauge is ok, then it should read about half of it's psi range. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: February-24-2009 at 2:16pm
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About the sender is the one from skidim for that engine..so it should be ok. Faulty? are this things delicate? can get damaged by movenment during transportation? or is something solid? how can I check if the sender is bad?
Iīm stuck here... ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-24-2009 at 2:48pm
Zero oil pressure (engine not running) check for the 240 ohms. Engine running you should have about 1/2 the oil pressure the gauge reads or about 100 ohms. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: February-24-2009 at 4:40pm
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I will have a tester for checking resistance... and let you know if any new...
sebastian ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-24-2009 at 7:09pm
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Seb,
You did get this correct? sender: 
And not this one. switch:  ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-02-2009 at 1:50pm
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Yes Pete the first is the one I have...
Well did some testing. Reading w/o cable attached with the engine of was 240 ohms at the sender... So we took the gauge, and connected with a piece of cable directly to the sender to check if the old cable was the culprit. Same thing, so the problem is the gauge. Needs to be recalibrated.... I took it to a guy that fixes them and will have a quote... I think that moisture or water may have affected the gauge.... I will let you know what turns out!!! Thanks Sebastian ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-02-2009 at 2:51pm
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Seb,
Well at least you now know it's the gauge! I'm glad to hear you have someone down there that can work on them. The typical gauge has two coils in them creating the magnetic push-pull on the needle. Sounds like one of them is "open" meaning a break in the coil winding so with no current going though it, it won't create the proper magnetic field which pins the needle. Don't forget to come back with the results. We'd like to hear about it. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-02-2009 at 2:54pm
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Pete
yes I took it to a guy that do automotive gauges, but he will take it to a guy that do marine gauges... they donīt mess with other fields!!! Will have a quote....hope its fixeable... ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-05-2009 at 4:23pm
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Well I just talked to this guy and he canīt fix it.. apparently one of the coils is burned out....
i will pick it up and try luck at a marine parts store.....
But at least i know i can get one new from egauges... Tim did you contact this guys for the hour meter? is it real or is it just smoke? ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: March-05-2009 at 4:48pm
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Sebastian, the ones you linked to before are VDO Ocean Line gauges. The faces are very similar to our originals, but the bezel and plastic face covering are very different. You could either try to disassemble it and put on your old bezel/face or go with a different gauge that has a slightly different face but the same bezel as the originals. The only catch is that I *believe* this is an automotive gauge, so you may need to swap the sender. Egauges sells both:
Ocean Line (3501153): 
Cockpit White (350-240):  ------------- |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-05-2009 at 5:00pm
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The second one is the ones we have on our boats is that right?
they are not at egauges? i think they have them on both 240ohms-33 (is our case) and the automotive ones... but I migth be worng... anyway I still have the harware from the old gauge so it can be switch... ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-05-2009 at 5:07pm
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yeap that cockpit one is automotive...the OL is at our ohms range...
------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: March-05-2009 at 5:16pm
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Summit had a better picture, but egauges sells both. Neither have the exact same face as the original, but the OL is closer (oil can symbol). The Cockpit White has the same bezel as original at least and would not require modification. ------------- |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-05-2009 at 5:33pm
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but new sender is required though
I think I have a supplier here in argentina who carries them.. check this out note price is in argentine pesos the rate is $1 us = $3.65 pesos argentinos I`m gonna check out if they fit my requirement and if they carry them in white face... http://www.costanerauno.com.ar/add_prod.asp?prod=11419&cat= - vdo ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: March-05-2009 at 5:43pm
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I would still lean towards the automotive gauge- Im not exactly sure how easily the VDO's can be disassembled. The bezel and face will look pretty out of place if you dont swap them! I would imagine that the automotive sender would be pretty cheap and locally available. ------------- |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-06-2009 at 2:01pm
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I stopped by at this supplier to see the gauges.. no vdo but they had this uflex gauges.. but it was in bars.. the max would be 5 bars= 72.5 psi... it works with the 240-33 ohms but it supossed to match up with a 5kg (71psi) sender..
Can it work? or the pcm sender works in a higher psi ranger? ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: March-06-2009 at 2:12pm
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As long as the gauge and sender are matched (it sounds like they are) then they should work fine together. ------------- |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-06-2009 at 2:19pm
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What are your engine pressure readings at idle, cruising and wot?
------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-11-2009 at 2:49pm
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I went yesterday to pickup the unfixed gauge from this guy who was supposed to fix it...
I think he didnīt even took the job of openning the damn gauge!!! So I dissasemble it as my idea was to use the face and needle in a new gauge i was going to buy. But I think I found the problem, one of the coil wires was loose marked with the red arrow 
So I welded it again... hope fix the thing.... Let you know the result when I set the bilge plug back in the boat... ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: March-11-2009 at 4:01pm
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Sebastian, how hard was it to remove the bezel? Did the face come off just by removing the 2 small screws? Did the needle come off too or did you have to sneak the face past it somehow? ------------- |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-11-2009 at 4:26pm
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Tim
the hardest part is removing the black metal ring of the face. you have to do it carefully with a little flat hear screwdriver, try not to hurt the plastic bezel. when that off the iner white ring and glass are out. Then to remove the needle just pull it carefully until it pops off. the face its easy just unscrew the 2 screws that attaches it to the assy. Then if you want to remove the mechanism out of the bezel, the Signal and positve terminals are kind of heat welded to the platic bezel so try moving them with a plier to release them. The ground just unbolt the little nut and you are set!!! ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-11-2009 at 4:30pm
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Ah to remove the black ring you have to work it from the back of the bezel as it has a lip. I hope you got it!!!!
------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-11-2009 at 4:46pm
Seb, Now you can go into the gauge repair business!! Hopefully it's as simple as this broken wire to the one coil. Since you've got some experience now ohming out the sender, get out the meter again and see if you can get some readings off the two coils in the gauge. I don't know what resistence you should get but at least you can check for continuity on your soldering job. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: March-11-2009 at 5:25pm
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Sounds relatively simple Seb- thanks for the description! Ive got some bezels and faces to swap around and Ill probably have to order that $$$ hour meter, but I should have just about everything I need to reassemble a new dashboard. I dont even want to think about how much it will have cost me in the end! ------------- |
Posted By: 79nautique
Date Posted: March-11-2009 at 5:45pm
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I would suspect that the wire got broke when the post was turned to free it up, 30-45 gauge wire breaks extremely easy but maybe you got luck.
Before you put it all back together get the ohm readings and make sure it's not shorted to the pole pieces as well if you get any continuity at all it's shorted. Basicly you want to measure across both ends of the wire for each coil, aka start and finish of the coil winding which you should have two seperate curcuits. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=756&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1979&yrend=1979 - 79 nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: March-11-2009 at 6:18pm
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Seb,
Don't forget that you still have the option to bench test before you go the trouble of putting it back in the boat. When trying to figure out your sender problem, I mentioned that you can run to the electronics supply and get a couple of 100 ohm resistors. Using a 12V power supply (a battery charger is fine) and the resistors in series with the gauge will indicate if your repair worked. No resistor will peg the needle. 1 resistor will give you about half scale reading and both resistors in series will give you a near zero gauge reading. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: March-15-2009 at 12:04am
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Update
so installed it, and test drive it... it worked ok... at first it was a little stiff mabe case it was out of service such a long time but then it started to move more evenly.. readind are 40 psi at idle and then around 60-70 while cruising depending throtle now i have all my gauges working nicely...I need to replace the ligth bulbs from two of the gauges, do you know which kind to buy?
also to figure out the ground problem as when i turn on the navigation ligths some of the gauges start reading more than they should... ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |
Posted By: Sephmu
Date Posted: January-12-2010 at 11:12pm
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Just bought a 97 Sport with a "well used" GT-40, oil gauge is pegged....this site is amazing! I wouldn't have even known where to start. Thanks to everyone for such informative posts! I don't even have to ask questions here, just a quick search and I'm at least pointed in the right direction. Thanx again!
-Young Rookie |
Posted By: kapla
Date Posted: January-15-2010 at 11:21am
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keep us updated with the outcome of your gauge...
mine is now working fine... ------------- <a href="">1992 ski nautique |