GT-40 Pro Boss Engine starting / stopping issues
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Engine Repair
Forum Discription: Engine problems and solutions
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=37230
Printed Date: September-26-2024 at 1:53pm
Topic: GT-40 Pro Boss Engine starting / stopping issues
Posted By: tnplicky
Subject: GT-40 Pro Boss Engine starting / stopping issues
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 1:52pm
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1995 Ski Nautique GT-40 Pro Boss PMC/Ford 351 EFI Engine wouldn't start at boat ramp this morning Got it started at home, but now won't shut off. Several weeks back, replaced fuel pump and fuel relay due to another starting issue. Have used it several times since and no issues. Today, engine turned over but would not start at the boat ramp. I suspected the fuel relay since I did not hear it prime. I had messed around with the relay the other day to re-mount it as the replacement relay did not mount the same way as the original. I heard fuel pump prime when I was messing with the relay. (Ignition switch is off - shouldn't get power should it?) I hooked the hose to the boat and was able to start it in the drive way, but went to shut it off and it did not shut down when I turned the key to off. I turned off the ignition switch. Still running. I pulled the kill switch. Still running. I ended up pulling all the spark plug wires to kill the engine. I suspect something electrical is messed up, but I have not done anything with the electrical system. Thoughts ./ ideas / advice???? Also, in my situation above Is there a better way to kill the engine other than pulling the spark plug wires? |
Replies:
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 2:35pm
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Did you replace both relays? Why not switch them and see if the trouble follows or causes other symptoms? ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 2:43pm
Tell us more about the relay. You say it didn't mount the same way. What was different? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
tnplicky wrote:Posted By: tnplicky
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 2:45pm
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Yes, I replaced both relays. I will switch and report back my findings. Here is another bit of info: with ignition switch off and the key not even in the ignition, if I tap on the fuel relay, I get the fuel priming pump "buzzing" sound when it primes. I wouldn't think there should even be power to the fuel pump under that situation. |
Posted By: tnplicky
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 3:51pm
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The original Hella relays have a small metal bracket which snaps in the back of the relay and blots to a bracket on the back of the engine. The new relays (from a different manufacturer from NAPA) did not work with the small Hella bracket. I velcro-ed them in place instead. It ended up being a bad "new" relay, I believe. I had replaced both relays previously, so I had 2 "old" ones, one bad, one good and the 2 "new" relays. Well apparently one of the "new" relays is now bad. The boat currently works normally with the good "old" and the good "new" relay. What I didn't understand is why there was power to the relays without the ignition switch on or the key in the on position. Like I said previously, I got it started but then it wouldn't shut off.. I am not good with electrical systems, but something in the relay was allowing the boat to continue to run with no key, ignition switch off, and kill switch removed. Now with 2 good relays, everything works as it should. |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 4:01pm
It has always amazed me about all the relay problems. Are the relays being used for over or near their amp capacities? What is the typical failure? Contacts or coils? Get the VOM out!  ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: tnplicky
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 4:36pm
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Not sure, like I said am not good with things electrical, but everything should be "original" on the boat. There have been no modifications that would have increased electrical demand. I am going to order a couple of new Hella relays to have on hand for the next time, if and when it happens. I am hoping I have taken care of the issue for now. |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 5:14pm
I'm not saying anyone has added loads to the relays but rather PCM that I suspect of pushing the relay's at or beyond the amp capacity. They are probably using the IEC method of sizing relay contacts which is a combination of number of cycles and the load. I feel it comes down to using cheap instead of going with the NEMA standards. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: tnplicky
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 6:34pm
| I am just glad it seems to be working for now. I appreciate the helpful advice. |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 6:35pm
Your being pretty hard on PCM there Pete.I think 20 years in a marine enviroment is pretty good. The NAPA replacement is the one that lasted what weeks? The originals are Hella's,got my spares on Amazon for something like 6-7 dollars each ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: August-30-2015 at 10:31pm
Gary, I never said anything about Napa. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: August-31-2015 at 1:55am
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I realize that Pete. What I'm saying is PCM used Hellas which lasted 20 years which in marine enviroment seems pretty good. He replaced them with the ones from napa that failed in short order which may not have been to the same standards as the ones pcm used. I remember the maintance involved in the relays in the old central offices and they were in a controled enviroment. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: lewy2001
Date Posted: August-31-2015 at 6:44am
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I feel part of the high failure rate of these relays is how hot the plate on rear of engine gets. You could fry eggs on it most of the time. So instead of acting as a heatsink for the relays it is more of a heat soak. Insulating and spacing them of the plate with some air gap may help reliability. ------------- If you're going through hell, keep going http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2999" rel="nofollow - 89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: August-31-2015 at 7:06am
Mark, That's interesting. I also wonder if there is any contact protection for the fuel pump induction load. If the high failure rate is from contacts burning up, that would make a big difference. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |