Time for a heater...
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: General Correct Craft Discussion
Forum Name: Common Questions
Forum Discription: Visit here first for common questions regarding your Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=49571
Printed Date: November-24-2024 at 4:11pm
Topic: Time for a heater...
Posted By: ultrarunner
Subject: Time for a heater...
Date Posted: January-21-2021 at 7:13pm
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Couple of questions: On my '96 SN, I was thinking the Heatercraft 230 unit (Sport Kit, add the Y-adapter). Thoughts and comments? Thanks, Mark '96 SN Signature GT-40
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Replies:
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: January-21-2021 at 7:28pm
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I think a 200 came in my boat, that's the 2 outlet model. Works great after I put the Y in. Without it there is no heat at slow speeds. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: ultrarunner
Date Posted: January-21-2021 at 7:35pm
| Yep Gary, looking at the specs, same heater 200 vs. 230, with the latter having a third smaller port, I'm assuming for those that want a defroster. |
Posted By: bigwavedave
Date Posted: January-23-2021 at 1:14pm
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You can make your own heater for under $100. Build a box then purchased a large heater core at a discount auto parts place and a fan you can buy the hoses and connectors also Dave ------------- bigwavedave |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-23-2021 at 3:54pm
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Yup, made mine as well, very compact, and quiet, and inexspensive ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: ultrarunner
Date Posted: January-23-2021 at 4:11pm
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Yeah, the thought did cross my mind to put one together from a heater core....easy enough project. Now I'm motivated :-) |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-23-2021 at 5:48pm
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I'll try to take a picture of mine, and also the ground-down street elbow on the circ pump, so one can route the water more like it is on an auto, and get excellent heat at idle by not continuously loose high proportion of heated block water out the exhaust water and cooler water replacing it, as happens with the y ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: January-23-2021 at 6:33pm
| FYI the key component of the heatercraft Y is the restriction on the return... which is how it retains good heat at idle. It’s fairly easy to make your own tee with a restriction. |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-24-2021 at 8:56am
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Good to learn Tim! My exposure to the tee must have been flawed or something else amiss ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: ultrarunner
Date Posted: January-24-2021 at 10:04am
Hey Tom, I think I'll put one together. I'm plenty handy, have all the tools to put together a nice box and such. Do you have a particular source for the core and blower? thanks, Mark
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GottaSki wrote:Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-24-2021 at 5:04pm
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Certainly Mark, If you don't see pictures tonight, I'll post them tomorrow, may be easier than from the phone. I am still using the original blower since making my first heater in '87. I think they still make the same brand, tmc! Just found it... https://arnolds-boat-shop.shoplightspeed.com/tmc-bilge-blower-flange-mount-momentary-12v-90cfm.html I am still using a core from an 80s fox mustang no air, because that's what I had available (used) at the time. The first wrecking yard brass core lasted almost 25 years . The latest aluminum replacement I don't think will last very long, but they are inexpensive af. It suits a two outlet system, one can search a larger core from something popular, newer. Best is short, uncomplicated outlets. if you desire three outlets go bigger. Most anything works! In the last three years, I've added heater craft pullout tubes, they are reduced now, grab a couple! https://www.bakesonline.com/heater-craft-h509b-1st-generation-pull-out-hot-tube.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiA0rSABhDlARIsAJtjfCd-t9WFrt_qFXn7fYLneZNKifDG_aFTxvVz84XpDEgEmkz8ZkdwHeoaAvM8EALw_wcB The box is compact as possible, no more than 12x9x3 outside dimensions, but size the inside to your core of choice. A little foam and weatherstripping keeps all the air going through the core You will see a couple pvc flanges for the 3" outlets I found at HD, with a portion cut off so both outlets can compactly fit side by side on the face of the box. Three outlets would be similar. Engine side, I'll add a picture of each gazinta and gazouta Winterizing, I shopvac extract water from a hose at the engine then push some af forward. alternatively I've also connected the core with reversed garden hose connections, you can both bypass the core if it fails and keep going, and also bring the whole unit inside for the winter. ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: ultrarunner
Date Posted: January-24-2021 at 6:14pm
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Thanks so much Tom. I’ll take a look at the links. And yes, my thoughts are a that a two outlet will be just fine. Mark
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Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: January-24-2021 at 6:18pm
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Probably not as cheap as Tom’s but I’ve found these to be fairly reasonably priced and effective. Just add a heater tube and one flange for the drivers feet (plus the engine side stuff). https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-991102-1" rel="nofollow - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-991102-1 I’ve done the same as Tom with opposite sex quick connects on the engine supply/return. Mcmaster sells nice brass ones. |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 8:46am
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That system looks to be quite cost effective Tim! much more so than marine-specific offerings! ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 8:55am
System tucked above footwell ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 8:59am
One tube slung from control cables, places outlet within easy reach to extend to your feet ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 9:02am
Second pull-out tube at observer base
------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 9:07am
Outlet side of box ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 9:09am
Fan side ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 9:10am
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The hose side of the box has a slotted top, a few screws hold it in place ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 9:13am
Intake - 3/8 npt to 1/2"npt reducing elbow , 1/2" npt 3/4" hose barb ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: ultrarunner
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 9:18am
| Hey guys, thanks for all the comments and pictures. I have some good economical options. |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 9:19am
 @Water pump Return - 3/8" npt plug removed, 3/8 npt street elbow, 3/8 npt 5/8" hose barb * the street barb is ground down for clearance consider a 160 tstat After last frosty September you should be in for a treat this season season we use it all but the warmest mornings and evenings
------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 9:25am
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huh, looks like i hacked those pvc flanges down quite a bit with the saw ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 12:29pm
Tim, I'm trying to understand why the restriction is needed on the return. What's happening at idle? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 1:08pm
| I’d love a good explanation as I’ve never heard one myself. Without the restriction on the return, the heater will blow cool air at idle. |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 5:00pm
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When I bought my boat my heater feed was connected to a T at the intake like Tom's. The return went into the pipe plug drain of the U. No heat at idle. Put the Y in before the raw water pump. Hugh difference- originally was going to install their optional 12v pump Quinner told me to get the Y. The restriction consists of a 1/8 or 3/16 hole drilled into the 1" then a 5/8 braised over that hole on to the 1". I think it is the suction of the raw water pump that pulls the hot water through the system. That restriction might serve 2 purposes,it stops the hot water from being completly pulled out of the block and slows the flow down so the heat transfers to the heater core? ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: Donald80SN
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 5:25pm
Could this be Timmy Tee 2.0? I hear Tim's fist Tee for winterization is almost through the patent office. Then the cost goes up.  ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens 2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 6:02pm
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I like your explanation Gary ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 6:24pm
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I’ve never come up with a better theory either. Not sure there is a real concern with pulling too much warm water out of the block since you’re pushing it back in at the same rate (or better)... and it’s not like y-less set ups are prone to cooling system issues (just reduced heat at idle). Having no real background with thermodynamics, my back of the napkin logic would have thought that moving hot water through the core more rapidly (before it has a chance to cool) would allow the most heat transfer. I would have guessed the reduction at the return would slow the flow though the core down and make it less effective at pulling heat out, but apparently that logic is flawed. |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 6:44pm
Tim, I don't feel your logic is flawed and Gary's is. There has to be another reason for the restriction. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 7:39pm
------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: January-25-2021 at 8:46pm
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Well the way I see it is.... If you tap off of the intake manifold right before the thermostat for the driving force and you tap back into the system with the return water going into the inlet of the circulating pump either through the connection on the pump or thru a tee on the inlet to the circulating pump like in the Heatercraft instructions the driving force to provide flow is only due to the differential pressure across the circulating pump. That differential pressure is not much at all at idle speed so there's not much flow to the heater core . Now if you hook into the suction of the raw water pump with a tee for the return water from the heater (like Gary has done) you have a higher differential pressure because the inlet to the raw water pump is under a vacuum whenever the RWP is operating. As far as the restriction, at least logically you would think that .......... Small hole = more restriction= less flow=lower temperature Big hole=less restriction =more flow= more heat But it seems like there's that age old argument about the fluid spending enough time in a heat exchanger to transfer it's heat the best (depending on a lot of design factors). Heatercraft seems to say the hole size was derived from testing with no real explanation of the testing. I kinda figure that if I had 2 of the y fittings, I'd drill one out to a bigger sized hole and try it for myself ( and use a valve before the wye so I could have a "variable sized hole" in that return line that could be adjusted for best heater and cooling system performance. I guess it seems like I agree with Pete who agrees with Tim on the flow and maybe we're all a little curious about the hole size and how it was derived  |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: January-26-2021 at 6:27am
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For a real world example that we're all familiar with Some auto heaters use a flow control valve to vary the flow through the heater core and when you move the control to hotter, the valve opens allowing more flow and the temperature goes up. You don't go in the cooler direction and lower flow to raise temperature. Lots of vehicles these days use blend doors on the air side and constant flow on the coolant side, so this doesn't pertain to all vehicles, but you should get the idea. |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: January-26-2021 at 8:22am
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I can report I'll loose heat if idle speed in gear is around 650, around 750 the heat returns, and plenty of it. When I place the core at feet level, no loss of heat occurs at low idle I imagine with a t return to raw inlet, the still- warm return water is diluted with the main flow, and most these btus dumped out the exhaust, very little return heat makes it back into the engine replacing the exiting water, like having a stat bypass putting cold water into the engine continuously The orifice could possibly inhibit higher flow the core would see under nonidle conditions. ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |