Print Page | Close Window

Red Check Engine Light

Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Engine Repair
Forum Discription: Engine problems and solutions
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=51306
Printed Date: May-15-2024 at 11:55pm


Topic: Red Check Engine Light
Posted By: Otto Throttle
Subject: Red Check Engine Light
Date Posted: August-13-2023 at 4:33pm
Good afternoon! My 1999, 285 hp normally aspirated powered Nautique pop the red engine light yesterday. I had good oil pressure and the temperature was fine, so I did some research and read on a prior list here that it could be the sensors. Can someone please tell me where those sensors are located so I can troubleshoot and see if that is the cause or if I need to dig deeper.

Yes, the oil is full…. The only thing that was odd was it seemed to take a little longer to come up to temperature.

Thank you for your help in advance. I will disconnect one at a time to see if it stops the light from coming on.

-------------
Otto



Replies:
Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: August-13-2023 at 5:03pm
I just had that happen on my 97, ski 176. If you have a carbureted 351 like I do, you will find the oil pressure switch on the front of the engine next to the fuel pump. The temperature switch is located on the top of the engine near the thermostat. The switches, not the senders for the gauges, are responsible for the trouble light.

Replacing the oil pressure switch and oil pressure sender along with cleaning the T fitting of sludge “gave” me 15 psi more oil pressure.

YouTube is your friend.

-------------
https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206
http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot
78 SkiTiq


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-14-2023 at 10:55am
Thank you very much, so you are saying replaced both the switch and the sending unit for the gauge? What did you search under YouTube? Thanks again for your help. I appreciate it.


-------------
Otto


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-14-2023 at 3:58pm


I also would like to know if I should use a loctite or thread sealer when changing out!

Thanks for all help!

-------------
Otto


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-14-2023 at 4:57pm


Here are a couple of pictures from a recent thread.

First one shows the location of the oil pressure sending unit with the blue wire attached and also the oil pressure switch with the red wire attached

Second one shows the location of the high water temperature switch with the red wires.

The oil sending unit has nothing to do with your check engine light, it feeds the gauge on the dash, so no need to mess with that as long as you have good oil pressure indication.

If you unhook the wire from the oil switch and the light goes out, then you have a bad switch. If the light stays on, hook it back up and unhook the wire from the water temperature switch and the light should go out.

It'll be one switch or the other causing the problem.

Your wires may be a different color like green or some other color. Those in the pictures look like they've been redone at some point in time with the red wires and crimp connectors 

A little bit of thread sealer isn't a problem to prevent leaks. It's not some kind of super electrical insulator that will keep the pipe threads from making metal to metal contact with the female threads in the engine/manifold.

Or in other words, it won't affect the operation of the switches Wink

Lots of replacement sending units/switches come with a little sealer already applied.

You also have a water temperature sending unit over on the right side of the engine, directly behind the thermostat housing near the coil. It'll have a tan wire attached to it. No need to mess with that either, it feeds the gauge on the dash and has nothing to do with the red alarm light.

PS....you don't need the globs of RTV or whatever it is on those connections either


Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: August-14-2023 at 5:03pm
My 27-year-old oil pressure gauge sender was original (painted black by PCM).  It was in my way for the oil pressure switch replacement and removing it meant that I got to clean the sludge out of the T fitting.  It seemed to make sense to throw money at that part "while I'm there". 

Not needed but... 40 bucks extra to do it up now and not do it again for a while.  I was surprised at the amount of oil sludge in the T fitting and how a change of a "working" sender altered the observed oil pressure. Go figure. Ouch

Keno's write up and pics are PERFECT - BTW!


-------------
https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206
http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot
78 SkiTiq


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-14-2023 at 5:23pm
Originally posted by Air206 Air206 wrote:

 

Keno's write up and pics are PERFECT - BTW!

Maybe, maybe not  Wink

On a gt40 which I'm more familiar with in those model years, the hi temperature switch is behind the thermostat housing 

That's what Air206 said in his post too.

So what you should do is, look for the green wires, those go to the dash light 




Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-15-2023 at 6:28am
Awesome!   I didn’t wanna have to do all that, but now I am very excited as I know what to do! Thank you everybody for your time and effort, it’s saved me a ton of time!!!!! I appreciate it!

-------------
Otto


Posted By: Mpost
Date Posted: August-15-2023 at 8:19am
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Originally posted by Air206 Air206 wrote:

 

Keno's write up and pics are PERFECT - BTW!

Maybe, maybe not  Wink

On a gt40 which I'm more familiar with in those model years, the hi temperature switch is behind the thermostat housing 

That's what Air206 said in his post too.

So what you should do is, look for the green wires, those go to the dash light 


Not to be picky Wink but with Kens steps it is not mentioned that the engine must be running when the wires are removed. 
Big smile
Ask me how I know!


-------------
84 SN Sold   98 SN    Lund Pro V   1975 Alumacraft


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-15-2023 at 8:30am
Originally posted by Mpost Mpost wrote:

 
Not to be picky Wink but with Kens steps it is not mentioned that the engine must be running when the wires are removed. 

Yeah........what Marty said Wink

And if somebody happens to have a gt40 and is looking for sensors, switches, sending units for oil pressure and water temperature, here's a link to a thread by Marty showing locations

http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=49744&title=98-gt40-sensors-and-swithces" rel="nofollow - link




Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: August-15-2023 at 10:18am
Originally posted by Mpost Mpost wrote:

Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Originally posted by Air206 Air206 wrote:

 

Keno's write up and pics are PERFECT - BTW!

Maybe, maybe not  Wink

On a gt40 which I'm more familiar with in those model years, the hi temperature switch is behind the thermostat housing 

That's what Air206 said in his post too.

So what you should do is, look for the green wires, those go to the dash light 

Not to be picky Wink but with Kens steps it is not mentioned that the engine must be running when the wires are removed. 
Big smile
Ask me how I know!

Totally agree - I find most of my engine warning light troubles go away when the engine is off!  Big smile   Steve




-------------
https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206
http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot
78 SkiTiq


Posted By: MrMcD
Date Posted: August-15-2023 at 2:21pm
When I bought my 1995 GT40 after it had been mostly parked for 19 years it popped the Red flashing light and the engine went into limp mode.  Seemed like a big repair coming, I thought I had a major issue.  This forum got me up and running right away.   Replaced both sensors, Oil and Coolant at that time.  No issue since in 9 years.  I also did the thermostat while in there.

-------------


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-16-2023 at 5:11am
Lots of great info here… couple of questions on “the job.” I appreciate the pictures!

1) do you have to disconnect the battery?

2) what is best method for removing the sensor?

3) should I spray some penetrating oil and let it sit before trying to remove?

Hopefully my parts come by the weekend! Thank you!

-------------
Otto


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-16-2023 at 7:01am
Originally posted by Otto Throttle Otto Throttle wrote:

Lots of great info here… couple of questions on “the job.” I appreciate the pictures!

1) do you have to disconnect the battery?  

2) what is best method for removing the sensor?

3) should I spray some penetrating oil and let it sit before trying to remove?

Hopefully my parts come by the weekend! Thank you!

There's no need to disconnect the battery

Quit calling it a sensor,  Wink   It's an on-off switch 

For hi temperature it closes at about 200 to 210 degrees and opens when temperature drops to 190 to 200 or so and for oil pressure it closes when pressure drops about 5 psi and opens when pressure gets to 7 or so.

They're normally open when the engine is running and either one closing completes the circuit for the check engine light to come on.

You can spray some oil if you want but shouldn't really have to. You can use an open end wrench or the box end of the wrench or if you have some deep sockets they'll work good too. No special tools needed.


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-16-2023 at 8:54pm
Air206…. What did you search for in YouTube to find videos on the switch replacement?

Thanks!!!!

-------------
Otto


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-18-2023 at 7:52am
Umm..........i think you can handle this without a video Otto Wink




Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-19-2023 at 5:25pm
Yup…. You’re probably right!   In the “Ol” days I would just go for it and it would work out fine… I miss those days… I am always worried there is some “trick” to doing something… some hack code or secret I don’t know!

Anyhow Nautique parts wants pictures of the parts to make sure they fit



-------------
Otto


Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: August-19-2023 at 5:47pm
Originally posted by Otto Throttle Otto Throttle wrote:

  Anyhow Nautique parts wants pictures of the parts to make sure they fit


http://https://nautiqueparts.com/oil-pressure-switch-r020015a-pcm-pro-tec-1989-1994-all-gt40s-and-gm-to-2006/" rel="nofollow - http://https://nautiqueparts.com/oil-pressure-switch-r020015a-pcm-pro-tec-1989-1994-all-gt40s-and-gm-to-2006/

For sure the oil switch above - I just replaced on 97 PCM carbed non-GT 351.  Have you figured out which switch is in error yet?

BTW - You use a wrench Wink.  I didn't want to say that above for fear of sounding like a jerk, but the oil pressure switch area is very tight to wrench, that's why I took off, cleaned and replaced the gauge sender and the T-fitting.  I made it all a little easier and got it all done at once. You can do it, if I can...


-------------
https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206
http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot
78 SkiTiq


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-19-2023 at 9:21pm
For the temperature switch, you have to know which hole it goes in Otto.

If it's in the hole by #5 cylinder (green arrow) it has 3/8 NPT threads and takes part number R020014

If it's in the hole by #1 cylinder right behind the thermostat housing (tan arrow) it has 1/2 inch NPT threads and takes part number R020014A

https://ibb.co/HXr409Q" rel="nofollow">
Switch in one hole, sending unit in the other

And like Air206 said the oil switch is R020015A. It's the only one they sell these days, no other choice.

I think the rest is up to you and Nautiqueparts Wink




Posted By: 1980SN2001
Date Posted: August-20-2023 at 9:40am
Is that some kind of caulking on the terminals for the temperature and oil pressure switch? Is this a common practice in the marine environment?

*EDIT* I just read this: "PS....you don't need the globs of RTV or whatever it is on those connections either" so that answers that question. Smile

Do these switches kill the engine or just light up a warning/red light? 

I have a 1980 and am interested in installing a temp/oil pressure warning light for those who might be driving my boat on the rare occasion that I get to ski/board behind it lol. 


-------------
1980 SN Project


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-20-2023 at 2:01pm
Hey I have two sensors/switches on the manifold… can I not post pictures from my apple phone????

-------------
Otto


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-20-2023 at 2:58pm
Originally posted by Otto Throttle Otto Throttle wrote:

Hey I have two sensors/switches on the manifold… can I not post pictures from my apple phone????

You're catching on here Otto, that's been mentioned more than once in this thread.Wink

One is the sending unit for your temperature gauge

The other is the switch for the dash light.

Now go back and read about the colors of the wires attached to each of those.

The sending unit which has nothing to do with your problem will have a Tan wire

The switch will have a different color wire. That's the one you care about

Most anybody can post pictures these days even from a phone if they follow the directions below Steps 1-9 and watch the Youtube video in the link.

Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Originally posted by Mpost Mpost wrote:

Originally posted by 75 Tique 75 Tique wrote:

Per Ken's request/suggestion, and per Ken's efforts in finding a relatively easy way to post photos, here is a step by step process.

1.  Have photos you want to post in your phone gallery or on your computer.
2.  Open website imgbb.com
(no need to sign in, sign up, or register unless you want to)
3. click or tap on "select images to upload"
4. Go to your gallery or computer and select photo(s)
(Leave autodelete option on "dont delete")
5. click or tap "Upload"
6.  In the "Embed codes" box, scroll to and select  "BBCode full linked"
7. in the box at the bottom of the page where the photo URL shows up,  tap or click "copy"
8. Open your CCF reply and tap and paste or click and paste.
9. Voila, its there. (Note: it wont show up until you view preview or post it)

I suppose 8 steps sounds like a lot, but its mostly quick easy point and clicks (or taps)  Goes quickly and easily.  Give it a try.


Added this here so it is sticky or pinned Smile

And added this link to the You Tube video that Larry made so there are written instructions and a video showing how to do it.

https://youtu.be/0UYbzewyjXw" rel="nofollow - https://youtu.be/0UYbzewyjXw

Written and video instructions all in one spot Wink

Good idea Marty

 


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-20-2023 at 3:42pm
Originally posted by 1980SN2001 1980SN2001 wrote:


Do these switches kill the engine or just light up a warning/red light? 

I have a 1980 and am interested in installing a temp/oil pressure warning light for those who might be driving my boat on the rare occasion that I get to ski/board behind it lol. 

On a gt40 they turn on the dash light and at the same time, tell the computer to put the engine in SLOW mode often called limp mode, but they don't kill the engine.

On the carbureted engines with the same switches, they'll turn on the dash light and nothing else. Then you look at your temperature gauge/oil pressure gauge to see if you have normal readings with a switch malfunction or an actual problem.

For your 1980, with a little wire and a couple of switches, a tee for the oil switch, a light and some connectors and a horn if you were so inclined, you could make your own setup for a whole lot less than the cost of the PCM labeled switches at Nautiqueparts. Wink



Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-20-2023 at 8:05pm
Alright the slow guy figured it out!   Here are pictures I took today....I am a preventative guy so would it be best just to replace them all?
LOOKS like a quick job...I have had many of those...experienced comments?

Also one last diagnostic to narrow down what switch...the light doesn't light up until the engine is warm than comes on intermittently at an idle, then on.  As soon as I get above an idle it goes out...Amateur guess says oil pressure because water temp would increase at higher rpms????

So the green wires go to the Engine Light, and the other two are different colors because they go to different destinations...AKA different gages!  Ok....baby steps!  You ar very good with the colored arrows corresponding to the wire color!   I am NOT worthy...but I am THANKFUL!



-------------
Otto


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-20-2023 at 9:49pm
Otto......you're on a roll here Wink

It looks like #1 has a tan wire so it's the temperature sending unit and #5 has a green wire so it's the high temperature switch.

It sounds like the oil switch would pretty definitely be the problem based on your description.

The oil switch is part # R020015A like mentioned earlier.

The temperature switch is part # R020014............there's no A on the end. The one with the A on the end would be for the gt40 switch location which is different than your location.

I'd pull the wire from the oil switch, tape the end so it can't ground itself on the block and take the boat for a ride  Your light won't come on when you turn the key to the Run position and it shouldn't come on at any time if the oil switch is the issue. If it does come on during the drive, that would point to the temperature switch.

Then you can decide whether you want to replace both switches or just the bad one.

I wouldn't mess with either sender if you have good, normal oil pressure and temperature readings on your gauges.

PS.........if you hit the space bar between pictures, they won't all run together Wink


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-20-2023 at 10:01pm
Love this place….. really do!!!!!! I will try that… have friends coming this weekend just wanted to avoid looking bad!!!!!

Source for water pump impeller? I’m stocking up on spark plugs and oil filters for my wife’s jet ski, and I mine as well get an impeller! One can’t have too many projects!!! Lol

Thx!

-------------
Otto


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-21-2023 at 7:29am
Since you're getting the switch(s) from Nautiqueparts, why not just tack on a Sherwood 9959K impeller kit to your order.

And don't forget to use the not too well publicized PND discount code for a 10% discount on the order Wink



Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-23-2023 at 9:02am
Thank you, Keno! Is there a reference somewhere on the forums for the wiring diagram for my boat? I would like to print it out if there is and put it in my maintenance binder. Yes you heard correct a maintenance binder. I run all my stuff just like an airplane. I log all the maintenance hours parts and costs. The person that buys the boat after me Either be very impressed, or wonder how in the world it could be so much documentation for a boat!

-------------
Otto


Posted By: 1980SN2001
Date Posted: August-23-2023 at 11:14am
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Originally posted by 1980SN2001 1980SN2001 wrote:


Do these switches kill the engine or just light up a warning/red light? 

I have a 1980 and am interested in installing a temp/oil pressure warning light for those who might be driving my boat on the rare occasion that I get to ski/board behind it lol. 

On a gt40 they turn on the dash light and at the same time, tell the computer to put the engine in SLOW mode often called limp mode, but they don't kill the engine.

On the carbureted engines with the same switches, they'll turn on the dash light and nothing else. Then you look at your temperature gauge/oil pressure gauge to see if you have normal readings with a switch malfunction or an actual problem.

For your 1980, with a little wire and a couple of switches, a tee for the oil switch, a light and some connectors and a horn if you were so inclined, you could make your own setup for a whole lot less than the cost of the PCM labeled switches at Nautiqueparts. Wink


Thanks for the info KENO!

I was on Nautique Parts website looking at the switches mentioned in this thread and I saw they sell a temp/oil pressure switch and buzzer kit for about the price of one of the other switches. I need to know the thread size on the temperature switch before I can order it but I'm thinking about going that way along with an alarm indicator light they sell. They also sell the oil pressure tee fitting, so conveniant! Any reason I shouldn't get the alarm kit and just stick with the parts you listed instead?

Kit SKU# 6257 https://nautiqueparts.com/alarm-buzer-low-oil-overheat-system/


-------------
1980 SN Project


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-23-2023 at 12:05pm
In the picture below you'll have to figure out where your temperature sender is and use the other hole that would have a pipe plug in it.

Your 80 probably has the sender in the hole with the Tan arrow, so you'll want a 3/8 NPT alarm switch to fit in the other hole with the Green arrow.

The kit should work, you'll have to verify with Nautiqueparts the size of the temperature switch threads in the kit.

You can also find the same kit from Sierra, SeaStar Solutions, Recmar and others  for various different and of course lower prices 

Here's an example in the link  Wink and the T is easy to find also

http://marinepartssource.com/audible-warning-system-mp41400" rel="nofollow - link

And a link to the T, you can find them locally too at an auto parts store, hardware store

http://www.amazon.com/s?k=Legines+Brass+Street+Tee+1%2F8+NPT+Female+x+1%2F8+NPT+Male+x+1%2F8+NPT+Female+Pipe+Fitting%2C+Barstock+Male+Run+Tee%2C+Oil+Pressure+T+Fitting+Splitter+%28Pack+of+2%29&ref=nav_bb_sb" rel="nofollow - link




Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: August-23-2023 at 12:28pm
Originally posted by Otto Throttle Otto Throttle wrote:

Thank you, Keno! Is there a reference somewhere on the forums for the wiring diagram for my boat? 

This version of the TRB diagram is probably the closest you'll get for the engine wiring with your PMGR starter.

The wiring for the Red check engine light isn't shown, since it wasn't on his boat probably Wink
 
https://ibb.co/wdhf1bn" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-29-2023 at 11:04pm
I’m finally going to the lake this weekend… I’m going to disconnect the leed to see if the light stays off? If it does I will change out the switch. Is the switch higher than any oil in the block, or can I expect oil to leak out of the block when the switch is out?

Happy Labor Day Everyone!

-------------
Otto


Posted By: 2001SAN
Date Posted: August-30-2023 at 2:00am
No oil leak when I changed mine.

D

-------------
A little knowledge is a dangerous thing...

2001 Super Air Nautique
1989 Fairline Corniche 31

www.bannrivercruises.co.uk


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: August-30-2023 at 9:28am
Thank you!!!!

-------------
Otto


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: September-05-2023 at 1:09pm
Took Lead off....no light!   Original switch has a bolt to hold the lead on...new one has a screw...Has anyone ever cleaned the switch?  I haven't taken it out yet, but was curious how it works and if it can be cleaned up?

-------------
Otto


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: September-05-2023 at 4:06pm
Here's a link to a YouTube video complete with a cutaway of an oil switch.

The title says "Oil sending units explained, but he's really explaining an oil pressure switch Wink

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZGg4x5VmkA" rel="nofollow - link

Be nice to your boat, just replace the switch


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: September-08-2023 at 1:18pm
awesomeCool

-------------
Otto


Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: September-21-2023 at 6:45pm
After all that - Is it fixed? Wink

-------------
https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206
http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot
78 SkiTiq


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: September-22-2023 at 5:26am
I think he's getting ready to start thinking about getting ready to maybe attack this switch change  Wink


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: September-24-2023 at 10:35am
I am flying  lot!   I just put the Lyman to bed...the Nautique will be 2 weeks out.  I am going to take it off and clean it to see if I can keep it all original!   

I will let you know...I will try to clean and reinstall the switch prior to pickling for the winter!


-------------
Otto


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: September-24-2023 at 2:42pm
The saga continues Wink

You already have the new switch, just put it in.

That poor old "original" switch cycled itself every time you turn the engine on and off.

if your oil is cruddy enough to plug the old switch, you probably have other things to worry about


Posted By: Otto Throttle
Date Posted: September-24-2023 at 3:54pm
you funny!  my oil is great.  I put less than 20 hours on it every year...this year 6 and she will still get the Rotella/Mobile one treatment!

I'm trying to make this like 



Joe Dirt or Who shot
JR!!!!!


-------------
Otto


Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: September-24-2023 at 5:55pm
Otto!  How unsatisfying!  Going to clean the old switch... then putting the boat away?  sigh.....

Ok - So I'll give you an update on my fix:  Ski 176 drives great and Red Light off after the oil switch replaced; ready for another 25 years and hundreds of hours!  Wink Woot!


-------------
https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206
http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot
78 SkiTiq


Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: October-11-2023 at 7:04am
Originally posted by Otto Throttle Otto Throttle wrote:

I am flying  lot!   I just put the Lyman to bed...the Nautique will be 2 weeks out.  I am going to take it off and clean it to see if I can keep it all original!   

I will let you know...I will try to clean and reinstall the switch prior to pickling for the winter!

Here we are 2 plus weeks out Otto............so how'd the "cleaning" job go? 



Print Page | Close Window