Inspiring confidence?
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URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=14590
Printed Date: January-07-2025 at 4:40pm
Topic: Inspiring confidence?
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Subject: Inspiring confidence?
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 12:04am
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What do you guys and gals think when you hear phrases like..."I'm not going to lie to you" or "to be honest"? ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Replies:
Posted By: p/allen
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 12:07am
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They could very easily be lieing to you .
They may not lie to you but they will the next guy . Are you the next guy ? ------------- Pat http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w146/72ccfan/100_5977-1.jpg - My 72 Skier Rock River Dixon,ILL. |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 12:09am
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I think we all are.
Great to meet you sir! ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 10:11am
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8 years of the little boy who cried wolf will do that to you..... ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 10:20am
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C'mon Eric...and that wolf ate a couple of buildings among other things. ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 10:23am
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he didnt mention anything that pissed me off, he is attacking healthcare full steam ahead, with no regulations things tend to get out of hand as proven in the housing crises, no one watches, everyone gets rich.. Healthcare to me is an issue that everyone in this country should be entitled too, especially the elderly,they shouldnt have to dump thier 401's to pay for care. Doctors do pick and choose according to insurance coverage, I dont think its a right, i think it is an entitlement for paying taxes all your life, i at one time payed 18 bucks a week for full coverage and the employer picked up the rest. now i pay out of pocket for bare minimum coverage and the bills roll in..we dont cover this we dont cover that. it turned into a big expense taking money from the monthly budget. with re-form it would be like getting a raise, all the way around for everyone, it should be equal accross the board, this is something you cant control but you can control your own destiny on becoming whoever you want in this country ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 10:30am
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It was great to meet you Eric!
We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 10:37am
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nice meeting you and Amy too, i have no idea what happened to your coozies or the CCF ones i purchased. im just glad i made it out alive.
i didnt tell Randy but he probably is woondering where his shirt is. Come on Greg, we are stuck with him for 4 possibly 8, if the pubs keep acting like little girls ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 10:40am
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I'll have to give you that one. The pubs don't seem to have much going for them right now. ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 10:44am
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How about a Public Physician, Like Public defenders. If you need a doctor or medical care and you have insurance you cango to whwt ever doctor your inurance will pay for. If you have no insurance or other means to pay you are apponinted a Public Physician. A qualified doctor willing to work and be paid by the government. This would be cheaper then any of the plans they have suggested currently. 100% of the population would be covered. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 11:41am
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i always use examples, helthcare in this country is ran as a profitable business. you guys know i own a bodyshop/marine repair, the bodyshop is regulated by the insurance companies the marine business is not. on the auto side they tell us our hourly rate and what they will pay....me as the owner hates that because it is not very profitable but it keeps us inline. on the marine side and you guys know I highly condone good insurance on boats and the reason is its not regulated, the auto side gets 38.50 per hour and everything you do has a time and thats how you get paid. on the marine side the rate shoots up to 85.00 per hour and no time. lets say you hit your prop and it bends the prop, without regulations the engine automatically comes out, damper replaced, new shaft, new prop, rebuild transmission. if it was regulated the bill would have been maybe 1000.00 bucks, with it unregulated the bill all of a sudden is 5000 bucks.....
thats why healthcare needs regulation...btw this was an example lol ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: azeus17
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 11:52am
I HATE the whole entitlement mindset. In my opinion, that is one of the biggest problems in America. To many people think they are entitled to have everything. My wife works at a hospital in the registration and billing area. You would not believe how many people walk in there and claim they are poor and can not afford healthcare, blah, blah, blah, hospital can not turn them away and then go out and drive away in their new Caddy  . Some people are legitimatly uncapable of paying, but the thing is, those are the ones that already qualify for Medicare.
Just my opinion here, but I do not think you are entitled to healthcare, have a new car, a free government cell phone, cable tv, or anything else, except national security. That is what our taxes were supposed to be used for. It is time for people to take some responsibility for your own life and quit bitching about what is fair or not fair. I don't care if you are 100 or 20, plan your life accordingly. If BO wants to make healthcare more affordable to individuals, why doesn't he just open up the markets and allow you shop for healthcare nationwide? Make them be a little more competitive. Allow individuals to form groups or pools to get discounts. Tort reform. These are easy, free ways to lower healthcare costs. ------------- Boats: Current: 02 SANTE Sold: 89 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 12:34pm
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Azues, we are way past discounts, it needs regulation, we are paying for the uninsured no matter how you spin it, at times the uninsured poor get better care than the middleclass insured are recieving because its on someone elses tab.
I'll ask you this, if you were BO what would you do? its easy to be part of a problem and point fingers, its not about that, the system has failed creating 46 million uninsured, 14000 more everyday, its turned into a me, me, me society and thats not what its about. healthcare is a necessity not a pleasure such as a boat or car, national security is a necessity...and it has to be viewed that way, its not wheteher its fair or not, its your neihbors...were not talking free healthcare to the world but to our families. thats one area that the economy hasnt affected, healthcare, government jobs, state jobs, so you probably have a nice steady income and you havnt been put into the position of no healthcare.....46 million have, for the people by the people ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 1:07pm
It means they were previously lying to you. ------------- |
BuffaloBFN wrote:Posted By: Randy_in_Ohio
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 1:08pm
Which shirt am I missing??? I hope you didn't take the one that I accidentally dropped in the toilet! I seen the black coozie on the table not sure where it is now. i'll look around for it ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1602&yrstart=1991&yrend=1995" rel="nofollow - 1993 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: Randy_in_Ohio
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 1:10pm
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I have to agree with Eric on the health care issue. something has to be done, it has gotten out of control. too many people getting too rich off of others misfortunes. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1602&yrstart=1991&yrend=1995" rel="nofollow - 1993 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 1:14pm
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green long sleeve one, i look good wearing it lol come to think of it, it was wet and i mixed it in with everything.
those bastards (doctors) at the Cleveland clinic are trained to keep your office visits to 12 minutes, thats not even enough time for a reach around, and a probing ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 1:23pm
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Eric, do you remember what the coozie said?
Don't stress over it Randy and great to meet you. I'm just giving Eric a ration. ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 1:31pm
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If Obamas healthare plan is good enough for the citizens why won't any of Congress be willing to sign on?
The Government in this country has gotten too strong,stacking the deck for themselves and only interested in winning the next election. In order to change anything we must change the players. If your term is up your out. It would be great if we could get a new Congress and Senate with mandanatory retirement(65) like factory workers, No pension (let them pay into social security like everyone else)buy their own insurance, taxes etc. We would get a better class of canidates. Folks that are in tune with the real world. if money actually came from their pockets they would be alittle more responsible with ours. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: Randy_in_Ohio
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 2:00pm
I didn't have a green long sleeve shirt, it must have been Mike's. It wasn't my gray button down shirt was it? That is one of my favorites... ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1602&yrstart=1991&yrend=1995" rel="nofollow - 1993 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: Randy_in_Ohio
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 2:07pm
Great meeting you also Greg, I wish we would have had more time to talk. next year. I think the coozie in question was black and said something about a pig ass. not sure, I was foggy that morning... ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1602&yrstart=1991&yrend=1995" rel="nofollow - 1993 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 4:08pm
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was...
a family friend recently was diagnosed with esophogas cancer and his wife befriended a Saudi Arabian woman in the waiting area, i guess they got pretty tight and the womans husband was renting the entire floor at the clinic. these people we know are a little down on thier luck and at home here in Lodi Ohio a limo pulled up to her house and the driver handed her an envelope, it had 5k in it, she tried not to accept it but it was dis-respectful if she didnt. true story, he was a prince btw ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: The Lake
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 5:13pm
Friends offer hope . . . sometimes it's money, cool story. It was good to meet you Eric. Chuck ------------- Walk on Water www.coldwater.me http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=775&sort=&pagenum=3&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970 - 69 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 5:24pm
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I've got a friend coming to Maine tomorrow. He's a 58 yo doctor and an anybody but Bush guy. I can hardly wait to ask him how he likes being a "basic human rights" provider. I hear he's not nearly as excited about change as he was last year at this time. ------------- |
Posted By: behindpropeller
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 5:33pm
Can't agree with you more. Eric is going to be disappointed if BO passes his plans. What if the government supplied ski boats? Do you think they would get better every year because of competition? Think about it. ------------- |
Posted By: Luchog
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 7:18pm
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what's the deal with those coozies? ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2095" rel="nofollow - 1980 Ski Nautique Commander 351W |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 7:41pm
We'd end up with competition pontoons.  ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 8:07pm
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Tim, i rather be dis-appointed than be as disgusted as i am with todays healthcare, its pitiful.
there is no other way to fix the system other than the government stepping in, its in the private sectors hands and has been turned into a profitable greedy business..i dont like the government running things but it is necessary. its about compassion for other human beings, havnt you noticed a drug store at every corner? im not preaching re-form but there has to be a better way than what is current, we have to try something even if its not popular, i dont know if it will work, you dont know if it will work, but at least the attempt is there and a problem is recognized ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 8:10pm
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were talking 46 million without and rising, there are people that really need healthcare and do not have access to it, thats what bothers me..... ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 8:13pm
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Eric, you know gov't regs had a lot to do with the housing and insuance issues we have now.
And that 46 figure can be broken down without a lot of effort. ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: July-23-2009 at 8:39pm
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My concern is that the gorvernment already is in the health care business with medicare which will go broke in 2019. It is financed by taking down payments from customers who are not yet eligable and paying it out to those who are . In private buisness (which is regulated) this is called a ponzi scheme and is illegal. I do not want to hand over 17% of our national economy to be screwed up in this maner. In this country we have rights, based on inherant god given rights from birth. They do not give us the right TO anything just the right to be free of having things taken from us by force. It is up to us to pursue our rights. We have the right to PURSUE life liberty and happiness and not have them taken from us once we achieve them. There is no guareenty of health care in our constitution. I love my health care. Do not %$#* with it. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: critter
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 12:45am
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Everyone in this Country, legal or not, has access to health care. You can walk into any Hospital and get medical health care.
Just ask the Illegals, they can point you to free health care providers. Do not expect all health care to be equal. We are all equal at two times in our lives.. when born and when we die. Other than those two times, we are all different. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique 1966 Barracuda |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 10:14am
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I think when you say everyone have access to HC you are correct, lets say a bean picker breaks his arm, he goes to the ER, they x-ray it, its broke, no insurance...they set his arm put a cast on it and send him on his way...on the other hand Joe the plumber walks in with the same break, Aetna insurance no deductibles, the Doc orders a MRI, 40 x-rays, sets him up in a room overnight, in the morning the surgeon walks in, advises him we need to do surgury and were going to have to put pins in the arm, after a month or so we'll pull the pins and you will need therapy......Oh yeah here is a script for some percs for the pain.
thats what re-form is about quit thinking Blue or Red, everyone has access to coverage but it is biased coverage and maybe thats what is not understood here ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 10:19am
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the ethics are long gone, I do realize whats going on in the industry and believe it or not everything you purchase in this country has a percentage tacked on it for healthcare, the price of things will creep down if you get ahold of the skyrocketing costs. its not this or that, the biggest cost for companies besides employess is healthcare. i believe it is around 26% of a AMERICAN cars costs and its passed onto the consumer.....look at it as a raise in your income ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 11:18am
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When the government dictates the pay to doctors there will be less doctors. Every year their insurance, offices and training costs go up and the reinbursment rate doesen't. Eventually they retire early, and the incentive for people that have to spend $300,000 to become doctors will diminish. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: azeus17
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 11:19am
I am really OK with this. Like others and I have said, no where is it written that you are garanteed health care, nor should it be. The bean picker is probably illegal anyway, so i don't think he should get anything but a free ride south
Eric- I know you and I will never agree on this, and that is OK, but I do not believe that giving everybody something for "free" will make this a better country to live in. Oh, and yes, I do have very good health care. Am I supposed to appologize for that? I, sir, am not like BO and will not go around appologizing for my accomplishments. Also, I did offer a few solutions. Tort reform (make it harder, or illegal for people to sue a doctor when they were trying to help them), open up, yes DEREGULATE, the health care market and make them be more competitive with companies in other states, and allow individuals to form groups to get discounts (just like a company, think how much cheaper you could probably get insurance if you are 35, non smoker, non drinker, and have 500 other just like you in your group). These are just my pea brain solutions and I am a no body. You can not tell me that the "smartest" people can not come up with something better than what they have so far. What it boils down to is that this is just a good old fashoned power grab. They know once they have you on their health plan, let alone wellfare, food stamps, etc...we will never be able to elect anyone else. For the people by the people my ass...if that was the case, congress would not have writen that they are exempt from the plan! ------------- Boats: Current: 02 SANTE Sold: 89 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: azeus17
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 11:24am
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Oh yeah, HC is a business. A business that saves lives, but none the less a business. What is wrong with them making money. Really rediculous comparison coming, but how would you feel if BO decided that everyone was entitled to a boat and FFM could only charge 10/hr to fix the boats? Probably would not be worth it, would it? ------------- Boats: Current: 02 SANTE Sold: 89 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: behindpropeller
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 11:33am
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I don't think health care is that expensive.
It all boils down to other prices going down on stuff. Look at all of the cheap crap at wal-mart. Maybe we should sub-contract all doctors from China....?? We want cheap everything but gold standard health care. ------------- |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 11:35am
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First of all, the Average American wont pick beans because it is below them, if they did we would have to pay them 20.00 per hour.
believe it or not everyone is entitled to coverage, walk into a hospital with no coverage and you will be treated, pretty black and white and i think you fail to see that. I suppose you also have a problem with the Draft also? is that entitlement? BO is putting the politics aside, he has nothing to benefit, this world works on "how am I going to benefit?" I would bet my life if he said in this bill with reform it will be law because of the savings you will automatically get 3.00 dollars more an hour in your paycheck, every mudslinger would be fighting to be first in line. it works in other countries, thats why Foriegn cars are cheaper than US made, it may not be a perfect bill but its a step in the right direction, everyone always throws in a spin because it doesnt benefit them and will try and find the downfalls. how is it the Pharmacutical companies have 80 billion lying around for the cause? ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: Luchog
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 2:55pm
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it's somekind of funny when some quote the constitution as a holly book, you have to consider it was written like 200 years ago... pretty different world and expectations then dont you think? ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2095" rel="nofollow - 1980 Ski Nautique Commander 351W |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 3:04pm
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if you read earlier, the insurance companies do regulate part of our business, and thats why the premiums are lower, they dont regulate the marine industry and thats why its a field day but there is not enough volume to regulate it.... ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 5:19pm
Actually many live by and quote another Holy book that was written much much before the Constituion but the values and messages still applies today. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: Luchog
Date Posted: July-24-2009 at 10:04pm
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Harddock, you know they are not the same kind of book, and they were not written by the same guy. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2095" rel="nofollow - 1980 Ski Nautique Commander 351W |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 10:49am
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reform needs to start at the education of Doctors, grants, and incentives for them to pursue what they have a passion for, private practice is almost non existant because of mal-practice suits, big business turned the INDUSTRY into a monopoly and this weeded out your long time phycisian that knew your charts and had the personal touch with you. it forced them to sign on with the big guys and limit your office visits to 12 minutes...and that leads to mis-diagnosis and many uneeded tests. the costs ballooned and its passed onto me and you somehow.
a couple of union boys were on my deck last night throwing a few back (J-Bear communication guys) they were negotiating a new contract and the biggest issue was healthcare and how it was hitting the chopping block...The point is the negotiations were about taking away not giving, it should be the other way around, 3000.00 deductibles WTF? its not very hard to understand what re-form is about when you put the politics aside ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 10:57am
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Free tickets!
Dems vs. Blue Dogs Gotta luv it. ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 11:49am
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Greg, if it was a good system we wouldnt be talking about it ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 1:07pm
The bible and constitution share characteristics that I admire. In my mind I believe they both were devinely inspired. Both are based on principles that do not change over time. Society has let go of a lot of standards but that does not mean the old standards are wrong. It might mean that we have lost site of what really matters. Water pouring over a dam slowly erodes it. Does that mean it really should be lower? or should it be re-inforced and built back up because when it was new it was good and right. Both of these documents are timeless. we just need to find a way to apply them in modern times. Keeping principles in todays circumstances can be very difficult and make a person unpopular. Most bend to assume societal norms. Myself I aspire to meet the higher standard. Admittedly i fail often, but that does not mean I will stop trying.In this respect I say keep it original. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 5:40pm
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I have to weigh in here. I have been in healthcare for over 25 years. I am currrently in a graduate program to get my Advance Nurse Practitioner degree.
I have added a link to the current bill. Eric I suggest you read this bill before you really make your mind up. It is scarey. Be very very careful for what you wish for. This has nothing to do with reforming healthcare because there are many ways to do that without it costing all of us in excess of 1.5 Trillion dollars. This is about control, period. I have just begun reading it and do not like what I see. My 2 cents worth. http://waysandmeans.house.gov/media/pdf/111/AAHCA09001xml.pdf This is the actual bill. Don't Tread on Me ------------- Chris |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 6:04pm
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im standing outside looking in, my wife has Migraines and its been 2 years of Bullsht, now shes talked into the Chiropractor twice a week for her neck causing the headaches, 60 bucks a crack out of pocket and i shake my head. this is after 3 cat scans, the very best 3 day treatment at the clinic, is that why its called practice? it is, if i practiced what i did i wouldnt be in business very long.
im not saying the Bill is the answer, i really think when something is way out of control, not a little, its time someone steps in and gets ahold of the situation and starts to put caps on things and creates incentives to heal the problem and not prolong it and soak the patient. If you can convince me in a post that there is not a problem with the system i will glady read every word you have to say and reason with you. but for now there is a problem in your profession and it needs to be fixed.....thats why the government wants to step in. right now i have absolutely no control of the bills that keep rolling in for practiced medicine ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 8:05pm
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Eric, few would argue that there are not problems with the system, but this fix will make the problem worse. My wife has very similar problems to yours, we spent thousands out of pocket(one or two tranny repairs)at the chiropractor last year. The new plan would likely not cover any of these services either and also not approve many of the newest drugs available, and then at a certain age it might stop treatments entirely. There is a reason congress exempted themselves fron this coverage before it was ever written. The Congressional budget office now states that the current bill will increase the cost of heath care, and we know it will ration and decrease the level of care. To pay for it many new taxes are planned, including cigarette taxes that unfaitly hit the poor,the wealthiest Americans will be subjected to an additional 5 percent in taxes, these are the people who create jobs in this country, say goodbye to job growth and possibly them. These new taxes will not even pay for half of the cost of this program. The rest will be deficit spending. Democrats complained of deficit spending under W that reached the mid 30% range of GDP. Six months of Obama has them in the 40% range and by 2012 they will reach over 80% of GDP. This will screw us all. This is the wrong plan at the wrong time. How about implementing torte reform which will imkmediatly cut costs, and then stop government interference in what has to be covered, If we were not paying for cosmetic surgery and viagra we might be OK, certainly better than where we are and far better than where we are headed.The currnt plan is like getting rid of a cold but the side effect is you get cancer. I would rather have the cold.The previous post was right . this is about power and control, not improving heathcare. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 8:24pm
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Please do not take offence at my opinion. My wife has be disabled due to severe gastrointestinal problems for the last 25 years (over 7 major surgeies just on her stomach). There has never been a time that I was not paying outstanding medical bills and having to pay them off by making payments each month and I would much rather pay those bills each month than to have a government run healthcare.
I would disagree with you that my profession is the problem. The problem is multi-leveled including irresposnible people. If we as Amercians want to continue to get top quality health care and not have government control what we get and and when and not have everyone's children pay for it then I suggest you not support this bill and let your representative know that. This bill will only create more problems with the system. (Have you ever had to deal with medicare, I have, a lot) it is no fun. By the way medicare is already 63 trillion in the hole. Most people my age, middle aged, will not get medicare benifits. All you have to do is look at Hawaii, they tried this same type of system for 7 months and had to shut it down becuase it was about to make the state go bankrupt. Also look at Mass. they are having the same problem. The cost for that states system is already 3 times what they expected it was going to cost. The bottom line is anything our career politicians get their hands on they screw it up and this will be no exception. I am not trying to make you not support this bill. I think we all need to be informed. I would bet if you read 100 pages of this bill it will be more than most of our so called represenatives have read. Is that really the way you want bills passed? Great discussion. By the way I just got my first CC yesterday. I will be posting it in the diary section soon. It is a 1970 Barracuda. Can not wait to hit the water. This is a great forum. Safe Boating ------------- Chris |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 9:12pm
|
A doctor called these numbers in to a show I listen to. Wonder how solid they are.
33% of physicians won't take new Medicare-caid patients 40% of those who do restict the procedures they will perform on a medicare-caid patient Both of the above, not because the gov't won't pay, but because of the paperwork and beaurocratic hoops they must jump through...aka 'hassle' factor 2/3rds of doctors today would rather treat medicare-caid patients for free; again for the same hassle factor reason...but of course that is illegal And the AMA controls the code system that must be used? ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: July-25-2009 at 10:36pm
|
Chris, Good job jumping into these forums with both feet, congrats on the 1970 Barracuda, enjoy it while the V-8 is still legal. Of course if they extend the clunker rebate to boats you might make a profit. You have an nice boat there and a nice resource here. welcome. Dave. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-26-2009 at 10:53am
|
Im getting beat up here, lets concentrate on the current system, instead of microscoping the new bill lets microscope the current sysytem and try to pick out some faults. i keep hearing it wont work, it wont work but none of you guys at the pulpit are standing shouting...this isnt working, this isnt working,
Greg, because of ethics the phycisian shouldnt be picking and choosing who he will treat that day, the phycisian should be exposed to that persons charts and not to thier wallets...thier first thoughts should be can i cure this guy? not can this guy pay...thats what this current system has done...can you guy's maybe see a problem here and stop for one minute and say yes there is a problem and something needs to be done. its being divided once again to where the rich will get the best care because they wear silk underwear. I guess my point is I feel when it comes to healthcare everyone should be treated as equals. no were not entitled to it, thats a strong word that seems to get taken out of context. but when you bragg that we have the best healthcare in the world, the ones bragging are usually that ones that have it ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: July-26-2009 at 3:58pm
|
Eric, I do not want to beat you up, I have to much respect for your knowlege and passion,I just feel we are at a tippingpoint in time and we are about to cross a line that we cannot return back over. Medicine is a buisness that should take care of itself through supply and demand. Our government has seen fit to interfear with this processand dictate who must be covered and what they should get covered. They also dictate that medicare patients(the ones they pay for) get the same high level of care at prices around 50 Cents on the dollar. You and I then supplement these costs by paying more for our services. add mandating paying for the newest drugs and treatments to be "Fair", and then outrageous legal liabilities and you create a mess that supply and demand cannot fix. Why not offer inexpensive basic packages for thaose with limited funds, The rich can then buy their premium packages and fund advancements for all of us. Government is directly to blame for at least 50% of the current mess, and that is with a private system . If we hand it over to government they will mess it up 100%,I am ok with improving the system, just not changing it for change sake, and making it worse in the process. Eric what would you think about torte reform. and not paying for elective care like viagra and lasic eye surgery? ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: July-26-2009 at 8:38pm
|
Without naming the source ( which would take this who knows where) someone on TV this week end mentioned that there are 12 million people that legitimitly can't afford health insurance. If this healthecare bill was about providing insurance the government could buy 12 million people a policy for a small fraction of what they propose to spend. It is not really about healthcare. It is a control thing.
you problably had to hear it all in its original context, dut damn the guy started really making sense. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 2:13am
|
Eric, The current system is not what is in play here. By asking us to examine the system you are asking us to fiddle while Rome burns. Our President whishes to ram this disaster through by fall, it is only the voices of reason that have slowed it down from August. We need to focus on stopping this massive government power grab now, and that will give us the opportunity to discuss what is both right and wrong with the current system. It is not right to take by force from you because I do not have it. Not food, not money, not a transmission, and not healthcare. That is stealing, plain and clear.People are good natured and will share their good fortune if given a chance. let them make their fortune and let them share volentarily, and let those that can earn learn the self satisfaction of providing fro them selves under tough circumstancess. I work in construction, own rental property and have an s-corp on the side. I raise three kids one 16 one 4 and one 2. I also go to school in a full time program at the University of Phoenix with no tuition assistance. My wife is a stay at home mom and we would not change that. I work hard and live check to check which sucks for a 47 year old guy but I made life choices that put me here and I am making choices to improve things. Recently work was slow and I was told to apply for unemployment. I said no, I do not believe in it. I passed handyman flyers around the nieghborhood and lined up a weeks worth of work in 24 hours so as not to burden society with my misfortune. I am proud of what I am doing in the face of adversity. Others should be allowed and maybe even forced to find out what they can do. Oh yea, I rebuilt a boat in the middle of this for fun. Now I am supposed to pay more taxes to help thase that are not willing to do what I do. Screw that. That is not what this country was built on, nore should it be built on anything less. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 10:02am
|
bottem line, the wheel is broke and needs to be fixed, maybe this is a wake up call, if the system does fail they always turn to the government and always seems to get a hand out, thats nice knowing you have that cushion..so should they walk away and not be involved at all? including cutting of all funding? ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 10:13am
|
OverMyHead
A-freaking-men The think the American people are beginning to wake up. Our government is absolutely OUT OF CONTROL. If both the Cap and Trade and healthcare reform bills pass we are hosed for a long time. Eric if you have a "broken wheel" to do immediately go out and try to find the most expensive wheel you can find or do you take time to try and get the best deal???? ------------- Chris |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 10:16am
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if someone else is paying.....lol ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 10:18am
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its impossible to get a bigger hosing than we did 4 or 5 months ago, right in front of our eyes ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 10:25am
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I'm glad to see a few more names in this thread; some really good posts as well! People are starting to get over the kool-aid.
O'reilly has a good article on townhall.com this morning. Some of the comments are even better! ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 11:31am
|
Nothing is impossible (in my line of work-emergency medicine-flight nursing-you find out real quick nothing is impossible) and if cap and trade and healthcare pass, in the long run, the stimulus package will be chump change. ------------- Chris |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 11:39am
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what else needs fixed? ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 11:45am
Some spider cracks on my recently purchased 1970 Barracuda. You think I could get some simulus money for that?  ------------- Chris |
Posted By: critter
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 4:14pm
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Can anyone out there help me to understand what exactly the officer did wrong ?
I keep hearing that Mr. Gates and the officer over reacted but the only specifics I hear are that Mr. Gates accused the officer of racism and would not stop badgering the officer. How did the officer over react ? Is it not proper for an officer to arrest someone that is being un-cooperative and challenging them ? ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique 1966 Barracuda |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 4:35pm
|
he didnt pull the trigger and drop a gun..thats bad, they throw this *************** out there to keep your mind occupied, as they slide it in ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 7:36pm
Heathcare = Broken wheel need a new wheel Government = Gets a set of 4 bad ass 22"s & new tires without even checking to see if they will fit, and dosen't want to wait for them to be on sale! ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 8:09pm
I don't know nothing about the rest of this nonsense, but no it is not proper for an officer to arrest someone that is uncooperative and challenging them. That is not against the law, it is infact only illegal to interfear with a lawful arrest or disobey a lawful order. Arrest without cause is against the law, but even worse it disrespects and endangers fellow officers who do thier jobs correctly and accept and deal with the fact that they do not have the right to arrest anyone they have an issue with, it is in fact still America. If you want to get a good look a system that only works for people with money point out to the wrong cop (nothing against the vast marority of good cops) that he is making a mistake. If your poor you get a something resembling a lawyer and you go to jail, if you have enough money to waste on a lawyer just to prove a point you will win your point, if your in the middle and need to feed your family then you have no real access to the court system and it is the cop that decided your fate as soon as your arrested, because you will take whatever deal the DA offers. Luckily I haven't been in the first or last category yet... ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 8:45pm
|
Unless you were there you don't know how this ordeal was escalating. At the time an audience gathering was turning the situation into a public spectical.
There were three cops there and they agreed it was the best way to handle the situation. The fact that this event involved a prominent black Harvard professor got Al Sharpton invloved then the cable news and then the President. Had it been you or me it would have been lucky to make the local Boston news. The charges were dropped and the prof has had his 15 min of fame. It should be put to rest. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: critter
Date Posted: July-27-2009 at 9:35pm
|
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0723092gates1.html
Per the Police report, he was arested for "exhibiting loud and tumultuous behavior, in a public place, directed at a uniformed police officer who was present investigating a report of a crime in progress". Must be some defined Law against this behavior. I see nothing that the officer did wrong in the report or from the other officer present. Just wondering why the charges were dropped and why the officer is being hounded. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique 1966 Barracuda |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 1:02am
|
Make no mistake about it, I have no idea what happened there but I can recite the average disorderly conduct police report for you word for word. Unfortunately a few bad apples have used that charge over and over to the point where it is referred to by many in the system as POPO, or pissing off police officer. The problem is it is still america and pissing off a police officer is constitutionally protected free speach unless it is done with intent to specifically block traffic or incite a riot. Therefore every report you ever read will include references to either blocking traffic or attempting to incite a crowd in a public place. If you have enough money to push it these charges will always eventually be dropped or dismissed because they would never withstand a constitutional challenge, they make it just as far as the courts and DA who have to deal with these cops on a daily basis have reach, and then only as "professional courtesy".
Moral of the story, it is America and you can't be arrested just for being an ***************, unless of course you don't have the time or money to fight it. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: critter
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 1:20am
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Thanks for enlightening me Joe. I feel like I must live a secuded life... I do appreciate the explanation. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique 1966 Barracuda |
Posted By: TX Foilhead
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 2:40am
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Back to the big elephant over there in the corner.
Everyone has access to healthcare in this country with or without insurance, I think everyone has agreed to that. We also have the best healthcare avaliable any where in the world, untfortunately people aren't like cars or boats and you can't always just change out some parts and make them good as new. Health insurance doesn't insure your health, it insures your bank account in the event of a catastrophic health emergency. That is what it was designed to do originally, and I think if thats how it was used these days then things would be cheaper. You cover the regular check ups and office visits with your money, and the insurance takes care of things like when you blow your knee out on a wakeboard. That would make the doctors check their prices because I don't think many people would be willing to pay the prices they charge now if they knew what they were. I think the PA that I usually see is billing about $500 an hour if I calculate out what my insurance company and I pay for a 15 min visit. If you took the lawyers and lawsuits out of the equation, that price could probably be cut in half. Unfortunately this would require people to be responsible and not spend everything they make plus some, and there aren't enough people like that around anymore. The more important issue here is the fact that the people in Washington want to take over more of the private sector. I don't have any official numbers, but with most of the auto industry, the large banks and the healthcare system I would think they would control somewhere between a 1/5 and 1/4 of the economy. Some of them think it would be a great way to grease the campaign wheels come election time, just more lies they can promise to give you if you reelect them. What really worries me are the ones that will use this to control what ever they want. They might decide boating is dangerous and we can't do that because it would raise healthcare costs. The Constitution works just fine, the people in Washington just don't like to abide by it, that's why they should all be sent home. Sorry for the rant, I should have gotten on this one sooner. |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 10:08am
|
Joe, I think the nonsense is whats going on with the black dude, not the healthcare,
Maybe not control, but caps on things, if you legally start putting caps on costs then suit will follow, in know way should a family recieve 50 million for a mistake a doctor makes, maybe it should be calculated at 2 million. I base my opinions from talking to people, 2 good examples are my next door neihbor, his wife has been sick for years and he has to make payments to me for his car I repaired for him, he worked for shell oil all of his life, he exhausted his 401 on hospital bills in the last 8 years taking care of her, I send food over or i will roll her over every time i cook out back because i know they are short on cash. another friend was recently layed off at Timken, he had to go on Cobra, because of pre-existing conditions his premiums of what he is use to...dental, eye, no deductions is 1800.00 a month. now god damn i sure couldnt afford 1800.00 a month. and the way i see it is something is wrong here. with the current trend in the system the costs will keep creeping up and more and more will be taken away, and until it affects you personally the baby wont cry, when the baby crys you feed it. Look at the trend over the last 15 years of what has happened to your own personal healthcare, did it get better? probably not ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 10:37am
|
another BIG problem is the Doctors writing scripts, everyone knows someone hooked on painkillers, how do they get away with it? who needs to control the greedy doctors, Painkillers are also Big Business...Agree? ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 11:08am
|
I find it interesting which topics become hot button. They are feed to us by media and politicians and it always seems to be the private industries that are targeted. education has gone up faster than healthcare. double digit increases for the last 30 years for k-12 and college, but they are liberal institutions and get ignores. My state budget has more than doubled in the last 10 years, no mention on the news, but let a pharmicutical company make a profit and look out. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 1:06pm
|
What would you say if the government came in and said that you can no longer charge xx for your services because it MIGHT adversely affect the economy. That is not a free capalistic economy. As I said before this is not about reforming anything it is simply about control. Do you realize that part of this healthcare bill being considered there will be an executive oversight medicare panel (only reports to the president with no oversight) that will be making decisions on what kind of healthcare will be provided to the all Americans. Lets say you get cancer and the panel has looked at the statistical chances that with the type of cancer you have there is less than a 5% chance of survial (as was the case with Lance Armstrong), than most likely you and everyone in the country with that type of cancer will be denied care. (Except the politicians since they exempt themselves from this bill)
If the government wants to do something that would be positive and really make a difference here are a few solutions that would be relatively inexpensive compared to what they are proposing. 1. Offer catatrophic coverage for every American to cover those situations that has the potential to bankrupt a family. (Like your example of the Shell employee Eric) 2. Open up the ability of Americans and companies to look beyond the state they are in for coverage. This would end up reducing cost and allowing companies to offer less expensive coverage. 3. Tort reform. For example an OB doctor pays about $500,000 a year for malpractice insurance. This will never be part of a bill because our country is run by lawyers. 4. Do not cover anyone who is an illegal alien. The way the bill is written if you reside in the US you will be eligiable for the government healthcare. That is about 12 million people. This is part of the reason that California is bankrupt. 5. Allow physicians in the Emergency Department to denie care to individuals that do not need Emergency care. This would require tort reform that will never happen. 6. If the government want to be in the insurance business have them provide malpractice insurance at a reduced cost. (I personnaly do not like this because the government is invovled. It might be ok if they did not try to dictate to the practitioner how to practice) 7. No political contributions to politicians from healthcare related or any big business. 9. Subsidise small business that are willing to offer healthcare coverage to their employees. 10. CUT TAXES, CUT TAXES, CUT TAXES AND CUT TAXES. Give us our money back, including businessed of all sizes, and get out of the way and let capatilisim work. 11. Offer temporary healthcare to the unemployeed with a time limit. These are a few ideas that would not give government complete control and begin to help and not change the quality of care we recieve or our choices. If we want new and inovative ways to keep us healthy and well there is going to be a cost associated. I saw something yesterday, not sure how accurate, that about 50% of the cost of rising care is due to new technology. I work for a university based hospital system and there are always new innovations coming out to help all people live longer. Yes we do have the best healthcare in the world and if we want to keep it do not allow the government take control. ------------- Chris |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 1:16pm
|
Eric,
Most doctors are not greedy. Look at it this way. Doctors spend between 10-16 years of their life learning to take care of people. When they are done they come out anywhere between $300,000 and $600,000 in debt. Could you imagine trying to pay that off if the government begins to set salaries. Within 10 to 15 years there would be about 50% less doctors covering 46 million more people. There is one way to do that-limit access to care. Can you say Canada?? I personnaly want practitioners of all kind to make a lot of money. That way we will get qulified people taking care of us. Ok I have said enough. Got to go study. ------------- Chris |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 6:58pm
|
If you want any of your 11 points you have to change the players in Washington. They have stacked the deck and rigged the game for themselves. We need to take back government, or nothing will ever get better. Our only chance is at election time. If your term is up your OUT. The new polititions will have to agree to pay their taxes, healthcare, social security and term limits. The only thing they truley care about is winning the next election. Why else woould they spend millions to get the job. Where else can you take a year or two off to try to get a new job without any reprecussions if you don't get it? Politics. I don't know how we do it but it has to be done. Once we have people running the country for the people then the bulls**** can be curtailed and maybe once again we can prosper. We have to stop giving the country away and start taking care of ouselves. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 8:22pm
|
I have been telling anyone who will listen that exact thing. This country is being "transformed" (Obama's words) right in front of us and if we do not stand up and throw all the weasles out of Washington this country will not be the same. Make no mistake there could come a time that the government will not allow us to use our boats because they use too much fuel, are too loud, give off too much CO2 (oh that evil gas that all green plants need to live an grow). I am screaming and will continue to anyone who will listen.
------------- Chris |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-28-2009 at 8:26pm
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Everyone needs to watch, record or TIVO Glenn Beck. He brings is all together. ------------- Chris |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-29-2009 at 10:32am
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are the hospitals going to satisfy your 11 points, No,
i said there was greed in the system, and one other thing I said is, we wouldnt be taliking about this if there werent any problems and damn this thread is getting pretty long....at least we recognize that there are problems...so how do they get repaired? this may be cynical but do we really want people to live to be 125? i sure the fk dont, for me 80 and out lol, i think your thoughts should be live comfortabally to 80 not extend life, thats in Gods hands ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-29-2009 at 11:42am
|
I must live on the darkside....I called the Jackson thing 4 weeks ago, doctor assissted suicide, homicide? nothing more than a greedy doctor, on his payroll for 150k a month, according to my calculations he should be able to pay off school in around 4 months..not provable, so now the *************** family is going to file a civil lawsuit lets say for 150 million, who will pay the 150 milly's? malpractice insurance. for the most part Doctors are good, but i dont have enough fingers to tell you the guy's i know that are getting 90 per month 80mg Oxy-Contins that go for a minimum of 50 bucks a crack...thats $$4500.00 per month tax free...doctors havee the power to write these scripts and i know these people do not need that kind of pain medication, why are they writing these scripts? because the entire industry benefits, thats why there are pharmacies at every corner. a high school friend of mines father took one to the head, self inflicted, 3 weeks ago, on his calender the day was circled and it said "no more doctors" maybe if they rounded off that 12 minutes to 15 they could of recognized there was a problem there........ ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-31-2009 at 1:17pm
If the gov't can't handle a used car lot(cash for clunkers), I'm not sure I want them telling me which pills to take.  ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-31-2009 at 2:06pm
|
will you take the swine flu anti virus? ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: July-31-2009 at 2:29pm
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You're avoiding the issue... ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: critter
Date Posted: July-31-2009 at 2:41pm
|
I have not taken a flu shot in 20+ years and have not had the flu since.
Finally talked the wife out of getting her free employer flu shot a few years ago and she stopped getting the flu each year. It is better to practice good hygiene than to have them put a virus in you. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique 1966 Barracuda |
Posted By: trihartsfield
Date Posted: July-31-2009 at 2:42pm
Kinda like the currrent White House administration  (Sorry could,t resist) Eric you are a good sport you have gotten beatin up on this thread.------------- Chris |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-31-2009 at 4:16pm
|
i have a feeling im hanging with the GOP here, it takes alot more to ruffle me, i just try to put another point of view out there. thats allright you guys got beat up in November,
dont throw Palin out there or we ill see another 4 of this guy ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |