HELP GT-40 No Start
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Engine Repair
Forum Discription: Engine problems and solutions
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=30717
Printed Date: September-27-2024 at 5:23pm
Topic: HELP GT-40 No Start
Posted By: whiz05403
Subject: HELP GT-40 No Start
Date Posted: July-12-2013 at 9:42pm
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Been having some electrical problems on my 97 Sport Nautique GT-40. Please watch short video: Need advice!!!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbB47l_PXSM Thanks Mike |
Replies:
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: July-12-2013 at 10:53pm
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Have you checked your battery terminals? Proper link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbB47l_PXSM" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbB47l_PXSM |
Posted By: Got Tiques
Date Posted: July-13-2013 at 3:03am
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Mike, You message is confusing/upsetting!! Why did you say you are having electrical problems without describing your symptoms, and then provide a link to a video that doesn't work, and then suggest I watch a video. Then you ask for advice. Remember, I'm not the one with a problem. Maybe I should just guess what your problems are, and machine-gun the response/potential solution. This is a great site with lots of experience, even on the GT-40's. But you need to help us understand the problem that you are facing and are so close to. I have a GT-40, my third, and just fixed a friend's 1998 Ski with a GT-40 that had an intermittent no-start problem going on three years. There are specific issues (simple) with the circa 1997 electrical systems. Please respond!! Todd ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4811" rel="nofollow - '78 Ski Tique |
Posted By: SNobsessed
Date Posted: July-13-2013 at 10:23am
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I'll bite - Sounds like your battery is bad. ------------- “Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.” Ben Franklin |
Posted By: lewy2001
Date Posted: July-13-2013 at 10:30am
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I can hear a solenoid engaging on the video. The GT40 has a power assist solenoid on the metal plate at rear of engine. It is on the underside of that plate just below the relays. I would be cleaning the connections on that solenoid and the battery terminals. Then measure voltages at battery and the power assist solenoid. You may have bad cables that are causing a voltage drop or a flat battery. ------------- If you're going through hell, keep going http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2999" rel="nofollow - 89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: July-13-2013 at 12:49pm
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Mike, I agree with all of the above comments especially the one about not providing enough info. The video really was not helpful to me. Thankfully Mark caught the solenoid click. Hopefully you are not using a deep cycle battery for starting the engine. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: whiz05403
Date Posted: July-14-2013 at 2:17am
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Hello Gents, I'm very sorry I did not provide more info. Also it's taken a while to check back here. I coached 14 innings of baseball today as well as watched 9 more. (3 of my boys play ball) OK, so over the past few years I have been having this clicking sound during start attempts but the motor usually fires up after a few tries. It has been getting progressively worse as time passes on. I have replaced the positive terminal twice, and have kept the battery well charged as well as kept the terminals clean. Tomorrow I will swap batteries with my truck and see if that makes any difference. The connections to the round thingy above the starter are clean as a whistle. That metal plate you are talking about, what should I do there? I will look at those connections. Thanks in advance for the advice. Mike ------------- |
Posted By: whiz05403
Date Posted: July-14-2013 at 2:19am
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A bit more: When I turn the key one click, you can here the fuel pump make it's usual noise. Then when the start is attempted that is when you hear the click. Thanks ------------- |
Posted By: lewy2001
Date Posted: July-14-2013 at 10:34am
This picture shows location of power wire with battery +ve cable attached. This assist solenoid applies power to the other starter solenoid on top of starter. You should be able to tell which solenoid is engaging by touching it while someone else hits the starter. If all the connections are clean on this power assist solenoid and it has the same voltage as you measure at the battery. The voltage should be over 12.5 Volts if you battery has a decent charge stored. That checks out the battery and cabling to the assist solenoid. Then test the voltage on the other side of the assist solenoid you will see a smaller red battery cable running to the starter check for the same 12.5 Volts when engaged. The yellow red wire runs from the assist solenoid terminal to the starter solenoid also to activate that solenoid test it has 12 volts on it when the ignition is turned to start position. Before you replace the assist solenoid take extra care of noting the correct wiring to the terminals. ------------- If you're going through hell, keep going http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2999" rel="nofollow - 89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
Posted By: whiz05403
Date Posted: July-14-2013 at 12:26pm
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Wow. thank you very much Lewy. I will look at that hopefully today. ------------- |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: July-14-2013 at 2:33pm
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Mike, Get the volt meter out and check what you are getting to the starter during cranking. You never answered if you have a deep cycle for starting?? If so, dump it and get a starting battery. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: whiz05403
Date Posted: July-15-2013 at 8:34am
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The battery is not a deep cycle. Buying volt meter today. If one of the solenoids fails where do you usually order new parts? |
Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: July-15-2013 at 6:36pm
This is one source http://www.nautiqueparts.com/solenoidstarterrelay.aspx - Solenoid Zach at N3Boatworks (Banner ad above) should be able to get them as well and they are a site sponsor. |
whiz05403 wrote:Posted By: steepndeep
Date Posted: October-28-2014 at 9:06pm
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Hey guys! New (to me) Nautique owner, 2000 Pro Air with the boss gt40... was wondering if someone has detailed pictures of the solenoid relay wiring on the same model boat? Just replaced mine and Im not even getting a click. also replaced neutral safety switch. Checked as many connections as I could get to and cleaned them really good. Lewy2001 I saw that picture you posted in this thread and was wondering if you had one from a better angle that could be of some help, or anyone else that has one would be greatly appreciated!! Been searching on here and planet nautique and cannot seem to find a for sure right wiring diagram. Thanks all, this site is really cool!! Kasey |
Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: October-29-2014 at 1:42pm
What where your symptoms before the parts replacement? Where did you get your replacement solenoid? From a PCM parts supplier? |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-29-2014 at 1:46pm
Kasey, What is the VOM telling you before you started putting parts in it? Yes, a wiring diagram would be great but you can get some volt readings from the NSS and coil on the start relay without one. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: lewy2001
Date Posted: October-29-2014 at 7:00pm
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Kasey as suggested the VOM is your best friend especially if the wiring has been switched around somehow. Hard to get a better picture of the assist solenoid due to its PIA location. I do remember a hand drawn diagram that someone posted I will try and track it down. ------------- If you're going through hell, keep going http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2999" rel="nofollow - 89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
Posted By: lewy2001
Date Posted: October-29-2014 at 7:05pm
Found them.......  ------------- If you're going through hell, keep going http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2999" rel="nofollow - 89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
Posted By: steepndeep
Date Posted: October-29-2014 at 10:13pm
The symptoms started out as intermittent no start with a click at what sounded like the starter or the solenoid relay-not %100 sure-but almost always when the engine was warmed up, very few times would it not start on the first try but there was one occasion when it failed to start right up cold (Im in Hawaii so "cold" is not really an issue).. After almost getting stranded out in the ocean, I decided no more boating until the problem is resolved. As I was rinsing out the engine on the trailer after her last outing, it failed to start at all after that. So I ordered a new starter solenoid relay from nautiqueparts.com and after talking with their parts rep I opted for a new neutral safety switch as well. Not sure if I wired that up correctly when putting it back together but from how its built it looks like the wires from either side could be interchanged, if I am wrong about this please let me know, I didnt mess with it once it was installed. Starting batt-month old, cranked the engine just fine every time Wired solenoid up as instructed on the nautiqueparts.com website. http://www.nautiqueparts.com/solenoidstarterrelay.aspx after it was wired up the fuel pump would not prime, so I wired it back the way it was on the old one Im guessing VOM is Volt Ohm Meter, I do not have one and have never used one. Is it easy? New with electrical, Ill go out and buy one tomorrow and try to find something on youtube on how to use one, please let me know if there is a certain place I should start. I will get some pictures up here asap. thank you very much for your help!!! |
Posted By: steepndeep
Date Posted: October-29-2014 at 10:16pm
Thank you for your reply! I do not yet have a VOM but will go get onw tomorrow or this weekend and learn how to use it. Electricity for some reason is very intimidating for me, mechanical stuff comes very natural, hopefully I can pick up on the electrical stuff, sounds like it can become an issue with boats quite often. Thank you again and if there is any recomendations you have as far a VOM tutorials that would be great! |
Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: October-29-2014 at 11:39pm
That's correct on the Neutral Safety Switch. The two posts are interchangeable because it's just a simple switch. |
Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: October-29-2014 at 11:43pm
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If you're pretty new to electricity, a test light will tell you most of what you need to know in this particular situation. The only problem is the information it will tell you is binary, just "yes/no" on whether or not you're getting juice, it just won't tell you how much. The posts on the solenoid, shoouulldd just be dealing with the switching of positive, so you can clamp your (test light) negative alligator on a known solid ground, somewhere on the block and poke around with the pointy end. When you get light, you've then got a live positive. You should be getting light when you touch the post with the heavy red wires, at all times, regardless of the key. See what you get and we'll move from there. |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-30-2014 at 12:31am
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Kasey, A VOM is very easy to use. It will come with instructions. A basic one will be about $20. It will come in handy around the house and car too. DON'T just go throwing parts at the issue until you determine the problem. Don't become just a "parts changer".  ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-30-2014 at 12:36am
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Kasey, I forgot to ask, when are we going to see some pictures? We love to see them. I'm sure one of the CCfan group will also ask for some pictures of some of the Hawaiian women too!  ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: steepndeep
Date Posted: October-30-2014 at 9:02am
Sounds like both the test light and VOM will be good tools. Will hopefully buy tomorrow and will have some time to poke around and see if we can make any progress. I really appreciate the genuine help on the site, you guys are so cool for helping! Thank you! |
Posted By: steepndeep
Date Posted: October-30-2014 at 9:13am
Pictures will come I promise, Hawaiian girls and all. First we need to get her running so we can bring said girls on the boat!! A little motivation never hurts Its great to know I have some knowledgable people on this forum that are willing to help. Thank you all for the support so far. I will follow up tomorrow or friday with any progress!!Good news is, the times that the engine did start, it rips! |
Posted By: steepndeep
Date Posted: October-30-2014 at 9:16am
Lewy2001 thank you very much! It looks like you have one or two more wires than I do. Its hard to read some of the labels for the wires in your drawing but I appreciate the reply and will keep you all posted on the progress!! |
Posted By: steepndeep
Date Posted: October-30-2014 at 9:22am
 THis is how it was wired when I bought it. new solenoid looks slightly different, from nautiquepart.com |
Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: October-30-2014 at 10:34am
It looks like someone had added a jumper previously... if I'm correct, wired this way, essentially voltage was just coming from the Neutral Safety Switch (NSS) and going right to the solenoid on the starter. It was really just bypassing this remote solenoid we're looking at. I'm wondering if it didn't have a good ground and was not switching, therefore the jumper. You shouldn't need that jumper, everything else about the wiring looks correct. This era has a solenoid on the starter directly mounted to it, and this remote, round solenoid in the pic. This remote solenoid just switches the other solenoid, but it is a hub for other electrical as well. 
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Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: October-30-2014 at 10:40am
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This image should be helpful as well. Although, the I terminal, labeled in blue in the pic, is not typically used in PCM applications, so don't let that freak you out. 
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Posted By: steepndeep
Date Posted: November-05-2014 at 9:31am
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Alright guys, some great news, the problem is fixed! I did cheat a little bit and have my friends electrical engineer help me. He does electrical installations on big boats so he knows his stuff. Its funny because the first thing he said when he shows up is "ya its probably just a bad connection somewhere" which is all ive been hearing on most of these threads. It took him from 8.a.m. to noon to figure it out. It was a corroded connection with the ignition breaker in the black box under the dash. Cleaned it off with a flathead screwdriver and it starts every time!! He only charged me for three hours of work at $60 an hr which I thought was a deal, I threw him $200 and said keep it. Hope he answers my calls next time :) I really do appreciate all of the help from you guys. I did buy a multimeter and a test light and payed close attention to what he was doing so hopefully when this happens again I can track it down myself. But for now, I have piece of mind and most importantly, enjoy the boat! Now we can start putting some time into the huge list of projects that are a little more fun! Well, after I pull the engine and change out the rusted oil pan lol! Any down side to putting an aluminum one in? Thanks again guys, will try to get some pics up soon! |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: November-05-2014 at 10:35am
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Down side to the pan? Assuming you're in salt forget it. Just get a new one and coat it with something, coal tar epoxy or one of its modern equivalents. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: November-05-2014 at 10:55am
Gary, Modern? Maybe you need some updating? Coal tar epoxy is still around and a common coating. http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-paint/=ugnhbp" rel="nofollow - Here it is at McMaster Look under "epoxy coatings" then severe environment. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |