Are fuel regulators standard equipment
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Engine Repair
Forum Discription: Engine problems and solutions
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=31754
Printed Date: October-08-2024 at 5:20pm
Topic: Are fuel regulators standard equipment
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Subject: Are fuel regulators standard equipment
Date Posted: October-10-2013 at 11:17pm
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I have a 1985 2001 with a ford Windsor 351 PCM. it is very hard to start and requires starting fluid when cold. I examined the carb and it delelivers plenty of fuel... it has a fuel regulator which seems to be aftermarket. Is this standard equipment and if not, why would you install. thanks for the help. |
Replies:
Posted By: baitkiller
Date Posted: October-10-2013 at 11:39pm
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Gonna need a pic of this one... ------------- Jesus was a bare-footer............. |
Posted By: backfoot100
Date Posted: October-10-2013 at 11:53pm
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I'm guessing the fuel pump was changed out and had too much pressure which held the needle/seats open flooding the engine. Definitely not standard equipment. ------------- When people run down to the lake to see what's making that noise, you've succeeded. Eddie |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-11-2013 at 12:08am
| I will get a pic ASAP... had a hard start issue and it starts right up when using starting fluid... |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-11-2013 at 11:44pm
| is it possible to post a picture from an iPad as my forum screen does not show an attachment button? |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-12-2013 at 3:05pm
Glenn, I highly recommend not using the starting fluid. It's a "crutch" and over time, you will trash your engine. The biggest problem with it is the ether is a very strong solvent and washes all the oil off the cylinder walls. I will not have a can of it in my garage or shop! Yes, pictures are needed. Is the carb original? Has it ever been rebuilt? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Gluvs2brd wrote:Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-12-2013 at 10:46pm
 The carb has been replaced. THe engine was rebuilt over 100 hours ago. Former owner also replaced the valves to better accommodate the unleaded fuel. He also put in a Pertronix electronic ignition. What is so strange about the hard start problem is that when the boat runs, it does so flawlessly, no skips, misses smoke or abnormalities.... It runs perfectly ... When using the boat often this summer, it had a hot start issue but started reasonably easily without starting fluid... With that being said, the carb seems adjusted fine and the timing is also good. What gives with the fuel regulator? Thinking of taking it off tomorrow and going to the lake to see what happens. Thanks for the advise about the starting fluid!!! I was unaware of that being a bad thing. Hence the forum status "newbie"... Please chime in at will. All advise/opinions are welcome... |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-12-2013 at 11:10pm
 Up close pic... And why would this be installed... The fuel pump appears to be stock. |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-13-2013 at 6:23am
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Glenn, Did the PO at least install a marine carb? Knowing what it is would also be helpful. Considering the non USCG install of the pressure regulator, he may not have known what he was doing! The high pressure side of the fuel pump should be hard piped. There are alternatives but the USCG regs are very specific when rubber hose is used. What's that orange oil filter doing on a nice 351?  Hopefully the PO installed it as well! We do not like to see the orange since they are the worst filter you can get.------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-13-2013 at 9:50pm
| thanks for all the responses... I removed the fuel regulator and low and behold the boat starts right up evey time.... the fuelmregulator wasnstarving the boat for fuel on startnup....no I did not install the orange filter(lol) and love all the opinions posted here... I'm not sure wether the new carb is a marine version or not... I just know it works... it is a holly four barrel.... I did notice a couple of thenports were sealed. is there an easy way to tell? thanks again, this is a great forum... |
Posted By: ArtCozier
Date Posted: October-13-2013 at 10:20pm
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i've heard of lots of wierd things over the years, but never heard of a fuel reg on a carbureted boat. Easy to tell the marine carb. List # 4160, stamped on the front of the air horn toward the throttle cable side. Or, easier yet, take off the flame arrestor (some folks call it an air filter) and see whether there are two tubes sticking up that look like an upside-down letter "J". Those are the bowl vents. Automotive carbs will have straight ones cut off at an angle. Art ------------- "Art" |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-14-2013 at 10:55pm
| thanks Art. |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-17-2013 at 4:49pm
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Gents, The reason for this post originally was due to a hard start when hot issue. Removing the fuel regulator did not fix this issue as my lake test demonstrated yesterday. Yes, the boat now starts right up and runs like a top, but don't shut it off... You may be there a while. I am going to test my spark again when it is hot but after that I'm out of options. Does the pertronix ignition (installed by the previous owner)get hot and not work??? IT is the first version they put out... Any other means of troubleshooting would be appreciated... I refuse to bring to a dealer... Cant be that complicated... Thanks in advance for any suggestions... |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: October-17-2013 at 5:18pm
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Please describe "doesnt start well when hot". What happens when: 1. Boat is cold 2. Boat is warm, you shut down and restart immediately 3. Boat is warm, you shut down and restart after 30 seconds 4. Boat is warm, you shut down and restart after a few hours (assuming ambient temps are high enough to keep the engine near operating temp, more or less) When the boat "starts hard", does it crank slow? Normal cranking but no start? Do you manipulate the throttle when it struggles to start? If so, describe what you do. |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-17-2013 at 7:39pm
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1. the first start of the day. has always started within a few tries.... 2. once its hot or warmed up and you turn off... it's a crap shoot with or without throttle wether it will start or not. sometimes you have to quit and wait a while to not run down the battery.... 3. same answer to question three... always turns over well. I used to use a quick shot of starter fluid but quit due to advise of another member.... yesterday during my lake test I shut off and it wouldnt fire up... tried the spray and it didn't work... I had a buddy look at the spark when I took him out and he said the spark wasn't at great... it sure fires quick sometimes for having a weak spark.... I would like to reinstall the old points and give it a go. PO told me he put a hotter plug in it which clued me to he must have had the same problem..... 4. haunt tried waiting a few hours but. Waited maybe one hour and no change to it's ability to fire up.... I usually try first with no fuel but then give it a quick pump or two.... I have confirmed no leak- by after shutoff... it's ashame because it shines and runs like a new boat! after it starts....... |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: October-17-2013 at 7:41pm
Explain this:
Just to clarify, when I say shut down and restart immediately, I mean immediately. Not waiting 10 seconds, not waiting 1 second. Shut down, restart. What happens? Is this answer still valid?
So when this problem occurs, you have tried adding no extra fuel (throttle closed) and adding extra fuel (pumping). The latter would help the engine to start if it had a lean idle mixture- but it would be a reliable fix and you would not have to fight it. This does not appear to be your problem. All of the symptoms Im seeing are consistent with Zach's guess- and the most common cause of the "hot starting" issue. Ie, the carburetor leaks gas after shut down, flooding the engine. If you attempt to restart immediately, it should start since it has not had a chance to flood yet. Wait more than a few seconds and it will be on its way to flooding. Additional cranking and pumping of the throttle flood it more. Opening up the throttle all the way will introduce more air and allow it to start. Waiting several hours will allow the bowls to drain down incrementally and stop leaking, and the gas will eventually evaporate off the top of the intake and you can restart as normal. Pop your flame arrestor off and look down the throat of the carb when you shut down. You should see no dripping. |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-17-2013 at 7:46pm
| I meant no fuel leaking bu the carb after shutdown... causing a flooding situation. |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: October-17-2013 at 7:55pm
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Dripping out of the boosters is the most common problem Ive seen, but Ive also seen carbs leak after shut down lower down on the body (idle/transition circuits?) which is a bit tougher to spot, but the end result is the same. Try the open throttle (no pumping) trick next time it acts up and see if it starts for you. |
Posted By: ArtCozier
Date Posted: October-17-2013 at 9:47pm
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Question #5 from me would be "Does it blow black smoke from the exhaust when it finally does start?" Also, I'd like to hear the results of a timing chain slack test. How many hours on the engine? Art ------------- "Art" |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-18-2013 at 4:05pm
| Art: It has never blown any smoke, black or white... I have never done a timing slack test. The engine was completely rebuilt to include a new carb only 100 hours ago. Please give me a little more info on the timing chain test. I think in my humble opinion that it the timing was off, it would not run so perfectly when it does. The boat has yet to sputter or miss ever! Once it starts... |
Posted By: Gluvs2brd
Date Posted: October-18-2013 at 4:10pm
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TRBenj: I will perform the test of starting immediatly after shut down and get post the results. I have never heard of the wide open throttle trick but will attempt as well. Art: I see your an O town guy... near Clermont? Thanks again for all the info... Love this site. |
Posted By: ArtCozier
Date Posted: October-18-2013 at 6:02pm
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OK, no black smoke indicates no excess fuel in the cylinders when it starts, so we probably don't have a fuel leak while shut down. If you find that the spark is weak when the engine is hot, try to borrow an ignition coil from someone and try it on yours. No doubt the complete rebuild of the engine meant a new timing chain and gears, (sprockets, actually) so the chain is probably OK, but I will describe the test just the same: This is best done with the spark plugs at least loosened in their holes, so that you don't have to fight the compression. Turn the crank with a wrench on the front bolt until the engine is at a convenient timing mark. Say 10 degrees. With the distributor cap off, carefully observe the rotor while slowly turning the crank in the opposite direction from what you used to bring up the timing mark. As soon as you see the slightest rotation of the distributor rotor, stop turning are read the timing mark where you stopped. A difference of more than 5 degrees indicates a stretched timing chain. Sometimes I tape a broom straw to the rotor so as to make any rotation easier to see. Yes, I live in south Orlando, directly west of where the old CC plant on Orange Av is. Art ------------- "Art" |